Glacier alarm 'regrettable error': UN climate head

[lord_casek]

The head of the UN's climate science panel R.K. Pachauri addresses the press in New Delhi on January 23. Pachauri said Saturday a doomsday prediction about the fate of Himalayan glaciers was "a regrettable error" but that he would not resign over the blunder.

 

http://www.physorg.com/news183466246.html

[WORDISM45]

Some people understate the importance of alarmist predictions being presented to the public as fact from supposedly scientific organisations like the IPCC. What they don't realise is how much public money is spent and to what extent public policy is directed by what these big climate change institutes claim as fact. It is very scary that what an unqualified professor speculated in a magazine years ago was turned into a 'scientific fact' that was used to influence governmental policy worldwide, and that if someone hadn't noticed the lack of any actual data to back up this claim then those who didn't just accept the claim on face value without a grain of scepticism would still be looked upon as delusional right wing capitalist nutjobs by the climate change hysteria mob.

[lord_casek]

well said, yum

[UPS!]

Yeah this is some shit writing a letter or saying ''whoops'' isnt going to fix.

 

Ive been skeptic of global warming and all that noise since I first started to hear about it. If anything this proves its a sack of shit, and the UN is completly useless

[Soup]

Uh, they're not saying global warming doesn't exist. They're saying the Himalayan glacier isnt going to melt before 2035. It's still a good idea to weatherize your homes/reduce your carbon footprint.

[russell jones]

It proves that they made a possible error. It doesn't disprove the mountains of other evidence from multiple fields of study.

 

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=is-global-warming-a-myth

[russell jones]

More fuel for the fire:

 

http://www.sciencemag.org/cgi/content/full/306/5702/1686

[UPS!]

Yeah that shits all fine and dandy, but here in VA it hasnt snowed the last 3 years, and the last two weeks weve been buried in snow. Global Warming at work

[BraveNewWorld]

lets put in lamens terms for you then....

sun melt ice.

..not you breathing or your dog farting.

[UPS!]

lets put in lamens terms for you then....

sun melt ice.

..not you breathing or your dog farting.

 

Let me neg prop you.

I click nega-props.

..not positive props, cause you speak like an idiot

[russell jones]

Yeah that shits all fine and dandy, but here in VA it hasnt snowed the last 3 years, and the last two weeks weve been buried in snow. Global Warming at work

 

Weather and climate are two different things. The earth is warming, there is no doubt about that, even among those who don't believe humans are the cause. It's also possible that Global Warming could cause more "extreme" weather.

[UPS!]

Weather and climate are two different things. The earth is warming, there is no doubt about that, even among those who don't believe humans are the cause. It's also possible that Global Warming could cause more "extreme" weather.

 

I see ya, you bring up good points but I still gatta disagree on them. i just havent seen solid evidence and I sopose theres somewhat of a bias since my home weather pattern seems to be on my side. The green house gas effect process seems probable but I still dont think that itd make the word all that much hotter and overall global warming is a scam to ween us off oil.

[Mainframe]

Every time a global warming conspiracy tin-foil hat bullshit thread gets thoroughly debunked in crossfire, a new one pops up. I'm tired of explaining why your opinions are laughably naive, so here's this:

 

[UPS!]

Thanks for the posi-props you Cunt.

Facepalm your birth.

 

And why were on the subject, if you believe so much in global warming what are you doing to fix it?

[Soup]

Im not sure why anyone would doubt the existence of global warming. This isnt anything new so you can't just say that it's some government plot made up by the current or last government administration. It's been around since the 1939, and if you want more proof consider this: scientists are basically paid to disagree with one another. There is no personal gain for a scientist to agree with another scientist about global warming except EVERY SINGLE ONE IN THE WORLD DOES.

 

But here's the kicker: if you dont believe in global warming you should still take the exact same steps as everyone to fix it for the following reasons:

 

Lowering your electrical bill and at the same time lowering asthma in inner cities, improving your air quality, and the food you eat. Also, you will be creating a new local job market and helping your local economy/facilities like schools etc.

 

40% of all carbon emissions come from buildings. This starts with their construction, then the power needed to run the building, then retrofitting because the building's falling apart etc. So heres what you can do: weatherize your house, put up solar panels, solar water heating, energy efficient bulbs, all that crap. If you can't afford to do these things, look around for either "green collar jobs" organizations or talk to your gas and electric company. In Oakland, there are community activist groups that work with local solar panel builders and contracters to weatherize impoverished neighborhoods at no cost to them. The whole project is paid for by the money saved on their electrical bill and when it's paid off in 5 years you start reaping all the cost benefits. Some power companies offer the same thing, and if they dont, find your local green collar organization, or if you dont have one, find a different one for help and start canvasing your neighborhood and gathering support so you can ask your power company to do it. Just remember to demand that they keep construction of solar panels locally.

 

Your local power company wants to do this because unless they find ways to reduce everyone's electricity usage, they're going to have to double the number of coal plants in 38 years. Kids with asthma in inner cities is becoming a bigger and bigger issue. It's also affecting farmers and inevitably everything you eat. So the same steps you would take to prevent global warming would prevent air pollution, allergies, asthma, disease, healthy foods and water, save you money, increase the value of your home, create more jobs, create a more sustainable economy, etc.

[lord_casek]

Im not sure why anyone would doubt the existence of global warming. This isnt anything new so you can't just say that it's some government plot made up by the current or last government administration. It's been around since the 1939, and if you want more proof consider this: scientists are basically paid to disagree with one another. There is no personal gain for a scientist to agree with another scientist about global warming except EVERY SINGLE ONE IN THE WORLD DOES.

 

Pretty silly to say that all scientists agree.

[russell jones]

Pretty silly to say that all scientists agree.

 

True... but the consensus that anthropogenic global warming exists is true as well. In other words, the dissenters are thought to have a far weaker case by the scientific community in general. The evidence keeps piling up and leading to similar conclusions. The case for anthropogenic global warming has become stronger and stronger over the years, not weaker.

[Soup]

Pretty silly to say that all scientists agree.

Yes, but considering no scientist is payed to agree with any other scientist, the fact that 90% of earth scientists believe there is a climate change and 80% believe it's man made is a substantial worldly concensus which believes man-made global warming is real.

[Mainframe]

Thanks for the posi-props you Cunt.

 

Right back at you...

 

I'm not here to drop knowledge anymore, just to clown morons like you. :D

[ILOTSMYBRAIN]

Channel Zero is the section above this one.

 

I've posted several articles from people who aren't completely sold on the extent of damage that is being done.

 

The Earth runs in cycles, we are just in between cycles. In the 70's the Earth was going to freeze.

 

We're still good.

 

Believe what you want.

[Soup]

We're still good.

 

Not exactly. Our entire economy and our way of life is still very unsustainable and out of balance with the capacity of our world. Thinking we're good to carry on as we currently are would still destroy the environment and us. Im not saying global warming is our top priority, im saying it's a symptom to a much larger condition thats needs the same steps taken to undo.

[ILOTSMYBRAIN]

Of course they're improvements on how we go about doing things.

 

I doubt anyone will dispute this. However the political agenda that is behind global warming is what I am more disputing.

 

That and the fear mongering. It only hurts.

 

I basically meant that the world didn't freeze over in the 70's like "most" scientists we're leading towards, we're still alive and well we aren't all living in igloo's.

[UPS!]

Right back at you...

 

I'm not here to drop knowledge anymore, just to clown morons like you. :D

 

Becuse its crossfire ill give you a pass, but trust me man you couldnt clown me on my worst day.

 

Back to the subject, you bring up good points Soup and if you want an argument against what you proposed to cut back on our living then youve got the wrong guy. Without a doubt theres some water to the argument, I just have a hard time believing anything the goverment and more importantly the UN gets behind. However believe in it or not the steps to ''reduce'' the effects would be good for everyone to take part in

[UPS!]

Channel Zero is the section above this one.

 

I've posted several articles from people who aren't completely sold on the extent of damage that is being done.

 

The Earth runs in cycles, we are just in between cycles. In the 70's the Earth was going to freeze.

 

We're still good.

 

Believe what you want.

 

This.

 

And the fact there have been Ice ages and other several huge Climate changes on our planet even before Mankind was in existance.

[Soup]

Political agenda? What political agenda? Here's how a global warming political agenda goes:

 

1. Solar panels all along the sun belt and the rooftops of every house

2. Wind farms along the plane states

3. Recycling of methane emissions from cattle farms into ozone-friendly power

4. Enough viable "green" transportation where it's no longer an "alternative."

5. Preservation of natural resources

6. reduction in coal mines and plants

7. Greener uranium substitutes found

 

We'd stop burning fossil fuels, be an entirely self sufficent power grid which would create more local jobs especially in poorer labor communities, air would be cleaner, people would be healthier, energy would be cheaper (which means everything would be cheaper), and life would be better. Why would anyone be against this form of a political agenda that's better for everyone?

 

What possible downside is there? My gas guzzling sportbikes become socially unacceptable? That seems to be the biggest concern for folks against these kinds of changes. If that's the case come out to infineon with me this May and check out the world's first electric sportbike grand prix. Everything that's happening under this "political agenda" is the coolest shit ever. That's all i gotta say.

[ILOTSMYBRAIN]

Stop burning fossil fuels?

 

Really?

 

Check this out...

 

 

That's only the trailer, you can easily find the torrent online. Because he is way more educated than me on matters such as the environment. He will explain why most of those things that you just mentioned are not possible. They sound really nice. I thought so before too.

[Soup]

Dude im an architect and if you understand anything about architecture in the modern age, it should be that it's a humanitarian job. We're environmental designers so all this shit I already know. We as a global economy need to end our oil dependency as well as start preserving other natural resources. All that shit he's talking about in that trailer is everything Im talking about. I dont see how the two contradict.

 

I'll watch the movie right now and explain everything after I see it.

 

 

edit:

 

Ok i found the video and im watching it now but i want to reiterate something first:

 

From the first 3 minutes i've watched thus far there's a lot of petty imagery showing riots which im going to pretend I didnt see because i think it's distracting from the monologue narration. He's talking about "revolution." while you're talking about the hazards of a "political agenda." If you're demanding for the whitehouse to scrap it's policies and infrastructure all-together you're being unrealistic. Politics move slowly, so for obama to even hire a man like Van Jones and begin international affordable green housing competitions, national green jobs initiatives, invest tens of billions of dollars into a green infrastructure, that's as close to a revolution as you're going to see from the whitehouse and if you pay attention to those things like I do, you'll see that it's already created new solar factories all over the nation. Entire communities are joining together to get their cities off the "dirty" grid and all of this goes a long way to end our oil dependence.

 

And I'll be the first to say that current implemented aeroturbine technology isnt up to spec for what we need, but the technology that we do need has already been invented. It's just going to take a while to get the infrastructure up to the level needed to begin implementing those designs. It's going to happen, and the reality is our air quality, arable land and natural resources are going to suffer far more than our economy is if we don't start these changes. So while you may think a green "political agenda" is chasing a pipedream, that's not true. It's just taking a lot more time than it would if more politicians (who listen to communities *hint* *hint*) were more motivated to help our poor communities since they're the first to be affected by anything.

 

If you're really worried about this shit, take initiative. Dont go canvassing your community with this doom and gloom bullshit because that's not gonna fly.People get told what not to do all the time. You have to tell them about something they can do and tie it into something that helps them. Tell them about greening initiatives. My house just got canvassed the other day by a guy who just wanted to reduce my community's electric bill and passed out a URL to a "green the grid" blog. That kind of shit needs to happen more often by people who are passionate and informed enough to do it.

[Mainframe]

 

That's only the trailer, you can easily find the torrent online. Because he is way more educated than me on matters such as the environment.

 

This from the guy trying to dispute scientific consensus...remember that the entire scientific community is more educated than you on these matters.

 

I've posted this before, but try this "Collapse" instead:

 

[Soup]

Im not disputing the movie. The apocalyptic motif is ridiculous but most of the monologue is right (outdated but at the time was right) except for some small things he probably shouldn't've said like:

 

- "There is no thing or things in any combination that can replace oil"

Orange oil, oil from orange peels, can be used to make vulcanized rubber, plastic, resins, paint etc, and not only is it possible, it's already in production. For instance, yokohama has a tire which replaces 80% of its petroleum based products with orange oil.

 

- "Wind and solar are the only things that can really replace coal and oil power plants, but nobody is taking into consideration the cost of transporting electricity from windfarms to the rest of the nation."

He's looking at a current powergrid where all of our powerlines are at least 60 years old. We lose 25% of our electricity just from that and theres people in Obama's environmental advisory comittee trying to figure out an efficient way to replace them. Also, while we're trying to update the grid we can still be building aeroturbines and solar panels locally, installing them locally, and using them locally. Also dont forget the ancient korean method of solar water heating by running the water pipes from the rooftops, through the floorboards to heat the house, then into the shower. It's brilliant. And of course, on top of all this, we need more energy efficient houses, so we need every house weatherized.

 

 

-The whole bit about all the ways oil is required for modern farming

There is nothing that shows the modern way of farming is necessary to the survival of humans, or is there anything showing that everyone needs to pay Wholefoods prices. There are a vast number of ways america's agracultural industry is going green, and a vast number of ways that the definition of "going green" gets better and better. Small, family ran farms making products without the use any petroleum products are still thriving in today's economy and more will pop up in time. It's really just that old overused phrase, "Act locally, think globally."

 

 

and then the movie goes onto other things which i dont really want to discuss in this thread because it'll derail this discussion onto the concept of fiat currencies banking, debt etc. There's plenty of other threads for that so I'll reserve my thoughts on that.

 

Finally the ending:

 

A lot of his ideas are good. I dont really care for his wording because it makes it sound pretentious and apocalyptic.

 

Let me go over a couple of the ideas that im rather excited about:

 

Local farming:

Urban areas are the most environmentally friendly and efficent areas PER CAPITA than anywhere on the planet, so this concept of being green and living on the land in bumfuckistan suburbia is a farce. Cities need to think compact, locally, and preserve their green areas as much as possible. Some models to look at are Amsterdam where nobody likes to live in highrises, but they've successfully prevented the growth of suburbia and preserved much of their arable land. Everything Rembrant painted still exists 2 miles from the city center.

 

If you look at china where everybody is moving into cities they need serious help protecting their arable land. One idea from one of the main architects over there is to create residential/commercial areas where you have commercial on the ground level, residential on the 2nd to 4th floor, then all the arable land is on top. (

)

 

Basically what im trying to say is nothing he's saying isnt already of top priority for the president, international city planners, architects, etc. Not ALL city planners and architects, but a lot of them.

[russell jones]

This from the guy trying to dispute scientific consensus...remember that the entire scientific community is more educated than you on these matters.

 

I've posted this before, but try this "Collapse" instead:

 

 

Diamond is amazing. I read Guns, Germs and Steel and am looking forward to this one. No other author that I know of takes on such mammoth multi-disciplinary projects and succeeds like Diamond.