LIVERWURST* Posted April 19, 2006 Share Posted April 19, 2006 Let's talk about our political ideals. However, I would like to avoid responses that are arguments - in this case I think we would do better letting people just say their piece. If someone says something you don't agree with or is bullshit, let it go for the sake of what I think could be an interesting collection of opinions. Or if you're going to counter, make it your ideal so at least it stays on subject. I am definitely a socialist in the more modern Swedish model. I believe in a level playing field and certain protections for people. I think wealth begets wealth, which is unfair (I've known too many wealthy people perhaps). Likewise, I do not believe in a communist or extreme variation that denies that if one person works harder he should accept it as simply his responsibility. I prefer a cap on wealth, and a cap on poverty - but a semi-broad distance between the two to encourage novel ideas and reward effort, which would exist with a high minimum wage and a large tax for money over a relatively high amount. I think health care is a right, financial assistance is a right, that college is a right, and that military spending simply encourages itself by forcing other countries to try to compete. I think that gives an idea about my ideas and ideals. Where are you coming from? Can I expand on anything? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Pubes Posted April 19, 2006 Share Posted April 19, 2006 i used to battle it out in ch.0 when there was no crossfire, and i spilled my guts on a whole load of political bullshit. i've come to realize that even though i care, nobody else really gives a fuck and that the world is just so hugely problematic (i consider myself pretty optimistic, even though i probably never ever come off that way when politiking on 12oz) that to even begin laying out some sort of overall ideal that i hold would just spiral out of control once i got into it, merely for the fact the world, myself, and my ideals, are totally contradictory alot of the times, but yet not alot of the times. i have a friend that used to rap off to me how humans know nothing. i couldn't figure it out, i was like 'what the fuck are you talking about dude!'. but now i get it. that said, don't ask me to expand, i don't have the time, energy or will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
!@#$% Posted April 19, 2006 Share Posted April 19, 2006 democracy is all well and good until people get complacent power corrupts, so every government seems to need a check on its power if the people don't do this, no one will i have mostly given up on ideals because i have come to realize how different people are and how incredibly lazy a society can become once it has attained wealth to a point, my ideal would be for humanity to have to live out the nightmares it has created for itself, which of course, is precisely what is going to happen. capitalism has motivated a large portion of our society and alienated many of the rest. i don't think this system is working for everyone. since we're talking ideals let's talk about an ecofriendly, agrarian based, ethical and intelligent society minded by an elected committee of representatives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawood Posted April 20, 2006 Share Posted April 20, 2006 I'm an extremist terrorist fundamentalist islamist nah, but really though. is islamist really a word? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Qawee Posted April 20, 2006 Share Posted April 20, 2006 I don't think it can be, unless there is a word "islamism" I'm a communist, not in the Stalin/Mao/etc. sense. I believe in democratic centralism. I believe government should be made up of workers and farmers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angelofdeath Posted April 20, 2006 Share Posted April 20, 2006 and every one used to get mad at me on here when i called people socialists..........LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angelofdeath Posted April 20, 2006 Share Posted April 20, 2006 I believe in the constitution. I do think the Articles of Confederation were fine though. I despise consolidation and centralism in government. I also despise socialism and its variants and believe they will destroy America, if they havent already. Pure democracy is no good. Capitalism is the only economic system that is morally available, in my opinion. It does not involve government coercion or force, as does socialism. I believe in an extremely limited central state as outlined in the constitution and I believe decentralized power is the key to liberty. The general government should be limited to defense, foreign trade and treaties, coining money, post service, a navy, etc. I am an individualist and am against collective forces. im anti foreign interventionist war. I also believe as a Congressman from Tennessee said in the mid 1800's that a government big enough to give you everything you want, is big enough to take everything you have. so in essence im a conservative, not the looney neo variety. but instead of making things confusing, just call me a libertarian that rejects the LP plank of open borders. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
!@#$% Posted April 20, 2006 Share Posted April 20, 2006 it does not seem to me that everyone is socialist though. fuck it, maybe we are. i think these days i can sum it up by saying i support total annihilation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angelofdeath Posted April 20, 2006 Share Posted April 20, 2006 "....total annihilation" hey. im there. but we might have problems when its time to build another government....;) http://www.libertystickers.com best website ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Qawee Posted April 20, 2006 Share Posted April 20, 2006 My favorites: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
!@#$% Posted April 20, 2006 Share Posted April 20, 2006 total annihilation takes care of all the problems humans die earth lives. haha. i can accept that i have no answers for any of these questions or good ideas and solutions for our problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawood Posted April 21, 2006 Share Posted April 21, 2006 I don't think that the democratic ideologies have evolved from a truly objective process, Most Westerners have arrived at their present secular and humanist state due to negative encounters with their own religious authorities. Consequently, deductions made from Western historical experiences cannot always be applied on a universal basis, especially when considering that Muslims’ material progress went hand in hand with their adherence to religion as is documented in history that whenever the muslims were closest to following Islam , they were raised in rank among the people and whenever they were away from the teachings of Islam (such as this time) they were put low. “And if you were to obey most of those on earth, they would mislead you far away from God’s Way. They follow nothing but conjecture, and they do nothing but guess In my opinion democracy can't guide people to their greater interests as it relies on the opinion of those who move from one kind of supposition to another. For example, in a democratic society, what is deemed correct changes with the ideas of the people so, what was right 10 years ago may be considered wrong now. To illustrate my point, Let's use homosexuality as an example or having children out of wedlock. These things were considered absolutely unacceptable behavior in American society just 40 years ago, but since people have decided thay want to be Gay or they want to have premarital sex , things have changed. My question is how low will we go? What's next? Are we going to legalise and accept incest between mother and son? Father and daughter? Father and son, even? There has to be a line. Some people in America, Some communities draw that line, some people accept divine guidance to know where that line is, but some people continue to spiral downward chasing their lusts and passions. this lack of "knowing the ledge" causes too many problems. If people knew what was beneficial for them and actually acted on it and they knew what was harmful for them and they actually stayed away from it, this society would not have so many problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angelofdeath Posted April 21, 2006 Share Posted April 21, 2006 "To illustrate my point, Let's use homosexuality as an example or having children out of wedlock. These things were considered absolutely unacceptable behavior in American society just 40 years ago, but since people have decided thay want to be Gay or they want to have premarital sex , things have changed. My question is how low will we go? What's next? Are we going to legalise and accept incest between mother and son? Father and daughter? Father and son, even? There has to be a line. Some people in America, Some communities draw that line, some people accept divine guidance to know where that line is, but some people continue to spiral downward chasing their lusts and passions." this is a very good question and line of thought. there isnt a doubt in my mind that our generation will be considered facists in a hundred years for having laws against incest.... for example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Man with the Answers Posted April 22, 2006 Share Posted April 22, 2006 the only thing I believe is that a sunset on Puget sound is as beatiful as a sunrise on Mass Bay... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawood Posted April 22, 2006 Share Posted April 22, 2006 [quote=angelofdeath there isnt a doubt in my mind that our generation will be considered facists in a hundred years for having laws against incest.... for example. that's exactly why I'm saving up my money to buy a house in the hills of morocco with an inground pool and a patio surrounded by my house. A garden of fresh vegetables and fruits. A small farm consisting of a few sheep for meat and enough chickens to breed and eat. 2-3-4 or so wives. One american, one moroccan, one malasian and one african. a private homeschool for my children conducted by my wives. I'll study the quran and indonesian martial arts by day along with an occaisional wildstyle arabic peice in the village complete with a minaret skyline background with a purple , yellow and orange sky. I'll be running an ebay business selling trendy clothes to european rich kids and every euro dollar will be quadrupled or more once it hits the moroccan economy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Man with the Answers Posted April 22, 2006 Share Posted April 22, 2006 that's exactly why I'm saving up my money to buy a house in the hills of "DONEGAL" with an inground pool and a patio surrounded by my house. A garden of fresh vegetables and fruits. A small farm consisting of a few sheep for meat and enough chickens to breed and eat. 2-3-4 or so wives. One american, one moroccan, one malasian and one african. a p"PUBLIC SCHOOL" for my children conducted by my "NEIGHBORS". I'll study "EVERYTHING" and indonesian martial arts by day along with an occaisional wildstyle arabic peice in the village complete with a minaret skyline background with a purple , yellow and orange sky. I'll be running an ebay business selling trendy clothes to european rich kids and every euro dollar will be quadrupled or more once it hits the moroccan economy. see bro, as much as you think we are diffrent, we are the same... I read your stetement and rewrote it, with CAPS, my own dreams...we pretty much have the same shit.. eh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Qawee Posted April 22, 2006 Share Posted April 22, 2006 ^You're going to move to morocco and study the Qu'ran and indonesian martial arts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LIVERWURST* Posted April 22, 2006 Author Share Posted April 22, 2006 Damn, I should have known this would happen... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawood Posted April 22, 2006 Share Posted April 22, 2006 ^You're going to move to morocco and study the Qu'ran and indonesian martial arts? or something like that...... I'm definately not hanging around america to try to keep up with the Joneses and watch leave it to beaver re-runs in between painting my picket fence and complaining about high interest rates whenever up skee'd up on an 8-ball of rico, papa! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawood Posted April 22, 2006 Share Posted April 22, 2006 see bro' date=' as much as you think we are diffrent, we are the same... I read your stetement and rewrote it, with CAPS, my own dreams...we pretty much have the same shit.. eh?[/quote'] ha, ha...that's whats up, man. keep striving. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villain Posted May 1, 2006 Share Posted May 1, 2006 since we're talking ideals let's talk about an ecofriendly, agrarian based, ethical and intelligent society minded by an elected committee of representatives. I like this idea. Take back the earth. I hate to think that I have been struggling my whole life, at the mercy of the economy, when if I had some property and a farm I could be quite wealthy with infinitely renewable resources. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luke skywalker Posted May 1, 2006 Share Posted May 1, 2006 unless you have a multi-million dollar bank account, no one cares about your political ideals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LIVERWURST* Posted May 1, 2006 Author Share Posted May 1, 2006 So your willingness to think and speak is based on whats in the bank? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luke skywalker Posted May 1, 2006 Share Posted May 1, 2006 So your willingness to think and speak is based on whats in the bank? not really. you can think and speak all you want but nobody with the power to make changes is gonna be listening. it's definitely more effective to have substantial wealth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawood Posted May 2, 2006 Share Posted May 2, 2006 that's true, nobody (on a large scale) cares unless you can influence them with your money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
!@#$% Posted May 2, 2006 Share Posted May 2, 2006 well then luke, i guess you should throw in the towel and never come back to crossfire again. it's kind of annoying when people stroll in here to talk shit about stating a viewpoint because they think it's meaningless...but of course then they state their own. so take your own advice., until you can send us all checks to read your posts, we don't care. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luke skywalker Posted May 2, 2006 Share Posted May 2, 2006 you're not someone that i wish to influence with my millions, sorry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
!@#$% Posted May 2, 2006 Share Posted May 2, 2006 yknow, people like jesus, mohammed, lenin, mother theresa and ghandi would've totally benefited from your advice imagine what they would've done had they been able to influence people Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Qawee Posted May 2, 2006 Share Posted May 2, 2006 unless you have a multi-million dollar bank account' date=' no one cares about your political ideals.[/quote'] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
!@#$% Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 luke missed a lot of history classes mang terribly ironic as well... a lot of these tremendously influential, and terribly poor cults-of-personality have founded their whole philosophies on idealistic societies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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