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min wage in CA to be raised to $10/hr

Discussion in 'News' started by BOATS N HOES, Sep 26, 2013.

  1. Decyferon

    Decyferon Moderator Crew

    Joined: Jan 12, 2008 Messages: 10,473 Likes Received: 602
    Minimum wage here is £6.31 but goes up to £6.50 next year that is the equivalent of $10.94 and to be honest with you that still isn't a livable wage.

    The swiss just voted down a minimum wage of $25 an hour.
     
  2. TheoHuxtable..

    TheoHuxtable.. 12oz Legend

    Joined: Nov 17, 2008 Messages: 17,651 Likes Received: 1,426
    I read about that vote in Switzerland. I think if you have the minimum wage too high it can hurt the economy as well -- more businesses would outsource their labor and/or it would drive the cost of goods and cost of living up. I think Australia currently has the highest minimum wage. Something like over $15 USD an hour.
     
    Decyferon likes this.
  3. Decyferon

    Decyferon Moderator Crew

    Joined: Jan 12, 2008 Messages: 10,473 Likes Received: 602
    The problem that the Swiss had is that the cost of living in the major cities is so high that you need a minimum wage of $25 an hour to make ends meet, but then in the countryside it would put too much of a strain on the economy for them to be able to afford it.

    It is a hard balance really, you need to have enough to live on but not have a detrimental affect on the smaller areas of the country. There is no way you could survive in my town or London if you were single and earning minimum wage, you couldn't even afford rental costs!
     
  4. TheoHuxtable..

    TheoHuxtable.. 12oz Legend

    Joined: Nov 17, 2008 Messages: 17,651 Likes Received: 1,426
    It's the same here. Anybody making minimum wage in my city ($8) will need roommates to share the rent.

    My state just approved a $10 minimum wage and it will go into effect by next year. I think over time it should be raised to around $12 an hour.
     
  5. Decyferon

    Decyferon Moderator Crew

    Joined: Jan 12, 2008 Messages: 10,473 Likes Received: 602
    they are trying to bring something in over here (well labour suggested they would do it if they got into power) which is to allow the minimum wage to raise slightly above the level of inflation to allow a decent minimum wage.

    It won't happen as I can't see them being voted in sadly.
     
  6. Mr. Incognito

    Mr. Incognito Senior Member

    Joined: Jan 20, 2008 Messages: 1,218 Likes Received: 75
    The idea that the increase of minimum wage having no affect on anything else other than establishing a more "livable wage" is funny.


    i was once told "some people are just comfortable making minimum wage" as in having no desire to better their employment. Are those the same people that want it raised, or the same people who hate working?
     
  7. Decyferon

    Decyferon Moderator Crew

    Joined: Jan 12, 2008 Messages: 10,473 Likes Received: 602
    What if you don't have the chance to better your employment? good jobs are not easy to find.

    A lot of people are stuck working minimum wage, to be fair most people working minimum wage jobs work a damn sight harder, a lot of them NEED 2 jobs just to make ends meet.

    There is too much wage inequality, these huge companies like McDonalds, WalMart etc can easily afford to pay much better wages without any impact on the consumer.

    http://moneymorning.com/2013/04/19/ceo-pay-now-7000-an-hour-350-times-the-average-workers/

    There is no reason for a CEO to earn so much more than the AVERAGE worker let alone compared to minimum wage workers. This lie that is perpetuated by businesses that the top managers earn all the money when the staff do all the work is bullshit. Staff deserve better wages.
     
  8. theprotester

    theprotester Moderator Crew

    Joined: Dec 8, 2006 Messages: 10,811 Likes Received: 822

    This is a reasonably accurate blanket statement that applies to Australia.

    When you factor in things like free healthcare etc. Starts to add up in the cost of living stakes. Nothing is free.
     
  9. sexcauldron

    sexcauldron Member

    Joined: Jul 14, 2011 Messages: 439 Likes Received: 34
    I agree in part. Personally, I feel that good jobs are easier to find than good people, look up the countless studies on the experience gap if you disagree. I'm not saying it isn't difficult to find a good job, but if you're an educated and skilled individual you should be able to earn above minimum wage, plain and simple. The problem is we aren't interested in educating the underprivileged masses in this country. Our education system breeds ditch diggers and there are only so many ditches to dig, especially when someone in another country will do it for half the cost.

    So that's how wages should be measured? How much the company can pay before it impacts the consumer? FYI: http://247wallst.com/retail/2013/12/05/can-walmart-and-mcdonalds-afford-a-15-minimum-wage/ "Here is some simple but not entirely accurate math about what each company would pay if its hourly minimum wage rose to $15. If 75% of the workers at both companies make $8 and the number rose to $15, Walmart’s expense increase would be $18 billion a year. McDonald’s would be $4.5 billion. In the case of McDonald’s, profits would be cut in half. Walmart’s profit would be cut by 80%." McDonalds employs approximately 300k and Walmart employs approximately 1.4 million people in the US.

    Imparting labels to people seems to be about 99% of your argumentative ability. Nothing I said should have given you the impression that I'm a libertarian unless you have a faulty understanding of that political philosophy; in fact, libertarians would take issue w/ my minimum wage philosophy. True libertarianism would argue for no minimum wage whatsoever, I stated that I felt the minimum wage requirements should be solely vested w/ the states w/o a federal binding. Go ahead and google libertarian minimum wage, it shouldn't be hard to find dozens of articles disagreeing w/ my position on this matter. Everything else I said is true and has nothing to do w/ any political philosophy.

    Your arguments can basically be summed up as such: apply label + attack what label represents to you + disregard actual post. Nothing I said was based on a libertarian economic theory.
     
  10. Decyferon

    Decyferon Moderator Crew

    Joined: Jan 12, 2008 Messages: 10,473 Likes Received: 602
    But if you consider a CEO earns about 7000 times more than the average worker (see the link I posted before) also take into account that all the higher level jobs in that company will be ridiculous salaries. You could always balance the books by making the wages fairer within the company, without adding anything drastic to the annual spend and the managers will still be paid their handsome salary, just not as much, there may be some increase in annual cost but nothing in comparison to what you said.
     
  11. CILONE/SK

    CILONE/SK 12oz Loyalist

    Joined: Jun 25, 2003 Messages: 10,263 Likes Received: 277
    Same old libertarian nonsense.

    Your only worth what your paid.

    Don't like your job, go get a new one.

    Paying people more will ruin the economy.

    Blah blah blah

    Go back to the Koch Brothers and Cato Institute.

    Bottom line, minimum wage has never been lower in decades.
    More and more people are working minimum wage jobs.
    Companies are getting over, by transferring all profits to the top.
    The whole free market system, does not work. Everything shows that. Greed is what corrupts it.

    You are a libertarian. You just have not said it. Even if you are not hardcore 100% up Ron Pauls nut sack! you still are pushing the ideal that we are living in a market based fair economy.

    If you were remotely correct, there would be no low wage employment problem. But of course your wrong. The top whatever percent of people take all the money, while the vast majority works like slaves and can't afford to live.

    Nothing you have said, proves that by keeping a low minimum wage, workers benefit.

    Everything you have said proves that companies are gouging everyone for profit.
     
  12. Fist 666

    Fist 666 Moderator Crew

    Joined: Jun 16, 2007 Messages: 14,095 Likes Received: 969
    If Corporation X becomes less profitable because they pay their employees closer to a living wage (instead of substandard wages) and the only way Corporation X is able to post profits is by maintaining low wages for its employees then it would seem fair to assume that a. fuck capitalism and b. fuck bitches.
     
  13. CILONE/SK

    CILONE/SK 12oz Loyalist

    Joined: Jun 25, 2003 Messages: 10,263 Likes Received: 277
  14. sexcauldron

    sexcauldron Member

    Joined: Jul 14, 2011 Messages: 439 Likes Received: 34
    Your understanding of economics & politics is about as developed as that of a 16 year old who ran away from home to join Occupy Wallstreet for the weekend.
    While the number is up from 10 years ago, the percentage of people working minimum wage jobs has actually been declining since 2010.
    This doesn't make any sense. The only contestable point I made was advocating for the states to manage minimum wage w/o the involvement of the federal government, i.e. no federal minimum. I like Washington's model which uses an algorithm based on cost of living to determine whether or not an increase is needed on a yearly basis. Guess what, there is no low wage employment problem in Washington, in fact they have the lowest percentage of people on minimum wage in the whole country. My original point was merely that the federal government shouldn't use Washington as an example for raising the federal minimum because doing so undermines the process and circumstances that have made Washington's system successful. Lastly, the "vast majority" can definitely afford to live, we're not talking about Ethiopia; in fact, the vast minority of the work force are paid minimum wage. It's no fun arguing w/ you, all you do is push a narrative.

    The link you posted actually posits that the average CEO earns about 350 times more than the average worker. No one needs to make $100million a year, but I don't want anyone saying someone can't make that much either. Legislating these kinds of things is a slippery slope regardless of one's personal opinions and I for one am not willing to open that door. I wonder how many of the firms used for that article even have minimum wage jobs though, I'd wager it's less than you think. The stat I posted was only accounting for a federal minimum wage increase, companies like Walmart could obviously make internal adjustments to keep afloat but my point was just to show how many people they employ and how financially significant a federal minimum increase of that size would be.

    As an aside, the article you posted should be taken w/ a grain of salt. Unfortunately the author does not cite where he comes up w/ the average worker's salary; in fact, in googling the amount it only comes up w/ his article and various other articles quoting or just directly copying his information. That's troublesome because "average worker" doesn't really mean anything. The stats from the Census Bureau leave a lot of room for interpretation, but if you look per state, per industry, per household, etc... the number the author chose is definitely on the lower end of the spectrum with the true average appearing to be closer to $50k. In case you're interested you can thumb through these tables: https://www.census.gov/compendia/statab/cats/labor_force_employment_earnings.html. Even if you use the average hourly amount the author mentions ($20), the full time yearly is closer to $40k. However, again the BLS, which for some reason he cites despite the fact that it doesn't support his number, puts the average hourly wage closer to $24 which would then raise the yearly closer to $50k. You can look at this table if you're interested: http://www.bls.gov/news.release/empsit.t19.htm. Moreover, crunching his numbers on the average CEO hourly rate, I come up with $5,913 per hour bringing his ratio from 350 all the way down to 246. These numbers are obviously not exact, but the author is clearly playing fast and loose w/ the stats for the purpose of getting his point across.
     
  15. CILONE/SK

    CILONE/SK 12oz Loyalist

    Joined: Jun 25, 2003 Messages: 10,263 Likes Received: 277
    Haha

    A libertarian that is not willing to say he is a libertarian.

    You say that I am pushing an agenda, but the fact is that you are.

    You imply there is not a problem with people getting paid minimum wage that never goes up.

    Millions of people would beg to differ with that.

    I never do understand how moronic people like you can think that it is fine to pay slave wages and think that is good for our country.

    Keep sucking CEO dicks and hoping their cum shots pan out to be money for you.

    A fact that none of you can ever get around is that the top one percent are making more money than ever before, and the rest of the people are getting a lower share of the record profits than ever.



    Explain that!

    I am sure that paying people less and less every year is good for the country. That was sarcasm, because you seem like a no experience college boy that has his parents paying for everything.

    I am just going to keep trolling you, because I do not think people with agendas like yours deserve to be taken seriously. No matter what happens to this country, people like you push it further along with your austerity nonsense that has been proven not to work.
     
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