ILOTSMYBRAIN Posted July 16, 2011 Share Posted July 16, 2011 http://www.12ozprophet.com/forum/showpost.php?p=8244561&postcount=55 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CILONE/SK Posted July 16, 2011 Share Posted July 16, 2011 How does that show I called Ron Paul a fascist? Do you have a learning disability? Even in the other thread you were wrong. I did not call RP a fascist, you obviously are having a hard time understanding what is written. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zig Posted July 16, 2011 Share Posted July 16, 2011 Why are you asking me for proof of something that you've already made your mind up on? No matter what I post here to show you why he isn't a fringe candidate in 2012 isn't going to change your mind about him. Why are you trying to waste my time? The reason I have treated you and other RP disciples like that, is because they consistently refuse to acknowledge anything factual. If you are them want to come at me with something factual that is based in reality, please do and we can discuss, but until then, I will assume you are a RP cult knob slobber. I'm not part of any RP cult. I don't worship him, I don't think he is the god of politicians, and I don't refuse to acknowledge facts. I've already admitted that RP has an enormous struggle to deal with in order to win the nomination. In fact, I was very doubtful about RP's 2012 campaign when I first heard him announce his candidacy for president and am actually very surprised how well his campaign is doing compared to 2008. Stop acting like you know me so well, you don't know shit about me. Just because I support RP and I'm going to vote for him, doesn't mean I'm anything like anyone else that is also advocating on his behalf. You pre-judge people here on 12oz because they hold the same political beliefs as RP, you're condescending, rude, and arrogant, and you refuse to engage yourself in an actual debate demanding proof of something you've already made your mind up about. These are the fucking games played here on 12oz, and it's stupid. This isn't debating, it's a bunch of grown men acting like know-it-all assholes who have poor reading comprehension abilities and lack basic conversational skills. I can understand why casek got pissed off the other day and said he was done with this place. Most of these threads end up in shit storm arguements about absolutely nothing at all. But you know what, I'm happy there is another arrogant asshole like you around here now because tbh I was actually starting to get along with most of the people who post here on a regular basis and we were beginning to really have some interesting threads. I guess you're the new entertainment until you somehow come to your senses that you aren't smarter than anyone else on this forum, and you start at least attempting to respect people. I noticed plenty of other people I've disagreed with at least showing some form of respect for each other, and you're obviously new. I'm not asking you to fucking blow me kisses, but at least agree to disagree and stop coming off like everyone who holds a different point of view from yours is a cock sucking RP ass kissing libertarian retard. You sound like some little 12 year old idiot. It's like if I say... The World Trade Center fell due to explosives. Some idiot comes on here and demands me to prove to them something they already disbelieve. I could sit here and stress myself out posting pages upon pages of information and scientific data to support that theory, and it won't satisfy them. What's the fucking point. You tell me. Anyway, Two new RP videos that I thought were both interesting and if you guys want to watch them here's the links: RP vs. Bernanke : Is Gold Money? Ron Paul 2012: A Candidate of Common sense http://youtu.be/_29mBzRdJ8A Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CILONE/SK Posted July 16, 2011 Share Posted July 16, 2011 If you are taking my comments and thinking that I am not willing to debate, then you are wrong. All I am asking for is real facts or substance to back your position up and you fail to do so. If you do not like what I am saying, especially when I back up my points with valid facts, then that is your problem. All I am asking you to do is back you point up and you can not. By failing to provide any proof, what so ever, and then commence with this whiney bullshit, it just shows everyone that you can not debate someone who deals in facts. Do you have anything to show he is not a fringe candidate or that he even has a real chance of winning a national election? If RP is not Fringe, then why not? Stop with all the rhetoric and provide something and stop being a baby. I do not think you have anything and that is why you are getting so upset. I will remind you of what I have that shows he will not win an election by a longshot: Previous election records - show that he did not come close to winning the last two times Money collected - shows that he is not leading the Republicans although he does have the ability to get money, it is not on the same level as some of the other candidates and definitely not as Obama. He will need to step it up greatly to even compete. Take a look at the 2nd quarter for all candidates to see what I mean. So, if you have something, then put it out there, if not then stop being childish and accusing me of the things you are doing yourself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angelofdeath Posted July 16, 2011 Share Posted July 16, 2011 Ron Paul has received $4,518,947.59 from Individual Voters; and $511.45 from PAC's, Corporations, and Lobbyists in the 2nd Quarter. Barack Obama has received $46,323,209.30 from PAC's, Corporations, and Lobbyists; and $325,551.95 from Individual Voters in the 2nd Quarter. ...and the view point ron paul represents is supposed to the ideas of 'business,' 'corporations,' and 'oppression of the poor.' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CILONE/SK Posted July 16, 2011 Share Posted July 16, 2011 Here are the numbers for the 2nd quarter. AOD, what source is that from with Obama's breakdown? Barack Obama Raised: $46,323,209 Spent: $11,095,657 Cash on Hand: $37,110,346 Debts: $412,878 Mitt Romney Raised: $18,383,256 Spent: $5,668,384 Cash on Hand: $12,715,495 Debts: $0 Ron Paul Receipts: $4,518,436 Spent: $1,552,770 Cash on Hand: $2,966,177 Debts: $0 Tim Pawlenty Raised: $4,335,694 Spent: $2,451,251 Cash on Hand: $2,001,090 Debts: $1,915 Michele Bachmann Receipts: $3,639,723 Spent: $260,656 Cash on Hand: $3,379,066 Debts: $364,119 Herman Cain Receipts: $2,580,725 Spent: $2,098,830 Cash on Hand: $481,894 Debts: $500,000 Newt Gingrich Receipts: $2,102,916 Spent: $1,780,693 Cash on Hand: $322,222 Debts: $1,030,627 Rick Santorum Receipts: $582,347 Spent: $353,232 Cash on Hand: $229,114 Debts: $0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zig Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 I already told you I'm not going to waste my time trying to prove something to you that I already know you dismiss and disagree with. Off the top of my head all I can say is that RP has served 30+ years in congress, has had 3 presidential campaigns, has several wildly successful books, is in television interviews almost every day, has great name recognition, and has been consistently placing 3rd in straw polls in Iowa as well as placing high in other straw polls around the nation. That's shit off the top of my head, and I'm sure others could do a good job as well. I'm not going to waste more of my time on this though... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CILONE/SK Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 And how does any of that show us that he has a chance? He had the same thing in 2008 and that did not mean anything because he did not even come close to winning the primary. Straw polls are notoriously know for not equating a real chance of winning in the election, feel free to show me something that shows straw polls equal winning elections. Being a celebrity with books and interviews does not equal anything in a election or trump would have done better. In fact you said the media demonizes him, yet he is always on tv? How does that work, if the media is against him. Now we can use his previous campaigns, but I really do not think you want to, because they back up my point that he is a fringe candidate with no chance of winning. You say you want to debate, yet you do not even try and go whining about not wasting your time. I do not think you know what you are talking about and that is why you do not want to spend the time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zig Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 And how does any of that show us that he has a chance? He had the same thing in 2008 and that did not mean anything because he did not even come close to winning the primary. Straw polls are notoriously know for not equating a real chance of winning in the election, feel free to show me something that shows straw polls equal winning elections. Being a celebrity with books and interviews does not equal anything in a election or trump would have done better. In fact you said the media demonizes him, yet he is always on tv? How does that work, if the media is against him. Now we can use his previous campaigns, but I really do not think you want to, because they back up my point that he is a fringe candidate with no chance of winning. You say you want to debate, yet you do not even try and go whining about not wasting your time. I do not think you know what you are talking about and that is why you do not want to spend the time. Were we arguing here over whether or not RP had a chance at winning the presidency? Reading back through this thread I don't see anywhere me challenging you on that point. I see myself posting and agreeing with you several times that he has a struggle ahead of him to win the nomination. What I was challenging you on, was your point about RP being a fringe candidate and his supporters being the fringe of America. My post before this one was referring to that point. So, why are you all of a sudden turning this into a "debate" about whether or not RP can win the nomination when I never challenged you on that fact. I basically said you don't KNOW for certain that is true, and no matter what statistics you have there is no possible way you can predict the future. I still stand by that statement, because that is a fact which you can't disprove. Also, you aren't reading my posts and comprehending them correctly... if you are even reading them at all, I don't know. I tend to write a lot so I don't blame you if you lose interest in reading the entirety of my responses, but on your point about the media demonizing... I stated that he was being demonized by the media during his 2008 campaign and that his 2012 campaign has seen a significant difference. This is the kind of shit I'm talking about that always goes on here at 12oz. back and forth arguing because people aren't reading and comprehending the way they should be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Decyferon Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 Just so I unerstand (not being from the US) Who is RP running for, is he a republican or democrat nominee? or is he an independant? Because logically thinking if he doesn't have the support of one of the main parties he doesn't really stand a chance. The primaries are where they run to be the parties elected Presidential nominee is that correct? Because I cannot see either of the 2 main parties wanting him to be their presidential runner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CILONE/SK Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 Zig, do you have anything to back up your position that he is not a fringe candidate? Other then "I do not think so and you have no proof", because that is pretty much all you keep saying. I keep hoping that you would bring something to the table, but I guess I am just filled with "hope". My position is based on his history on elections. I will even now add that his history combined with his stance, which is extremely different from other candidates, makes him a fringe candidate. He is the quintessential fringe candidate. Do you have anything to add? Decy, our system for the most part, only has two parties. Independents never really have the ability to seriously compete. The primaries are the elections that members of those parties decide who is going to run for them in a main election. In some states, anyone can vote in a primary, not just members of that party. RP is running as a republican. In 2008 he did the same thing and in the 1988 he ran as an independent. Alot of the established republicans do not like him, because he does not go along with their party on alot of issues. He has been the single "no" vote a few times. They recently redistricted his district and that changed his base of voters. I wish he did run for congress one more time, because I want to see how he would do in that new district that has alot more minorities in it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Decyferon Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 cheers CIL that is exactly how I thought it worked, yea it seems very unlikely for RP to get the republicans nomination in that case, if he doesn't tow the party line he is hardly lkely to get much support from them, especially as his views seem quite different in some aspects to the established republican viewpoint. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CILONE/SK Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 If he had mass appeal, he would have a chance, but his viewpoints are fringe and that is who he draws. His primary draw is from people who are tired of the two parties and the same old ideas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CILONE/SK Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 Ron Paul has received $4,518,947.59 from Individual Voters; and $511.45 from PAC's, Corporations, and Lobbyists in the 2nd Quarter. Barack Obama has received $46,323,209.30 from PAC's, Corporations, and Lobbyists; and $325,551.95 from Individual Voters in the 2nd Quarter. ...and the view point ron paul represents is supposed to the ideas of 'business,' 'corporations,' and 'oppression of the poor.' This article disagrees with what you said. Do you have the source for your assertion that most of his money comes from "PAC's, Corporations, and Lobbyists"? I would like to see who is telling the truth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zig Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 Zig, do you have anything to back up your position that he is not a fringe candidate? Other then "I do not think so and you have no proof", because that is pretty much all you keep saying. I keep hoping that you would bring something to the table, but I guess I am just filled with "hope". My position is based on his history on elections. I will even now add that his history combined with his stance, which is extremely different from other candidates, makes him a fringe candidate. He is the quintessential fringe candidate. Do you have anything to add? I already told you I'm not going to waste my time trying to prove something to you that I already know you dismiss and disagree with. Off the top of my head all I can say is that RP has served 30+ years in congress, has had 3 presidential campaigns, has several wildly successful books, is in television interviews almost every day, has great name recognition, and has been consistently placing 3rd in straw polls in Iowa as well as placing high in other straw polls around the nation. That's shit off the top of my head, and I'm sure others could do a good job as well. I'm not going to waste more of my time on this though... I made this response and than you turned this thread into a so called debate about whether or not he can win the nomination... We could start posting the actual definitions of fringe and begin discussing what exactly fringe means, but anyone can look that up themselves and I'm sure people here are smart enough to understand it. I would agree with you if this were 2008 and you were calling RP fringe, but this is 2012 and I disagree with you that he hasn't broken out of that category and moved into the limelight as a mainstream GOP candidate this campaign season. If you want to keep condescending me and acting like I don't know the meaning of what fringe is, that's fine I won't waste my time with you. I feel like you are wrong, I've brought points to the table in this conversation that you aren't paying attention to and are just dismissing as bullshit and stupidity. Sounds like a typical 12oz argument to me.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CILONE/SK Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 What points have you brought to the table? I keep asking and all you say is this is not 2008. You made a point and you can not back it up, it is that simple and you might want to write it off as a "typical 12oz argument", but I think you probably run into this thing alot if this is how you really behave. Your just mad that I have not let you control this debate/argument. So, how about you finally concede that you have no idea what you are talking about? If this is not true, then for the love of god, bring something to the table or just shut the hell up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zig Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 i'm just going to ignore that. like you ignore a majority of what i've said here in this thread. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CILONE/SK Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 You have nothing and have said nothing. If you did, you would say it. Go back and re-read your posts and tell me what is in any of them, that shows us that he is not fringe. Just one thing. I have not ignored you, I have asked you to back up your posts. You just can not do that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ILOTSMYBRAIN Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 How does that show I called Ron Paul a fascist? Do you have a learning disability? Even in the other thread you were wrong. I did not call RP a fascist, you obviously are having a hard time understanding what is written. You said you weren't the only person to come up with those conclusions, James Delong did as well. Who is just a male version of Rachael Maddow (i read the guys blog, and he thinks RP is a racist as well, LOL) Saying that RP supports fascist ideology in the short term, I didn't quote all of the posts related to it, figured you would at least remember some of the accusations you've made. Guess that was me giving out too much credit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CILONE/SK Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 Ok, smart guy, if you go back and look you will see that I was talking about Ludwig Von Mises, not RP. Those posts were in reference to AOD posting one of his books. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zig Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 You have nothing and have said nothing. If you did, you would say it. Go back and re-read your posts and tell me what is in any of them, that shows us that he is not fringe. Just one thing. I have not ignored you, I have asked you to back up your posts. You just can not do that. I guess the fact that hes served 30+ years in Congress means nothing to you. I guess the fact that he's campaigned 3 times for president means nothing. I guess that fact that he's had several successful books, and has significant name recognition amongst american voters means nothing. I guess the fac that he's interviewed in the mainstream media almost every day to report his views on current events means nothing. Those are 3 points on why he isn't a fringe candidate. 3 points which you ignored. Can you explain why he is a fringe candidate? because all you've done is accuse him of being one, and pointed to primary voting statistics to prove your point. what exactly makes RP a fringe candidate in 2012 in your opinion? If all you can do is point to his "extremist" ideologies about aboloshing the fed, his foreign policy, and his constitutionalism i would warn you that his ideologies are only exact replicas of those of our founding fathers. if RP is fringe, than so are our founding fathers. you have done nothing but disrespect me, insult me, and tell me to shutup basically. i don't know why i'm still even responding to you. In 2008 RP could be considered a fringe candidate and I would agree with you because unfortunately he was pigeonholed into accepting that label. in 2012 calling RP a fringe candidate is just plain unacceptable to me, as a politician his views are accepted by a substantial following of americans and his campaign is proving to be more successful than the chosen corporate front runners. you're stuck in the past and you're probably upset that RP's campaign is doing so well this time around and more people are beginning to listen and agree with his perspectives. that's why you get so worked up and result to insults and childish behaviour when someone disagrees with you on your points. that's why you insult pretty much everyone who supports RP as a candidate. these are not my problems, their yours and i could care less what you think. the bottom line is, i respectfully disagree with you and i've stated why and ive attempted to convey why it is that i do disagree with you respectfully as i can. unfortunately your acting like an idiot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ILOTSMYBRAIN Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 Ok, smart guy, if you go back and look you will see that I was talking about Ludwig Von Mises, not RP. Those posts were in reference to AOD posting one of his books. That's what I get for not reading entire threads and jumping in after reading a few posts. Still though, Mises a fascist? :lol: http://www.politics.ie/forum/history/91324-ludwig-von-mises-fascist.html You on that board too? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CILONE/SK Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 His record of votes in those elections are only backing up that he is fringe, if he wasn't, he would have appealed to more voters and gotten more votes. [/color] I guess that fact that he's had several successful books, and has significant name recognition amongst american voters means nothing. I guess you did not read my post above, does being a celebrity mean your not fringe? How does books and interviews equate anything along the political spectrum? Those are 3 points on why he isn't a fringe candidate. 3 points which you ignored.I did not ignore them and addressed them above, you are just mad because they do not make any point that he is not fringe. Can you explain why he is a fringe candidate?because his actions separate him from the rest of the mainstream candidates and parties which are both a majority of the people because all you've done is accuse him of being on"e, and pointed to primary voting statistics to prove your point.those stats prove alot more then you realize and are willing to accept. Higher numbers equal more acceptance to the masses and RP does not have that what exactly makes RP a fringe candidate in 2012 in your opinion? If all you can do is point to his "extremist" ideologies about aboloshing the fed, his foreign policy, and his constitutionalism i would warn you that his ideologies are only exact replicas of those of our founding fathers. this is what you want to argue about and are mad that I am not doing so. You are the one who keeps bringing it up in this thread, but since you have, these are some of what separates him from other candidates and makes him fringe, and it is a stretch to say that they are the same as our founding fathers. if RP is fringe, than so are our founding fathers wrong and this shows that you have no idea what you are talking about. you have done nothing but disrespect me, insult me, and tell me to shutup basically. i don't know why i'm still even responding to you. Do you have anything else? Try not to sound like a RP cult member and steer the conversation to ideological rhetoric. Bottom line, he is fringe because of his views being different then mainstream (doesn't matter in this discussion if that is right or wrong) and the voting record supports that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CILONE/SK Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 That's what I get for not reading entire threads and jumping in after reading a few posts. Still though, Mises a fascist? :lol: http://www.politics.ie/forum/history/91324-ludwig-von-mises-fascist.html You on that board too? That is a debate I would love to get into, but honestly, I have my hands full already. :lol: :lol: No hard feelings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zig Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 yay let's play the colored text game. I choose Orange! During those 30+ years he has seperated himself for the rest of the Reublican party, when he was not an Independent. Most of them do not like him, because he does not go along with the party and has been known to vote "no" when the rest of the vote "yes". If you listen to RP, which you obviously don't, you'd understand that his reasoning behind even being involved in the GOP is because America has a monopolistic 2 party political system that leaves third party candidates in a severely unfair situation when it comes to campaigning. The only reason RP has been registered with the GOP is due to the platform it offers to politicians to get their message out to the people. With that fact understood and comprehended, it's very simple to understand why he doesn't vote with his party most of the time. Also, what is wrong with not voting with your party? Politicians who walk lockstep with their party 100% of the time should be looked down upon in a country that values freedom and independence. This is actually a quality of RP that I admire, in that he isn't a corporate shill who can't think for himself when it comes to controversial political issues. Another point RP makes is that the GOP or what is supposed to be representative of "Republicans" today has steered off course and gone astray from the values and ideals the Republican party used to represent. What is your response to this? His record of votes in those elections are only backing up that he is fringe, if he wasn't, he would have appealed to more voters and gotten more votes. This is not necessarily true, and please I would ask that you clarify on your point that this by itself is "backing up that he is fringe". So, since he didn't generate a certain amount of votes for the GOP nomination he is automatically a fringe candidate based off of numbers alone? This tells me two things about your argument. The first, is that you actually believe the political electorate system in this country is fair and balanced which is moronic, and the second is that you actually consider corporate front-running candidates who are pushed in the media and forced down our throats have actually accomplished earning the trust and approval of a majority of this country based off of numbers. I don't know what you think so please clarify how the voting statistics make him fringe. I guess you did not read my post above, does being a celebrity mean your not fringe? How does books and interviews equate anything along the political spectrum? Since when have books and interviews NOT equated to anything in the political spectrum? I thought that was how politicians kept their careers afloat to begin with. If a politician has a successful book it shows that people around the country are actually listening to what the politician has to say and are interested in that particular politicians ideals. Even Sarah Palin has to be taken somewhat seriously in Washington because of her success with books and other forms of media. What do you think politicians did when this country was first founded? They wrote their ideas down on paper and people around the nation read them and shared their thoughts and opinions, creating political conversation and debate. Books and reading is probably at the foundation of the political spectrum. I did not ignore them and addressed them above, you are just mad because they do not make any point that he is not fringe. I'm not mad at all, I'm annoyed because you're annoying. You did ignore them and you turned the argument into something I wasn't even challenging you on. You're confused... those stats prove alot more then you realize and are willing to accept. Higher numbers equal more acceptance to the masses and RP does not have that I'm willing to accept that RP will have an enormous struggle to win the nomination, because I know that the GOP is unwilling to accept a leader who holds the views and ideals that RP does. The statistics don't equal more acceptance to me, they just equate to successful campaigns which involve a lot of unfair and corrupt factors that prevent candidates like RP from even being considered. For example, if Britney Spears generates high numbers in the music industry does that make her a talented song writer/singer? No, it just means that corporations invest in her, back her, and push her as a product to the masses who consume her as entertainment for her owners to make money and profit. It has nothing to do with whether or not the entertainer is actually talented, and elections aren't much different in our capitalist society. this is what you want to argue about and are mad that I am not doing so. You are the one who keeps bringing it up in this thread, but since you have, these are some of what separates him from other candidates and makes him fringe, and it is a stretch to say that they are the same as our founding fathers. It's not a stretch at all to say RP's views represent closely those of our founding fathers because RP bases 100% of what he votes on from the Constitution. He is a constitutionalist libertarian, I don't think you can get any closer to our founding fathers than that. What separates him from other GOP candidates is the fact that he actually considers following the laws of this country and understands the limitations of government. Bottom line, he is fringe because of his views being different then mainstream You see, you think that the MEDIA decides what mainstream is. I think you believe that mainstream is reflected by the what the media says are the popular views of today, and you feel like front-running candidates represent the mainstream of America because they can generate the most amount of votes. Let's not forget that a majority of Americans DON'T vote. Let's not forget how low of a percentage of minority Americans DON'T vote. Why is this? Because they know that that the electorate system in this country is broken and corrupt, so they choose not to participate. Why else? Because they aren't properly educated and informed about candidates and the laws of this country pertaining to their freedom and liberty. The REAL mainstream in this country is marginalized and disenfranchised, which is why front-running corporate candidates who have elitist connections and high bank rolls ALWAYS win elections. RP is not a fringe candidate in 2012, he's as close to "mainstream" as he's ever been and probably as close as he'll ever get due to the imbalances him and MANY OTHER candidates are forced to endure. This isn't about me defending RP, this is in defense of third party candidates and in opposition to the the corrupt two party electorate system that has people like you calling anyone who isn't a corporate shill front-runner "fringe". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CILONE/SK Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 ^not one thing you wrote is saying he is a mainstream candidate. You are bringing ideological positions and view points into this. I think that is where you are confused. His viewpoints are different then mainstream candidates, regardless of whether they are right or wrong. He does not get the votes because he does not translate to the majority of Americans. Everything you have stated does not have any substance to it when it comes to saying he is not fringe, but it does have a foothold if you are arguing his position against some other candidate. I do not think you are clearly able to stay on track with a discussion without bringing his rhetoric into it. Let me try this from a different angle, please cite something that shows he is mainstream. His viewpoints are obviously different then all the other candidates, so please leave his viewpoints out of it, because if you do not, then we will get into ideological opinions, and they are just opinions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zig Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 oh yea... nothing i say matters... and I'M not able to stay on track with this discussion. hilarious man, you're a fucking joke. goodbye. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ILOTSMYBRAIN Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 You can say the Tea Party movement in itself is because of RP. Look how many offices Tea Party candidates hold, and if things continue it will only pick up further. I guess you would call the Tea Party "fringe" as well, and not mainstream, although they have a significant impact, and are talked about constantly in national news. I would agree with you if this was 2001 and we we're talking about Ross Perot, but this is not that scenario, how you don't see that is beyond me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CILONE/SK Posted July 18, 2011 Share Posted July 18, 2011 So, because of the tea party, RP is not fringe? Too bad that does not hold water because they are voting for Bachman and Palin if she decides to run. The tea party has left him to pursue more mainstream objectives. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CILONE/SK Posted July 18, 2011 Share Posted July 18, 2011 oh yea... nothing i say matters... and I'M not able to stay on track with this discussion. hilarious man, you're a fucking joke. goodbye. You are the joke who can not talk about something without bringing ideological views into it. You seem to equate the RP is a mainstream candidate because he has certain views. I can argue the same thing except to say his views are what makes him fringe and the voters seem to agree with that, which is why he has not and will not get even close to winning the primary. Although I am bringing up his views, I am not saying they are right or wrong in this discussion. You seem not to be able to tell the difference. You might think I am a joke, but the fact is I know you are one because you do not even realize you are a RP Cult Knob Slobber who can not even argue why he is not a fringe candidate. :lol: :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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