shai Posted September 14, 2011 Share Posted September 14, 2011 out of all of the 12 steps, the thing that has helped me the most without a doubt is the 4th step: "Made a searching and fearless moral inventory of ourselves." This helped me to get rid of a bunch of guilt/"im a piece of shit" type attitudes that I had been plagued by. Also I had hella resentments that I worked out... Secondly, the 9th step: "Made direct amends to such people wherever possible, except when to do so would injure them or others." Making up for the damage I have done to people has helped me so much, I actually don't feel like a low life anymore. Okay, I'm not going to make myself out to be the exception to the rule, but... I have a pretty good idea of who I am and have for some time- 99.9% of what I do when I drink would be what I would do sober. Therefore I don't get caught up in the "Oh shit, I fucked up" remorse trap beyond maybe apologizing for being annoying directly to close friends, but that's part of drinking and everyone knows it. I don't feel bad about talking loud and catching tags in stupid places, I was having a good time and not making a secret of it. Paradoxically, something I've had a serious problem with is other people's accountability....they just write off their shitty behavior to drinking and don't bother examining what might actually be causing it. This might sound contradictory but we've never drank together...I'm a pretty happy drunk. High-spirited at times, but never a complete train wreck/social liability. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ugene Posted September 14, 2011 Share Posted September 14, 2011 alcohol and drugs affect everybody differently. see when i would take like 14 mg of xanax i am deffinatley not going to act like myself, nor am i going to act like myself after 10 beers. it just doesnt work that way for me. i may have read your statement incorrectly so you can always call me out if you feel so. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlwaysOverDoinn Posted September 14, 2011 Share Posted September 14, 2011 DamN brah idk how you could act like anything other then a zombie/retard on 7 xanax. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlwaysOverDoinn Posted September 14, 2011 Share Posted September 14, 2011 ...I'm a pretty happy drunk. High-spirited at times, but never a complete train wreck/social liability. Same here...i hate when others im with become a social liability (props for that term) and make a good night potentially unpleasant. I hate having to tell a chick i meet like "yeah thats my boy, sorry" Drinking to have fun > drinking to become an embarassing slob . Everytime Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shai Posted September 14, 2011 Share Posted September 14, 2011 It's more about blaming bad behavior on drinking and not recognizing your limits. Some people totally fail at that and don't understand why I avoid them like the plague. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NaloksONE Posted September 14, 2011 Share Posted September 14, 2011 whats you guys's opinion about writing in relation to the 8th and 9th step? like, how would you go about making your amends to people's shit you wrote on, when you know you're just gonna have to make more Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yomommasaho Posted September 14, 2011 Share Posted September 14, 2011 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shai Posted September 14, 2011 Share Posted September 14, 2011 whats you guys's opinion about writing in relation to the 8th and 9th step? like, how would you go about making your amends to people's shit you wrote on, when you know you're just gonna have to make more Good question...I do that a lot less than I used to and I don't do it like I used to but maybe I could chalk it up to "special cases" or something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fat ralphy Posted September 14, 2011 Share Posted September 14, 2011 yeah as far as the graf thing goes, when you are active you are active, there is no way you can try and moralize it. i really think the most quality in amends comes from making shit up to family, girlfriends, friends etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shai Posted September 14, 2011 Share Posted September 14, 2011 True...straighten things out where it counts. Graffiti should remain anonymous. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NaloksONE Posted September 14, 2011 Share Posted September 14, 2011 alright, thanks. i know i shouldnt be worrying about that step yet ((i'm on my 5th), but i've just been trippin about that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fat ralphy Posted September 15, 2011 Share Posted September 15, 2011 lets try an avoid the graffiti is an addiction discussion, at least for me it is Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sleazeside Heights Posted September 15, 2011 Share Posted September 15, 2011 Ugene, Swif, Ralphy. Thanks for the support guys. I have been to a few meetings, have found some things helpful, but overall did not motivate to want to stop. Went to younger meetings, but it wasn't really like a forum where people could share, you just listen to speakers. Plus I got distracted by the girls there. I found the support of friends and some other things much more helpful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yonis Posted September 15, 2011 Share Posted September 15, 2011 isnt aa anonymous? isn't the fact that when your in active addiction it's 'not you, it's the drugs.' so if your going to use that arguement, why shuold i make amends to people when it wasn't 'really me,' as i found they love to preach in the rooms... when i was in a 1/2 way house after rehab, we went to these meetings in suburban philly. me being a little white kid from teh nyc suburbs, i felt like i was surrounded by a bunch of hicks. then they were saying that we all have an addiction problem! in my head all i could think is that, no not really, not everyone here is addicted to drugs or alcohol. not everyone needs a support group, not everyone can never drink or smoke a joint again. then they'd all go out and smoke their cigarettes. one time i bruoght up that, and someone answered me saying "well, no one has ever had to kill or rob anyone for cigarettes!" you never know though.. and addiction is addiction right? i guess i'm too young to understand! but it has affected me to the point where i packed up and bounced to another country, otherwise i don't think i would've been able to stop as long i was in nyc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fat ralphy Posted September 15, 2011 Share Posted September 15, 2011 the anonymous thing pertains to folks being put out on front street about being in the program, like if you saw your boss there you would respect his anonymity and not pull his card at work. even shit we do during our drinking/using we are accountable for. Sleaze....i too get distracted by birds at meetings, they also tend to say some dumb shit too...my sponsor reccommended i go to mostly mens meetings. NH. For all you folks just scratching the surface of AA, if you hear someone speak that you have similarities with....or you hear someone who has a way with words and some time, talk to them, see if they will sponsor you. I know its awkward at first but AA is one of the more welcoming communities I have found. You may find a millionaire chopping it up with a guy who used to be homeless, more often then not folks in AA arent gonna judge cuz we all been in the same places. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ugene Posted September 15, 2011 Share Posted September 15, 2011 isnt aa anonymous? isn't the fact that when your in active addiction it's 'not you, it's the drugs.' so if your going to use that arguement, why shuold i make amends to people when it wasn't 'really me,' as i found they love to preach in the rooms... when i was in a 1/2 way house after rehab, we went to these meetings in suburban philly. me being a little white kid from teh nyc suburbs, i felt like i was surrounded by a bunch of hicks. then they were saying that we all have an addiction problem! in my head all i could think is that, no not really, not everyone here is addicted to drugs or alcohol. not everyone needs a support group, not everyone can never drink or smoke a joint again. then they'd all go out and smoke their cigarettes. one time i bruoght up that, and someone answered me saying "well, no one has ever had to kill or rob anyone for cigarettes!" you never know though.. and addiction is addiction right? i guess i'm too young to understand! but it has affected me to the point where i packed up and bounced to another country, otherwise i don't think i would've been able to stop as long i was in nyc im not sure if you are necessarily saying you arent an addict, but if you did enough drugs to go to rehab and live in a sober house, im sure your "addiction" is much worse than somebody elses Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shai Posted September 15, 2011 Share Posted September 15, 2011 isnt aa anonymous? isn't the fact that when your in active addiction it's 'not you, it's the drugs.' so if your going to use that arguement, why shuold i make amends to people when it wasn't 'really me,' as i found they love to preach in the rooms... when i was in a 1/2 way house after rehab, we went to these meetings in suburban philly. me being a little white kid from teh nyc suburbs, i felt like i was surrounded by a bunch of hicks. then they were saying that we all have an addiction problem! in my head all i could think is that, no not really, not everyone here is addicted to drugs or alcohol. not everyone needs a support group, not everyone can never drink or smoke a joint again. then they'd all go out and smoke their cigarettes. one time i bruoght up that, and someone answered me saying "well, no one has ever had to kill or rob anyone for cigarettes!" you never know though.. and addiction is addiction right? i guess i'm too young to understand! but it has affected me to the point where i packed up and bounced to another country, otherwise i don't think i would've been able to stop as long i was in nyc I think you're on the right track but that's strictly my opinion based on how I feel. I definitely think some people shouldn't drink or do drugs because it just doesn't work out for them, but it's on them to come to that conclusion...recently I was telling a friend who has some pretty serious substance abuse issues that help is out there and I'd support them if they took that route but that they were going to have to come around to where they decided that was the solution. There's that one episode of the Simpsons where Barney quits drinking and at the end he's pounding extra-large mochas from Starbucks. I laughed at that because it was totally spot on. I moved to get away from heroin one time. It worked...sort of. I went where I thought it wasn't readily available, and it's not, but eventually it found me and I dabbled till I realized it wasn't going to turn out any different than any other time I got caught up in that mess. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fat ralphy Posted September 15, 2011 Share Posted September 15, 2011 ^^^^cosign folks arent going to get sober unless they want to....they need to come to the conclusion its hard pill to swallow because I have an alcoholic brother and tons of addict friends Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yonis Posted September 15, 2011 Share Posted September 15, 2011 and when they do finally quit their doc, they just pick up something else. fuck when i was in the halfway house i wouldn't stop watching dragonball z allllllllllllllll day Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sleazeside Heights Posted September 15, 2011 Share Posted September 15, 2011 Cigarettes and Caffeine are drugs too. they told you nobody steals for cigarettes? look at this guy: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yonis Posted September 15, 2011 Share Posted September 15, 2011 that's the point i was making! all they do is switch one addiction for another, be it meetings, food, nicotine (ah, smoking) or coffee. it's all the same shit. there was only two kids that made it to a year from the 20 or so i was in rehab with exactly a year ago. one was in sober living for this whole time (which to me makes it bullshit) and the other did it on his own for the majority of the past year (whether he admits to him doing it alone is up to him, i say he did). kid in sober living never got arrested, was in college, and more than likely just liked to fuck around. other kid had his college degree, and drank all the time, got into accidents, duis, his dad died while he just started his recovery out of rehab. do you see where i'm going with this? i feel like it's just another scare tactic. did that make any sense? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newer Bigger Better Posted September 15, 2011 Share Posted September 15, 2011 percentage of people who actually quit using AA: 10% percentage of people who actually quit by themselves: 10% Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yonis Posted September 15, 2011 Share Posted September 15, 2011 i'm willing to bet that it's actually true Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newer Bigger Better Posted September 15, 2011 Share Posted September 15, 2011 It is. It was in AAs actual government stats. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fat ralphy Posted September 15, 2011 Share Posted September 15, 2011 link?^^ nothing surprises me, i know guys who had 30 years go back out Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newer Bigger Better Posted September 15, 2011 Share Posted September 15, 2011 I found and posted it before. On this site. I really don't feel like digging for it right now. but i will later. You actually think it's higher or what? Next time you go to class look around and honestly judge which ones will be relapsing. EDIT: I know that on that Penn and Teller show Bullshit, they actually quote that stat too. Im sure you can find the episode online and it'll say where it's at. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fat ralphy Posted September 15, 2011 Share Posted September 15, 2011 i mean what is the basis....if it is that the person quits once and never again has a drink then i would not be surprised at a 10% success rate. there are tons of heads who use AA as a crutch and get like 2 or 3 months then drink or get a year and then drink and then come back etc etc. EDIT: I just googled "percentage of people who stay sober using AA" and there are so many conflicting sources that come up it is ridiculous. One site actually claimed .01 percent..... I would like to see a reputable study though, it is an interesting question. Also are these people who just went to a couple meetings or people who dove into the program full bore as advised....sponsor, steps etc. Not looking for an answer, just things to consider. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newer Bigger Better Posted September 15, 2011 Share Posted September 15, 2011 I believe that would mean that they are NOT successful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fat ralphy Posted September 15, 2011 Share Posted September 15, 2011 hahaha no shit, but I am saying is that a dude who went into one meeting, didnt like it and went back to drinking. or is that someone that completed the 12 steps and then went back to drinking. There are varying degrees of peoples activity in AA, but there is only one suggested method that is "backed" by AA, to get a sponsor and work the 12 steps.....if that is not what is being done in anyones program then they are not truly practicing in AA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yonis Posted September 15, 2011 Share Posted September 15, 2011 right foot forward, step to recovery, left foot back for all the shit we're going to leave on this fucking mountain! g-d, grant me the serenity to accept the things i cannot change, the courage to change the things i can, and the wisdom to know the difference. it works if you work it, so work it your worth it your so fucking worth it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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