Guest KING BLING Posted November 24, 2004 Share Posted November 24, 2004 Originally posted by KaBar2@Nov 23 2004, 11:13 AM People have behaved like civilized human beings, for the most part, and have attempted to express their anger and frustration the way the rules say they must--at the polls. But the liberal Democrats have succeeded in radically altering the cities--conservative whites have flooded out of the cities and into the suburbs. No wonder that on the election maps the center of the country looks solid red. Quoted post "At the polls" my ass, an uninformed population and a manipulated system does not a democracy make... The republicans have been "radically altering" democracy at its core while using inflamatory lies in the media and advertising - both sides get ugly in campaigns but republicans have mastered and fully implemented lies as a means to political office (Swiftboat Vaterans, The West Virginia gun scare, Osama wants a democrat, etc...). Republicans civilized and principled behavior in office has given us redistricting to distort representation, battling fair and open voting than accurate recounts, needlessly attacking a mans integrity via legal means on issues that have no bearing on there performance in office, manipulating information to create hysteria and war, unusually massive corporate involvement in the government, at least the symbolic support of embedding discrimination in the constitution and so on... I feel like a broken record... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nekro Posted November 24, 2004 Share Posted November 24, 2004 Originally posted by KaBar2@Nov 23 2004, 02:13 PM The right wing of the Republican party has been pretty successful at driving the entire political process farther to the right. The "Silent Majority" of the 1960's is no longer silent. The liberal Democrats (this is kind of redundant--there are no more conservative Democrats) enjoyed a run of over forty years. For forty years, they dominated both houses of Congress. They passed one measure after another that the inert conservative middle found offensive. They forced the conservatives out of the Democratic Party, where they were welcomed by the Republicans in droves. The liberal Democrats had their own way, and now they are dealing with the result of pissing people off, and forcing unwanted social "reforms" on people, and forcing people into situations which they do not wish to be in. It was not really a grass-roots movement. It was forced from above. We have not had civil war. There have been very few violent outbursts from the right. People have behaved like civilized human beings, for the most part, and have attempted to express their anger and frustration the way the rules say they must--at the polls. But the liberal Democrats have succeeded in radically altering the cities--conservative whites have flooded out of the cities and into the suburbs. No wonder that on the election maps the center of the country looks solid red. The extremes on both sides are larger than they were. That is a tendency that is likely to continue. I read something by the Southern Poverty Law Center that said that the National Alliance (a notorious neo-nazi organization) is increasing in size rapidly. They accomplished this by becoming less hateful and strident and more mainstream, but in the end, they advocate "national socialism," i.e. the Nazi philosophy. In my opinion, this is a temporary "backlash" phenomenon, but it's still very concerning. (The leader of the National Alliance, William Pierce, wrote the book that inspired Timothy McVeigh to bomb the Murrah Federal Building in Oklahoma City.) Quoted post You do realize that the "unwanted social reforms" were women's rights, civil rights for racial minorities, and civil rights for gay people, right? You realize that the reason white people went to the suburbs was to get away from black people, right? People in America don't want the melting pot, they want the fucking gated community. These social changes are uncomfortable most of the time, but we look back on them and are always glad we made them. We hold these truths to be self evident: women should be allowed to vote, blacks and whites should be treated equally, slavery is despickable and morally indefensible, and every man should be able to vote, regardless of his economic situation. In their day, each of these issues threatened to tear the country apart. Each movement for greater equality and justice in America inspired a backlash, but that's no reason not to pursue them in the first place. Liberalism is about liberty. I might not agree with people having abortions all the time, but I'm not going to interfere with that because it doesn't affect me. Straight people shouldn't care about gay marriage because it doesn't affect them. However, gay people are being denied their right to marry the person they love. That's wrong. I don't care how many guns you own, it's just when you start shooting people that I'm going to be mad. I don't care what other people do, it's just when they try to force their beliefs on me that I get pissed off. I'm fucking tired of all this crap about how the middle of the country is where The Real America is. A vast majority of our population lives in cities and on the coasts. The coasts are solid blue, and the bigger the cities get, the stronger they vote democratic. The "Liberal Democrats" suceeded in "radically changing the cities" because urban people keep voting for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaBar2 Posted November 24, 2004 Share Posted November 24, 2004 I keep telling myself I'm not going to get involved in these discussions any more, and I still do so. We never really get anywhere, because it's like we are talking two different languages. Our viewpoints are so different that it's extremely difficult to converse about it. As much blah-blah-blah as we do, it isn't going to change. Many of the so-called reforms and advances aren't reforms or advances at all. They are LOSSES, and have seriously harmed us. How are we better off now that the divorce rate is over 50%? How are we better off that every single urban neighborhood is in a constant process of deterioration and impoverishment? Are we better off with "bull's eye" cities? A black inner city surrounded by white suburbs? Are we better off with an "All-Volunteer Army" that is essentially an army of mercenaries? Are we better off that the nation is politically polarized between liberals and conservatives? Are we better off with wide-spread promiscuity, teenaged pregnancy and abortion-on-demand? Are we better off with a raging epidemic of drugs, even down to elementary schools? Are we better off with the collapse of the nuclear family structure, with children being raised by their mothers, with no father in the home? Are we better off with virtually every family having both parents work, work, work, work? Who the fuck is RAISING THE KIDS? Are we better off with all the proliferation of bizarre and unwholesome subcultures of every stripe known to man? With a massive immigration of millions and millions and millions of foreigners who do not share our culture? I don't know, but I know that I DO NOT LIKE IT. Our country is changing in ways that I am totally opposed to. If you approve of all these changes, you are within your rights to do so, of course. Nobody can really say there is anything wrong with you approving of all these changes. But it is also true that I am free to DISAPPROVE of them. I do not support them. That's my right, as well. When Election Day comes, I am free to vote my conscience--not that it's going to do any good. We drift father and farther and farther apart. It does not bode well for the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nekro Posted November 24, 2004 Share Posted November 24, 2004 Originally posted by KaBar2@Nov 24 2004, 05:21 AM I don't know, but I know that I DO NOT LIKE IT. Quoted post There you have it, the essence of how conservatives think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dirtyhoodrat Posted November 25, 2004 Share Posted November 25, 2004 this sounds like that one played out record of wanting some picturesque America that never really existed nor will even exist. like hey man what happened to the good old days? shit let's just undo civil rights, not let in the goddamn foreigners, and go back to the time when a woman really knew her place... in the goddamn kitchen with a kid under each arm. wah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanity Posted November 26, 2004 Share Posted November 26, 2004 well, a big deal that popped up a while back is that a Washington Post (considered left) reporter did a survey of a bunch of reporters about who they think would be a better president..like 80% chose kerry. the knee jerk reaction to this is that they're biased; of, course, you could also argue that they're just more educated on the issues and making a better informed decision. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BROWNer Posted November 26, 2004 Share Posted November 26, 2004 i'm not too sure how much effect that would really have, since real decisions are not made by the reporters themselves. you'd also have to take into account the total careerism that reporters are highly prone to... for example john king and others...he's a mouthpiece for the white house, he never imbues any opinions of his own, he just spews the line given to him(and he's regarded as this great reporter). or other reporters at the white house(which are all considered great reporters, all at the peak of their careers becuz they cover the white house), which are basically a conduit for white house propaganda..they censor themselves becuz they cannot ask the real questions without risking their coveted status as a white house press corps reporter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villain Posted November 27, 2004 Share Posted November 27, 2004 excellent point. whats so great about regurgitating propaganda? haha... good stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanity Posted November 27, 2004 Share Posted November 27, 2004 well, it's a coveted post because instead of dodging bullets in iraq, you get to sip fine wine in air force 1. but yeah. the survey was supposedly anonymous, and i guess like reporters who were stationed in DC favored kerry by a 12:1 ratio. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaBar2 Posted November 27, 2004 Share Posted November 27, 2004 But there's no liberal media bias, eh? Gee, they must feel pretty impotent, after all their effort to school the rest of us ignorant, backwoods racists in how we ought to think, ought to feel about things, and ought to vote, and yet, Senator Kerry did not win. Well, don't worry. Senator Clinton will probably run in 2008, and she will be able to slap these rednecks back where they belong. She knows whats best for us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest imported_El Mamerro Posted November 27, 2004 Share Posted November 27, 2004 Originally posted by villain@Nov 26 2004, 09:21 PM excellent point. whats so great about regurgitating propaganda? haha... good stuff. Quoted post I know, right? I feel the same way with 90% of the indy news sites that get linked here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BROWNer Posted November 27, 2004 Share Posted November 27, 2004 ^that 90% of them regurgitate propaganda? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest imported_El Mamerro Posted November 27, 2004 Share Posted November 27, 2004 Yeah. Keyword: "feel" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BROWNer Posted November 28, 2004 Share Posted November 28, 2004 you're more cynical than i thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest imported_El Mamerro Posted November 28, 2004 Share Posted November 28, 2004 For media matters... yes. I have a reeeeeally hard time trusting almost anything from any news source, corporate or independent. I see agendas in everything I read, and it completely fucks it up for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanity Posted November 28, 2004 Share Posted November 28, 2004 i actually give the bbc a fair amount of credit for risking themselves and suing their own government Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ODS-1 Posted November 30, 2004 Share Posted November 30, 2004 The media here critizes no one except who the government critizises (sp?). They don't try to find out what's happening or why it's happening. And all media companies in the US are owned by multi national corporations. Can you guess who they side with 98% of the time? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ledzep Posted December 1, 2004 Share Posted December 1, 2004 ^the dark side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BROWNer Posted December 1, 2004 Share Posted December 1, 2004 mamerro, you need probing. so if you're unwilling to trust any media(is that a fair statement?), how does one such as yourself come to any sort of position regarding events you cannot learn about first hand (incidentally, to me anyhow, you seem to be a fence sitter of sorts...along with playing devil's advocate, which i'd regard as something very different)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Æ° Posted December 1, 2004 Share Posted December 1, 2004 Liberal CEO's everywhere! CEHoe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oh so modern Posted December 1, 2004 Share Posted December 1, 2004 Originally posted by Hermdog@Nov 22 2004, 09:27 AM Right/Left-whatever You have the power as a consumer. If you don't like what you see, you can either change the channel, or refuse to buy that publication. Don't give them your ratings.. Quoted post thats a myth. the only way that would work is if everyone stopped watching television and reading the news and stopped spending money while also not going to work. good luck with that. otherwise to say that the news media in this country is left wing is fucking stupid. sure the news must uphold at least some kind of objectivity standard in order to remain relevant and consumable but look at who owns the news channels and the newspapers, not to mention the major publishing houses. these elites are not gonna let anything get outta hand. the mainstream press is not gonna bring the revolution. go watch oreilly and read ann coulter. then shoot yourself in the face. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oh so modern Posted December 1, 2004 Share Posted December 1, 2004 where go conservative graffiti writers come from? one love. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oh so modern Posted December 1, 2004 Share Posted December 1, 2004 sorry last one... above ^^^ excuse the use of "left-wing" and replace with "liberal" to imagine that the left has any kind of influence in mainstream politics is absolutely laughable. perhaps the most glaring example of how far right this nation has slid is the fact that john kerry gets called left wing, as did clinton. karl marx was left wing, emma goldman was left wing. john kerry and clinton (either) are centrists at best. no one seriously considers any real leftist or even progressive goals here. you can sleep sound tonight kids because although gays may be screwing in the streets and kids might be getting blazed in the alley with their african american friends while your wife enjoys her new full time job you can rest assured that tomorrow you will still have private property. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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