Guest Posted November 25, 2004 Share Posted November 25, 2004 ^ well played highlander maybe one day the 12oz masses will be in awe of me too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fatalist Posted November 30, 2004 Share Posted November 30, 2004 Originally posted by Cracked Ass@Nov 23 2004, 12:18 AM I'll say fuck religion. Those two words aren't nearly enough though, Key is right about that. I don't think I have enough time today but I'll see what I can do. Dig up a thread called 'Here Is a Woman I Admire' from here or Channel Zero; Ann Druyan basically says most of what needs to be said, and it's as if she read my mind. She also doesn't use the phrase "fuck religion". As I see it, religion is the antithesis of science, based on religion's concept of faith. Faith, simply put, is a determination to believe in things that are not observable. Rational beings do not need faith whatsoever. We are capable of observing the world, studying it through science, and trying to find out the answers to those big questions by hand, the long way. Rational beings do not need to know all of those answers right now, today. We are comfortable with immense uncertainty, in part because science has reliably explained a lot of the small stuff, stuff that is on a humanocentric scale: the behavior of water, lightning, mitochondria, carrots, geology. I can look up at the stars and wonder where they came from, and go home and sleep well at night, not knowing. Someday humans might know. Religious people are not rational beings. They insist on knowing the answers to the big questions right now, today. So they make them up. A couple of charismatic prophets throughout history, who made up the best stories, are still believed in today, their bullshit dogmas lapped up by the insecure faithful. Hell, even Jim Jones and David Koresh got a couple of hundred morons apiece to follow their bizarre leads. Some Christians, Muslims, etc. are that stupid, some are not. I get a kick out of Christians who dismiss Koresh as a "cult leader" while listening to the latest crap from their Pope, that dinosaur in a dunce cap. All religions I'm familiar with suffer those same failings, which can be traced back to believing what's in a thousand-year-old book instead of what's right in front of your eyes. The only exception I have seen to the rule of deliberate blindness in religion is the Dalai Lama, whose philosophy I am not familiar enough with to comment on, except that he acknowledges a big role for science in the pursuit of the answers to the big questions. I defined faith as a determination to believe in things that are not observable, and I meant the word DETERMINATION, in the sense of bullheaded stubbornness, a willful blindness to the facts about life, the universe, and human nature, all of which, if intelligently OBSERVED for long enough, yield the conclusion that gods are human inventions, not the other way around. Determination reflects desire, and that alone casts doubt on all the dogmas: religious people have a desired outcome in mind for answers to the big questions, and they reject or attack any science that comes to a different conclusion. Their minds are closed. Scientists don't have a preference, they just do the necessary work to discover the facts. (Yes, some scientists have fallen in love with their own theories, only to get embarassed later by more diligent, unbiased researchers.) Their minds, by and large, are open. They update their texts as new stuff is proven by the scientific method. Why are so many people religious? The biggest reason is fear. I'm unusual among humans in not fearing the unknown, and not needing the answers to those big questions. Most people, for whatever reason, are afraid, and the idea of a prefabricated system for going through life, and for answering all those questions, is very appealing. They don't have to think or be afraid anymore, just follow the rites and fight the heathen. And burn infidels at the stake, and outlaw abortion and homosexuality, and teach their kids to keep their minds closed, and go to war with heathen countries, and all of the other fucking bullshit that makes me want to say...fuck religion. I'll take rational science anyday. Quoted post the funny thing about atheism is it is indeed a faith, a faith in a lack of deity or deities, or any plan. A faith in randomness. This is why I remain flexible and adaptable, rather than commit permenantly to any one inner belief. Think of it as a mobie command post of reality rather than a fixed foundation that, no matter how strong, can always be overwhelmed by superior forces (of logic) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fatalist Posted November 30, 2004 Share Posted November 30, 2004 Originally posted by Cracked Ass@Nov 23 2004, 12:18 AM I'll say fuck religion. Those two words aren't nearly enough though, Key is right about that. I don't think I have enough time today but I'll see what I can do. Dig up a thread called 'Here Is a Woman I Admire' from here or Channel Zero; Ann Druyan basically says most of what needs to be said, and it's as if she read my mind. She also doesn't use the phrase "fuck religion". As I see it, religion is the antithesis of science, based on religion's concept of faith. Faith, simply put, is a determination to believe in things that are not observable. Rational beings do not need faith whatsoever. We are capable of observing the world, studying it through science, and trying to find out the answers to those big questions by hand, the long way. Rational beings do not need to know all of those answers right now, today. We are comfortable with immense uncertainty, in part because science has reliably explained a lot of the small stuff, stuff that is on a humanocentric scale: the behavior of water, lightning, mitochondria, carrots, geology. I can look up at the stars and wonder where they came from, and go home and sleep well at night, not knowing. Someday humans might know. Religious people are not rational beings. They insist on knowing the answers to the big questions right now, today. So they make them up. A couple of charismatic prophets throughout history, who made up the best stories, are still believed in today, their bullshit dogmas lapped up by the insecure faithful. Hell, even Jim Jones and David Koresh got a couple of hundred morons apiece to follow their bizarre leads. Some Christians, Muslims, etc. are that stupid, some are not. I get a kick out of Christians who dismiss Koresh as a "cult leader" while listening to the latest crap from their Pope, that dinosaur in a dunce cap. All religions I'm familiar with suffer those same failings, which can be traced back to believing what's in a thousand-year-old book instead of what's right in front of your eyes. The only exception I have seen to the rule of deliberate blindness in religion is the Dalai Lama, whose philosophy I am not familiar enough with to comment on, except that he acknowledges a big role for science in the pursuit of the answers to the big questions. I defined faith as a determination to believe in things that are not observable, and I meant the word DETERMINATION, in the sense of bullheaded stubbornness, a willful blindness to the facts about life, the universe, and human nature, all of which, if intelligently OBSERVED for long enough, yield the conclusion that gods are human inventions, not the other way around. Determination reflects desire, and that alone casts doubt on all the dogmas: religious people have a desired outcome in mind for answers to the big questions, and they reject or attack any science that comes to a different conclusion. Their minds are closed. Scientists don't have a preference, they just do the necessary work to discover the facts. (Yes, some scientists have fallen in love with their own theories, only to get embarassed later by more diligent, unbiased researchers.) Their minds, by and large, are open. They update their texts as new stuff is proven by the scientific method. Why are so many people religious? The biggest reason is fear. I'm unusual among humans in not fearing the unknown, and not needing the answers to those big questions. Most people, for whatever reason, are afraid, and the idea of a prefabricated system for going through life, and for answering all those questions, is very appealing. They don't have to think or be afraid anymore, just follow the rites and fight the heathen. And burn infidels at the stake, and outlaw abortion and homosexuality, and teach their kids to keep their minds closed, and go to war with heathen countries, and all of the other fucking bullshit that makes me want to say...fuck religion. I'll take rational science anyday. Quoted post I have much respect for your decision not to disregard other's decisions. I'm also sorry that the zealots have questioned your way of living and your beliefs. The only thing that I wish to tell you is that the Universe will support whatever you think and believe. If you so believe that there is no God, then that's how your life will play out for you. I happen to believe in God and that's how my life plays out for me. We all need to remember to respect each other's beliefs and opinions however bizzare or different they may be from ours. I thank you for doing your part. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cracked Ass Posted December 7, 2004 Share Posted December 7, 2004 Originally posted by Fugazi@Nov 25 2004, 04:04 PM "...religious people have a desired outcome in mind for answers to the big questions, and they reject or attack any science that comes to a different conclusion. Their minds are closed." Perhaps an appropriate statement; but aren't you doing the same thing? Your own mind is closed to the idea of religion, it's apparent in your generalizations. Don't you find it interesting that you comment that "they reject or attack any science that comes to a different conclusion.", which is exactly what you just did, except in the context of attacking religion in the defense of science? Quoted post I am not doing the same thing. I have no evidence supporting the existence of things religious people believe in, therefore I withhold belief in those things. I'm open to looking at scientific evidence that these tales aren't fiction, but agnostics have been ready to listen for centuries and have never gotten anything concrete. And the things these people believe in are so hopelessly unprovable that I retain a serious doubt that they could possibly have any validity. I haven't closed the door on religion: it's just that when you've been living with pigs for thousands of years, and never has anyone seen a pig sprout wings and fly, you tend to discount the people who say they can fly. If I see a pig sprout wings and fly, I'll say "Damn, that was unexpected" and revise my database accordingly, but don't accuse me of being close-minded when I rate the likelihood of that happening as pretty slim. I stick to believing in what can be observed, proven, and duplicated. That rules out my believing in any religious tenets. There's no scientific evidence for any of them, not one piece of actual data. If actual data comes in, I'll take another look. If you can get me an interview with this God guy, I'm down to talk. Until then, he's as real as Santa Claus to me, and about as relevant. As Carl Sagan said, extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof. The claims made by religious people (the existence of a supreme being, of heaven and hell, of an afterlife, of judgements passed on humans by how they lived) are quite extraordinary, and still lack the most basic forms of evidence. The case that religions are all fiction is not fully proven, but the mountains of evidence give me confidence. Primitive humans, motivated by fear (and hope, as Mamerro pointed out), created answers to questions they could not properly answer for real. To the extent that this action provides comfort in uncertainty, to people who need that kind of thing, I guess you can believe in whatever you want, just keep that shit off my front porch, out of the laws of the land, out of my kid's head, out of my gay friends' faces. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cracked Ass Posted December 7, 2004 Share Posted December 7, 2004 Originally posted by fatalist@Nov 30 2004, 12:22 PM the funny thing about atheism is it is indeed a faith, a faith in a lack of deity or deities, or any plan. A faith in randomness. This is why I remain flexible and adaptable, rather than commit permenantly to any one inner belief. Think of it as a mobie command post of reality rather than a fixed foundation that, no matter how strong, can always be overwhelmed by superior forces (of logic) Quoted post I don't know why you quoted me before saying this, I agree all the way. I am not an atheist. An atheist DENIES the existence of a supreme being, e.g. has faith that there is NO such thing. I can't prove that, so I don't make that claim. The evidence favors atheists with their claim, but it's not a done deal. I also remain flexible and adaptable, susceptible to logic. I just find most religions so hokey that I would scream with laughter and amazement if one of them turned out to be the "right" way. I can see myself being brought before the Catholic God on his throne for judgement and saying "Are you fucking kidding me, you big bully?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casekonly Posted December 7, 2004 Share Posted December 7, 2004 The TriPrimality: "Bob" is. "Bob" becomes. "Bob" is not. Nothing is; Nothing becomes; Nothing is not. Thus: Nothing Is Everything. Therefore: Everything is "Bob." Abracadabra. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vare_one Posted December 11, 2004 Share Posted December 11, 2004 i think personally that religion causes most of the conflicts n fighting in the world today who agrees? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Hipster Posted December 11, 2004 Share Posted December 11, 2004 more people have died int he name of religion than any thing ells. personlly i feel it is for weak minded people but what do i know? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 13, 2004 Share Posted December 13, 2004 wrong. people die for money. Religion is an easy scapegoat for human greed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
!@#$% Posted December 13, 2004 Share Posted December 13, 2004 huh? the word "jihad" means "holy war" the spanish inquisition, the salem witch trials, sacrifice of virgins in mayan and incan ceremonies, this shit didn't have anything to do with money. in the modern world, maybe a lot of wars do have to do with money. but throughout history, people have been killed in the name of religion since the dawn of the concept. an op-ed in the washington times refers to the current war in iraq as religious, and based on the propoganda being perpetuated by both sides, i agree completely. " We are now mired in a religious war in Iraq, and elsewhere. Our enemies, as witnessed by their astonishing willingness to slaughter themselves, are not principally motivated by political or economic grievances. Anyone who imagines that terrestrial concerns account for terrorism by Muslims must explain why there are no Palestinian Christian suicide bombers." http://www.washingtontimes.com/op-ed/20041...90801-2582r.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 13, 2004 Share Posted December 13, 2004 I should elaborate. I personally believe that most human actions especially war and religion all come down to land ownership or 'turf'. The situation in Jerusalem is a classic turf war. Two groups claim that the 'turf' is sacred to their religion and should be exclusively for themsleves. The Catholic church has been taking pieces of land 'for God' for years all over the globe. Consecrated ground? How about the Vatican being one of the biggest land owners in history? So now here's the stretch that not everyone will agree with: Turf = money. In the old days, if you owned land you could grow food on that land and create a place to raise a family. Nobility was really just a bunch of landowners who built themselves into the power structure of the Church. Land creates money which creates power. Certainly religious differences can lead to war, but even the Crusades were about 'taking the holy land from the heathens'. The end of the ancient world came about because the Church was gobbing up land (read: a means to have money) and as far as Iraq..... there is certainly a religious split between 'us' and 'them' but it's really all about the land. Or should I say that black gold under the land. 2! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 13, 2004 Share Posted December 13, 2004 + and 'jihad' mean 'struggle'. some people say it applies only to religious struggle but the muslims I've talked with say that it's more about personal struggle to do the right thing. ++ maybe the people on the front lines are doing it for religion, but there's no way the masterminds behind the slaughter of the innocents are doing it for free. Certainly if they are doing it just to kill people with other views, then their own wiews are sad perversions of what they think their religion has commanded them to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
!@#$% Posted December 13, 2004 Share Posted December 13, 2004 i think it's all about ideology. bin laden wanted to spark a clash of civilizations, it worked. the "turf" has only become so important because of al the religious significance. no one thinks they are going to get rich by owning the dome of the rock. this is one of those things that i think people without serious devotion to religion fail to grasp. god and his teachings are actually more important than money [to fundamentalists]. we can agreee to disagree i suppose, i see where you're coming from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
!@#$% Posted December 13, 2004 Share Posted December 13, 2004 What is Jihad by Daniel Pipes New York Post December 31, 2002 What does the Arabic word "jihad" mean? One answer came last week, when Saddam Hussein had his Islamic leaders appeal to Muslims worldwide to join his jihad to defeat the "wicked Americans" should they attack Iraq; then he himself threatened the United States with jihad. As this suggests, jihad is "holy war." Or, more precisely: It means the legal, compulsory, communal effort to expand the territories ruled by Muslims at the expense of territories ruled by non-Muslims. The purpose of jihad, in other words, is not directly to spread the Islamic faith but to extend sovereign Muslim power (faith, of course, often follows the flag). Jihad is thus unabashedly offensive in nature, with the eventual goal of achieving Muslim dominion over the entire globe. Jihad did have two variant meanings through the centuries, one more radical, one less so. The first holds that Muslims who interpret their faith differently are infidels and therefore legitimate targets of jihad. (This is why Algerians, Egyptians and Afghans have found themselves, like Americans and Israelis, so often the victims of jihadist aggression.) The second meaning, associated with mystics, rejects the legal definition of jihad as armed conflict and tells Muslims to withdraw from the worldly concerns to achieve spiritual depth. Jihad in the sense of territorial expansion has always been a central aspect of Muslim life. That's how Muslims came to rule much of the Arabian Peninsula by the time of the Prophet Muhammad's death in 632. It's how, a century later, Muslims had conquered a region from Afghanistan to Spain. Subsequently, jihad spurred and justified Muslim conquests of such territories as India, Sudan, Anatolia, and the Balkans. http://www.danielpipes.org/article/990 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 13, 2004 Share Posted December 13, 2004 ^ not entirely true. There are many definitions for jihad and it is very clear what definition is being used based on the context applied to it. Jihad, routinely translated as holy war, often makes headlines. For example, Yasir Arafat’s May 1994 call in Johannesburg for a “jihad to liberate Jerusalem”[1] was a turning point in the peace process; Israelis heard him speak about using violence to gain political ends, and questioned his peaceable intentions. Both Arafat himself [2] and his aides[3] then clarified that he was speaking about a “peaceful jihad” for Jerusalem. This incident points to the problem with the word jihad: what exactly does it mean? Two examples from leading American Muslim organizations, both fundamentalist, show the extent of disagreement this issue inspires. The Council on American-Islamic Relations, a Washington-based group, flatly states that jihad “does not mean `holy war.’” Rather, it refers to “a central and broad Islamic concept that includes the struggle to improve the quality of life in society, struggle in the battlefield for self-defense . . . or fighting against tyranny or oppression.” CAIR even asserts that Islam knows no such concept as “holy war.”[4] In abrupt contrast, the Muslim Students Association recently distributed an item with a Kashmir dateline, “Diary of a Mujahid.” The editor of this document understands jihad very much to mean armed conflict: While we dream of jihad and some deny it, while others explain it away, and yet others frown on it to hide their own weakness and reluctance towards it, here is a snapshot from the diary of a mujahid who had fulfilled his dream to be on the battlefield.[5] Does jihad mean a form of moral self-improvement or war in accord with Islamic precepts? There is no simple answer to this question, for Muslims for at least a millennium have disagreed about the meaning of jihad. But there is an answer. A very large article on the term 'jihad'. but yeah... we'll have to disagree over this one. I'm a firm believer that 'money is the root of all evil' money being the possesion of wealth or the means to create wealth: turf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toeskum Posted December 17, 2004 Share Posted December 17, 2004 eh im religiose(catholic) but i aint hardcore .....i belive in god but i have doubts just like everyone else when you see shit going on in the world, state, city and your block friends dieing...crazy shit drugs eatin people ......(im talkin about drugs im such a hipicrit........... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MANOWAR Posted December 22, 2004 Share Posted December 22, 2004 "turf" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sect one Posted December 22, 2004 Share Posted December 22, 2004 some bitches argument about God :hatred: Feel more than welcome to comment...... :hatred: :hatred: :hatred: "I've always thought about this.... So many people believe and depend on God to help them when their down or are in need of help. I personally think that it is all just not real. I don't believe in God at all. I believe in evolution!! I don't think that "GOD" made the world in 7 days. It's bullshit!!! How could "GOD" know what a day was in the first place if God made the sun on the third day? So they say! ....I simply don't waste my time going to church or reading the bible....i have read it and it doesn't make sense........! Now a days we have such great writers that are so creative....they didn't only exist now....people way past our times had a very creative mind....! How do we all know that some guy didn't just get bored one day and started to write a story?? This could have been all made up from someone in the past and now that everyone has read it they are all fallin into a trap...as i call it. People depend too much on God to Heal their SINS!!! It's disgusting.....I got malestied when i was younger....by my uncle (thorough marriage)...never said nothing til i was about 15 years old...by then everyone barely beleved me...my own grand mother called my a liar to my face...no one believed me except for one of my aunts! She told me that one day my UNCLE (asshole) went to her house after a few weeks that i have told everyone and he walked through her door and said "God has forgiven me for my SIN!" What that fuck....so it's ok now...fuckin assholes man i'm tellin you...i don't want any sympathy i just want everyone to realize how blind people get becuase of this character GOD! Parents refuse their own flesh and blood because their kids turn out gay? That's bullshit....they call it the way of being.....???? And you know why??? Cause they read the bible and it says so.....so now everyone disown your kids and fuck it have more......but not too much...cause we have God's rule to follow. I think that most of the people that believe in god are all fuckin Hypocrits.....seriously....i used to go to a Christian Church...had the time of my life....just because i knew everyone....but i would see all these kids praying and ask God please to forgive them for there SINS.....these teenagers crying for what they have done....WHY? I didn't understand why would you sit their and pray and then walk right out into the world and SIN your way into the next week to do it all over again....cause it makes them feel better that's why....i rather learn from my mistakes than to sit here and lie to myself....God to me does not exist.....at all.....it's all bullshit and iono....i've gotten here by myself.....i will finish here by myself......and with the help of my trusty parents.....but iono if you agree or disagree just comment me.....sorry but it had to come out of me sooner or later!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villain Posted December 22, 2004 Share Posted December 22, 2004 Originally posted by sect one@Dec 22 2004, 05:36 AM some bitches argument about God :hatred: Feel more than welcome to comment...... :hatred: :hatred: :hatred: Hmmm....? What's so bad about that? If anything I would say she's on the right track. She's seen the hypocricy and inconsistency in institutionalized christianity and has rejected it. But has not found the true essence of god to replace it. She has fallen into an atheist trap. A similar thing happened following the Enlightenment, when religion was shown to be such a wash... everyone was pretty upset.... It bred alot of nihilists... I guess this is to blame for the early 20th centuries imperialism and nationalism.... Materialistic empiricism... the order of the day. I would say if anything, this girl needs guidance. She has made the right step by realizing the fallacies of organized religion.... she just cannot stay in this lost state. I would be nice to her if I were you. Besides... she was molested by her uncle for 15 years... be VERY nice to her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveAustin Posted December 22, 2004 Share Posted December 22, 2004 I think religion in a general sense is good for most people. It gives them hope and assurance. Granted man has bastardized most organized religions with political or other power based aspirations. Power corrupts...even the "holy"...and I hate it when they use it to control the people. I prefer spirituality sans affiliation to any organized religion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 22, 2004 Share Posted December 22, 2004 you know it austin.... like the great karate master Peter Urban said: Enlightenment is knowing that only you can save yourself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveAustin Posted December 22, 2004 Share Posted December 22, 2004 I always knew I was enlightened. :king: hell...not only enlightenment...life. no one is going to do it for you. rely on yourself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sect one Posted December 22, 2004 Share Posted December 22, 2004 Originally posted by villain+Dec 22 2004, 08:47 AM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (villain - Dec 22 2004, 08:47 AM)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--QuoteBegin-sect one@Dec 22 2004, 05:36 AM some bitches argument about God :hatred: Feel more than welcome to comment...... :hatred: :hatred: :hatred: Hmmm....? What's so bad about that? If anything I would say she's on the right track. She's seen the hypocricy and inconsistency in institutionalized christianity and has rejected it. But has not found the true essence of god to replace it. She has fallen into an atheist trap. A similar thing happened following the Enlightenment, when religion was shown to be such a wash... everyone was pretty upset.... It bred alot of nihilists... I guess this is to blame for the early 20th centuries imperialism and nationalism.... Materialistic empiricism... the order of the day. I would say if anything, this girl needs guidance. She has made the right step by realizing the fallacies of organized religion.... she just cannot stay in this lost state. I would be nice to her if I were you. Besides... she was molested by her uncle for 15 years... be VERY nice to her. Quoted post [/b] ummm I see your point and I know this girl personally ...but anyway...I'm sorry but I do not respect her argument ...I do see the hypocrisy of the church but she belives that there is no god yet she still blames the god that "does not exist" for her problems. Her argument about being molested blames God and just because her uncle sought forgivneess it somehow made god some kind of asshole. Why be nicer to her JUST because she was molested? but mehhhh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villain Posted December 22, 2004 Share Posted December 22, 2004 Originally posted by sect one@Dec 22 2004, 05:13 PM ummm I see your point and I know this girl personally ...but anyway...I'm sorry but I do not respect her argument ...I do see the hypocrisy of the church but she belives that there is no god yet she still blames the god that "does not exist" for her problems. Her argument about being molested blames God and just because her uncle sought forgivneess it somehow made god some kind of asshole. Well yes this is entirely understandable even though on the surface it would appear to make no sense. She has determined that a) god must not exist, or b) god is an evil asshole, because of her experience. This is her family that she grew up with. To her, these people represent god and religion because that is what she was taught. Then her family's denial of her and her uncles manipulation of religion conflicted with the idea of "god" and "religion" she was raised with. She is struggling to rectify her idea of a good and just god with her actual experience of these representatives of god. If this is all she knows then it can be seen how she would be led astray. We all come from our own backgrounds in our own little worlds, and unless someone opens our eyes to what we are missing we very well can stay trapped in this world of disillusionment, which I would say would be very, very bad for her. So altruistic, pure guidance is needed by her. It would be very good if you could point her in the right direction because she is in a very dark struggle. Why be nicer to her JUST because she was molested? but mehhhh Quoted post Becaaaauuuussee.... you see how my explaination of her behavior would stem from her being molested? This traumatic experience has colored her whole entire world in dark and gloomy hues. She cannot even imagine a God to save her... which is really sad because sometimes in our lives ALL we have is God. She, has nothing. Please, please, please be nice to her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveAustin Posted December 22, 2004 Share Posted December 22, 2004 yeah. be nice to her. no tolerance for child molestation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sect one Posted December 23, 2004 Share Posted December 23, 2004 She doesnt strut around talking about how she was molested I just saw it as an unfair outlet but many are turned off by the idea of God through such experiences so I see your point. I had a problem with her argument because it is poorly supported and she doesn't know a thing about evolution. It just seems more of an ignorant argument to get some attention because she does not show much intelligent suport. I don't have a problem with her not believing in God but she is quick to make up facts and bring up ignorant points to make her argument. I guess it's because I know her and as a person she pisses me off sometimes...that blog she wrote was more for attention than anything. I just saw her argument as weak as the "fuck religion" statement but you have shown me other points but still :hatred: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sect one Posted December 23, 2004 Share Posted December 23, 2004 I'll agree my statement about her being molested seemed cruel but that was not my intention I just didn't agree that it should be used as a crutch but it has a lot to do with her problem with god so I'll retract what I said... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robJ Posted December 23, 2004 Share Posted December 23, 2004 I declare a jihad on religion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villain Posted December 23, 2004 Share Posted December 23, 2004 Alright sect... I would still cut her some slack. Sure she may be putting together a weak argument.... but it is also one that is very personal and subjective so to her it is THE strongest argument. And besides that she sounds needy. She probably needs to be believed because her whole family denied her. That is a strong possibility. What I would suggest to you is for you to just be a friend to her instead of engaging in this intellectual debate. Make sure she knows that she does not need to prove anything to you because you believe her! I think that a friendship of trust and understanding would help her to grow beyond this need for attention and acceptance. Because that's what this really seems like to me.... Not a philosophical statement as she may be trying to hide it as but as you said, a cry for attention. She is needy. Be gentle with her. I think that fostering a trust, and sincerely hearing her out, instead of correcting her faults would be better for her at this point in her life. Not saying that you have to agree with what are possibly wrong arguments but hear her out and say that while you may not agree you respect her opinion and that it is relevant. Wow I feel like Dr. Phil today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ledzep Posted December 25, 2004 Share Posted December 25, 2004 Originally posted by robJ@Dec 22 2004, 11:17 PM I declare a jihad on religion Quoted post I declare a jihad ON YOUR FACE! not really i just felt like saying that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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