help with 3-d

yo can someone helpme with my 3-d (not 2-d). any time i attempt it it just looks like a 2-d piece. :yuck: :yuck: :yuck:

Originally posted by mad rat@Mar 19 2005, 10:51 AM

yo can someone helpme with my 3-d (not 2-d). any time i attempt it it just looks like a 2-d piece. :yuck: :yuck: :yuck:

Quoted post

Look at other pieces and see how other writers execute it. Look at ordinary objects like boxes and cylinders and sketch them out from different perspectives, the 3d aspects will change depending on where you are. Notice 3d letters like on top of buildings and stuff like that.

Be observant. And draw.

yea i have been lookin at how totem2 approaches it... i can sketch some 3-d shit but when it comes to paintin it it turns out 2-d

just paint what you sketched and it should come out looking the same..no problem.

yea i tryed what you said fem and it worked. thanks. i'll post fliks as soon as their developed

Originally posted by mad rat@Mar 20 2005, 05:45 PM

yea i tryed what you said fem and it worked. thanks. i'll post fliks as soon as their developed

Quoted post

Sounds good.

Umm....................

nevermind

quit.

Paperchase?

fuck you ppl who say "Just quit writing now..." like wat the fuck no one gets it the second they pick up a damn pencil and they shouldnt be fucking sry for asking for help on how to do something.

Originally posted by Suicide Bomber@Mar 21 2005, 02:24 PM

fuck you ppl who say "Just quit writing now..." like wat the fuck no one gets it the second they pick up a damn pencil and they shouldnt be fucking sry for asking for help on how to do something.

Quoted post

For my understanding..Writers from back in the day didnt have access to the Internet to ask for help...so....... :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

i've got some advice for you, just on the sketching aspect. go out and find rocks, plants, whatever...just natural objects and sketch them.

you can thank me later.

no pictures...................

CLOSED

Originally posted by Dertychucks@Mar 21 2005, 07:15 PM

no pictures...................

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

CLOSED

Quoted post

this section dosent have pictures, you are retarded.

^^ :haha:

Originally posted by KiLL Or DiE+Mar 21 2005, 10:25 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (KiLL Or DiE - Mar 21 2005, 10:25 PM)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--QuoteBegin-Suicide Bomber@Mar 21 2005, 02:24 PM

fuck you ppl who say "Just quit writing now..." like wat the fuck no one gets it the second they pick up a damn pencil and they shouldnt be fucking sry for asking for help on how to do something.

Quoted post

For my understanding..Writers from back in the day didnt have access to the Internet to ask for help...so....... :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

[/b]

Yeah but this isn't back in the day is it? Fucking hell you all act like you were never toys at all. Give the kid some slack.

back in the day their wasnt much people who could paint 3-d. at least im not biteing i was just asking for some help and how to approach 3-d. no need for all the bitching. i will post my fliks here real soon their gettin developed now. im not that much toy neither... i have got props for my 2-d peices. for all the people whos bitchin please post your 3-d stuff.

Ok, I'll try to help you with this since it's 4 am and i can't go back to sleep.

I'm betting that the problem you're having isn't a lack of ability to draw and render a three dimensional object, but applying that knowledge through spray paint. I've seen waaaay more very bad 3D attempts than good ones, and usually the problem isn't the concept, but the technical execution. The problem with 3D pieces is that they rely heavily on technical experience with spray paint. You cannot do a 3D piece unless you at least understand a few concepts of using spray paint. Style is another matter entirely, something that you have to learn through trial and error and possess a little talent, but I'll focus on the technique of 3D, since that's what you seem to be asking.

First and foremost, you need to be able to paint very cleanly. The best 3D pieces I've seen were all painted backwards. By that I mean that at least some of the original outline was preserved, and simply built upon with progressively lighter colors. To replicate a Totem piece, it's not that simple, because he cuts back with darker colors to create certain shapes, but let's not get ahead of ourselves. I'd say the best way to practice would be to draw a shape in, say, black paint, and then try to fill it in, but preserve a tiny bit of the original black to keep a tiny outline around it. Here's a flick of something I painted to illustrate what I'm trying to say.

[attachmentid=10996]

I painted the T backwards. First I laid down the black outline, then cut into it with the green, preserving just a tiny bit of black to keep an outline. You can see how the edges aren't quite razor sharp. I'd recommend using Krylon, Belton, or any other paint that doesn't skip or have a delay in it's action. Rusto has an annoying way of stuttering in the beginning of a line, just a second where no paint comes out. The green is actually Rusto Meadow Green, but I've been painting a while and I'm used to it. It's essential to have this technique down to paint 3D.

The next step is to take a flat object, like the T above, and add some dimension to it. Here's another flick to illustrate.

[attachmentid=10995]

What I did here was do a regular old T with burgundy, double thickness width of a NY thin, so I had something to cut into. To pop it off the wall, I made a slight shadow behind it with the same burgundy, just holding the can further back and spraying the same shape lightly over. It's best to do the shadow at this point, because it's a lot more difficult to do it later. Next I used the same Krylon Watermelon that I used to fill in the background square, and back-painted in over the burgundy, preserving a little bit for outline. I used a grey dot cap, which sprays softly and allows for quite a bit more control than a NY thin. You can do the whole effect with a NY thin, I'd just recommend painting larger. At this point we're looking like the above picture, 2D with a tiny outline. All you really need to do to add dimension to it is add lighter paint to the "raised" areas. I used the same grey dot with Krylon Ballet Slipper (a soft pale pink) and lightly spritzed in a hint of lighter pink to bring up the surface of the T, heavy in the areas that I wanted to look raised, and lighter in the set back areas, or none at all. It looks decent now, but to really get that subtle, refined touch, I barely misted in the barest hint of white on the ends, so they have an extra "pop". Subtlety is very important in preserving a realistic look. I used four colors in just that little T. You have to build a shape with several levels of a color, instead of just light and dark. It's very difficult to create a realistic looking object with just a couple colors. Subtle, mild gradients is what it's all about.

You need to be able to do a blend. It can be just a plain old two color fade, but the trick is to make it impossible to tell exactly where one color begins and the other ends. The trick to getting clean, seamless blends is layering. First, you always layer lighter over dark, then go back with the darker color and lightly spritz in a misty coating to soften and even things up. Repeat the process until you can step away and not see any patchy areas or obvious spray lines. Again, Rusto is not the best for this. It always seems to spray kind of patchy in my experience. If you're dealing with just a small area, it's not so bad, but an even fade all the way across a whole piece is much harder with Rusto. (Then again, filling a piece solid is a much, much longer process with Krylon. Rather thin and watery, by and large.) By learning how to blend, you'll also learn subtlety with paint, how spraying at different distances with different caps will make blending easier, how to apply different amounts of pressure to the cap to achieve softer lines and also get a feel for wrist movement and how paint lands when the can is not pointed directly perpendicular to the wall.

To do a decent 3D, I'd say you need, at the bare minimum, four or five colors to pull off a believable 3D piece. You need those colors to be in a scale, meaning the same color in several shades from light to dark. By far the easiest is grayscale. Aside from paint availability, and not worrying too much about tonal value (cool grey, warm grey, etc.... don't worry about that right now), you can also essentially try to replicate exactly what's in your pencil sketch. The best scale to get is Krylon Black (gloss is better for a true black look), Krylon Shadow Grey, Krylon Smoke Grey, Krylon Pewter Grey and Krylon White. I'm not sure how readily available Krylon Pewter and Shadow grey are anymore, but I know that Smoke is sold in Walmart. I'm sure you can find something camparable in other brands. Basically all you need is black, dark grey, medium grey, light grey and white. I'm sure adding in some other in between greys will make gradients and blends just that much smoother. Of course, sometimes it's pointless to use a million shades of grey to do what you can with only 3-4 and some good technique. To illustrate, here's a greyscale totem canvas. It's a decent close up, so you can get a feel for the technique.

[attachmentid=10997]

I wasn't there, but I bet he used 4-5 shades, including black and white. If you look closely, you can pick up on his technique and the way he approaches his pieces. Not to cheapen Totems work in any way, because it's some of the best out there in my opinion, but it's really just a study in blending, shading and cutting with spray paint. Some of the tight details were achieved by applying the light colors over the dark, blending and building up the dimension with hints of white over grey, then spritzing back in with black to tighten and shape things back up. Or adding some white, then going back in with a light or medium grey to shape things up. A great deal of it is experience, practice, technique and knowledge. Totem has amazing amounts of talent and creativity, but I think the technical aspect of his work is something that just about anybody can learn.

Lastly, experimentation is the best teacher. Try all kinds of paint brands, all kinds of colors in all kinds of combinations, all kinds of caps (including stocks) and use them to create anything you can think of in any way possible. Over the years I've been painting, I've seen kids do amazing things with graffiti by thinking outside the box. New styles and techniques have emerged through outlinging before filling in, finger painting, splattering paint, popping cans of paint with a knife, spraying the can upside down, spraying through tubes, stencils, wire mesh, you name it. There's a use for basically anything in graffiti. It's all up to your imagination. VHS tapes, bags of concrete, fire extinguishers, carbon paper, a shovel, wallpaper glue.....I've seen someone use it to make graffiti. There's no wrong way to do it.

I should write a book about this and get fucking paid for it.

whoa kool i can ;earn somehing from this too

Originally posted by onesecondple+Mar 22 2005, 04:47 AM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (onesecondple - Mar 22 2005, 04:47 AM)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--QuoteBegin-Dertychucks@Mar 21 2005, 07:15 PM

no pictures...................

CLOSED

Quoted post

this section dosent have pictures, you are retarded.

[/b]

you got me :haha:

no, this is not a picture section, regardless of the pictures posted, you are still retarded...

dude i just think 3d will come when ur ready

if u cant do 3d who cares.

try some other stuff mann,

Instead of arguing about people posting pictures here, why don't you read Old Growths post and learn something...

Originally posted by caffeine@Mar 25 2005, 11:28 AM

if u cant do 3d who cares.

try some other stuff mann,

Quoted post

i have been doing other shit for the past 9 years so im kinda bored with the whole 2-d bombing and piecing. dont get me wrong i do love bombing but im looking to try new shit

You've been writing NINE years...................

Actually nevermind

Your best bet is to view other writers work on how they did theirs and it might spark an idea for you... But practice practice practice... Itll come to ya soon enough... Good luck..

Old Growth has a way with words...

you have my gratitude for your work in the wee hours.

my advice for 3d:

pick a point, for example to the left and bottom of your piece,

maybe like 6 feet to the right. mark it with a dot.

now draw your 3d line to that point, well not all the way

like 6inch then stop the line. after ya do that make

horizontal lines to connect them

and yes i realize this makes absolutely no sense,

but it sounded good in my head