another school shooting

[WORDISM45]

kthx

[shitting]

Rights are already well protected in Australia

 

The High Court is already protecting rights through its interpretation of the Constitution and the common law

 

Rights listed in the Constitution or Acts actually make little or no difference in protecting rights

 

The political system itself is the best protection of rights in Australia

 

A Bill of Rights would actually restrict rights, that is, to define a right is to limit it

 

A Bill of Rights would be undemocratic by giving unelected judges the power to override the judgment of Parliament

 

A Bill of Rights would politicise the judiciary

 

A Bill of Rights would be very expensive given the amount of litigation it would generate

 

A Bill of Rights would be alien to our tradition of Parliamentary sovereignty

 

A Bill of Rights would protect rights (e.g. the right to bear arms) which might not be so important to future generations

[christo-f]

....and I don't know 1 Australian that lives in fear of their own government or that some one is going to come into their school and blow them all away.

[Decyferon]

Well I am from the UK and there is a rise in shootings and stabbings and people getting jumped by crews of people. I do blame many different factors like media, the portrayal of being Rich being the only thing important, fame etc

 

however I think that basically the rise in all these sort of crimes comes about from the way society is nowadays. In the UK people are always talking about binge drinking and why it happens and basically it happens because there is no future for anyone. They aren't going to get a good job unless they have come in the uppermost echelon of students or daddy is connected. So then you get wannabe gangster that think theuy need to be hardcore and then you get the depressed bullied kid that hates the world. He wants to die but why go out quietly, remember he hates the world so take as many of them with you as possible.

 

hope that makes sense am in work now and havin arguements with ex while typing this and emailingf her so mind isnt most focused

[angelofdeath]

....and I don't know 1 Australian that lives in fear of their own government or that some one is going to come into their school and blow them all away.

 

i dont FEAR... i just acknowledge governments nature and that criminals do exist and that it is possible for you to be subjected to them both.

i also recognize that i might lose power or that i might have to deal with a flood or hurricane. i prepare accordingly.

 

i dont live in fear. i choose to get things done, not have something that happens to me, then sit around sulking about it.

that is why i prepare for such things, systemically and without emotion.

 

you have much more of a chance of being killed on the road driving than by a terrorist or a crazy school shooter. that is why i wear a seat belt.

[angelofdeath]

nikes!!

[christo-f]

I'm just going to leave this here for you kids to chat about. I'm done with gun talk.

 

 

Smuggled U.S. guns responsible for most Canadian armed crime: report

 

Jul 29 01:48 AM US/Eastern

Bob Weber, THE CANADIAN PRESS

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

A new study suggests most of the guns used to commit crimes in Canada have been smuggled in from the United States.

The study, published Wednesday in the Journal of Criminology and Criminal Justice, found that the best available data suggests that about two-thirds of crime guns seized in Canada have their origin south of the border. It's a situation the Americans would be unlikely to accept if it were reversed, said one of the report's authors.

 

"Canada seldom points to the obvious fact that lax U.S. gun laws not only result in high numbers of Americans being killed with guns, but fuel the illegal gun trade and handgun homicide in Canada, in Mexico, in the Caribbean and indeed around the world.""The U.S. never hesitates to draw attention to threats to its security," said Wendy Cukier of Ryerson University, one of the report's authors and a prominent gun control activist.

The study, conducted by Cukier as well as researchers in the U.S. and Great Britain, looked at the underground market between the U.S., Canada and Mexico.

"It is not possible to determine with certainty the percentage of guns used in crime in Canada or Mexico that have been illegally exported from the Unites States, but there is some relevant evidence available that indicates the proportion is high," the study says.

"There are very few cases that show handguns used in crime coming from anywhere other than the USA."

In 2006, Toronto police successfully traced back 181 guns used in crimes to their original sale. The source of 120 of them was the U.S.

An Ontario-wide gun tracing program found that 69 per cent of 705 guns used in 2007 in crimes in that province could be traced to the U.S. About 90 per cent of those guns were either restricted or prohibited in Canada.

That same year, the Canadian Firearms Program reported that of the 710 guns used by criminals it was able to trace in 2007, 54 per cent were smuggled.

And last year, Canadian customs officials say they seized 514 restricted and prohibited weapons. Customs officials stop about three per cent of the traffic that flows across the border.

"The patterns seem well-established," said Cukier in an email.

Most of the smuggled guns - and guns used in crime - are handguns. The majority of rifles and shotguns used in crimes originate in Canada.

Criminal gangs are the recipients of most of the smuggled guns.

"Illegal trafficked weapons are primarily used by criminal groups of varying degrees of organization," the report says.

Still, it's tough to get complete data on the sources of guns used in crimes.

Many crime guns aren't recovered. Serial numbers are often erased and unrecoverable. And it's doubly difficult to track guns from countries outside the U.S., such as China, Cukier said.

Cukier said Canada should step up its efforts to fight gun-running.

"Canada should be taking a lead role in international efforts to combat the illicit trade in small arms," she said.

Canada has yet to ratify the UN Firearms Protocol, under which countries promise to do more to fight the illegal traffic in small arms around the world.

[christo-f]

Whilst there are a lot of questions that can be asked about this report and the people that conducted it, I think the point is that the more prevalent guns are in society the easier it is for crims to get their hands on them which then necessitates general society to also arm themselves for protection. However, if the guns weren't already so widely available the crims would not be so well and widely armed reducing the need for the general citizenry to arm themselves for self protection.

 

 

That's a simple line of logic that I see that avoids issues like liberty and so on. Just looking at the self protection issue.

[russell jones]

I still don't think you realize how entrenched and fundamental gun rights are to the United States since its founding christo-f. It's sacrosanct, it's like a religion. There's no changing it. For many people in the US guns=liberty, and no amount of logical argument is going to get you anywhere.

 

That being said, I go to Canada quite often, and its really easy to buy a gun there as far as I can tell. Last time I was in Toronto, people were buying guns at the corner store. Also, I don't buy the whole if guns are more available to law abiding citizens they are automatically more available to criminals argument. In Canada, criminals might have bought American guns because they thought they would be less traceable by Canadian authorities.

[christo-f]

Oh I understand and I've even said many times that gun laws for the US are stupid because that place is too far gone. I argue against the idea that gun laws are bad for all countries such as Australia, England, Spain, Sweden, etc. And that you need them to keep the govt. honest or deter invasion. The liberty thing I don't enter in to because that is a philosophical debate that I have no insight to whatsoever.

 

Anyway, wasn't looking to get in to it again, just wanting to chuck that up for yall to read.

[angelofdeath]

"I argue against the idea that gun laws are bad for all countries such as Australia, England, Spain, Sweden, etc. And that you need them to keep the govt. honest or deter invasion."

 

damn, i wish you would of stated that during every debate we have had. actually, if you said that then there would never of been a debate.

[swineflu.]

 

i haven't been following this convo but i felt that this was the only appropriate place to put this

 

but from what i understand from a brief skim the only real gun crazy country is America and if you look at whats happened with that, peeps drop dead weekly

 

seriously you dont really need them there for cowards who cant fight

[christo-f]

Hahaha @ the cowards call!

 

So, you don't think that places like Russia, Pakistan, Brazil, Honduras, Mexico, Iraq, Egypt, Algeria, Congo, Nigeria, Liberia..., well, half of Africa and many other places are full of guns too?

 

Not sure you really know what you're talking about my friend.

[lord_casek]

If the United States didn't have guns it would never exist. Imagine that, rule by the Queen of Angland (yes, I spelled it properly...Anglo...think).

 

Also, this is the United States of America. America is the continent.