Madrid train blast

[aPirate]

a thoroughly interesting thread. thanks to all the contributors.

 

 

the bombings in madrid heavily sadden me. as do those in iraq. a number of issues have been raised in the thread that i feel compelled to address and i hope my input will inspire meaningful debate.

 

as a term, 'the war of terror', does not sit well with me. it seems to embody many aspects that are resulting in our current global terrorist activity. the term cleverly polarizes war and terror, where as already alluded by villain, both share violence on such horrific scale that terror is ensuing regardless of motivation. the polarization also denies much of the historic and political complexity, as in we now have the good vs. the bad. when really, as this is thread itself is testament, attempting to define good violence and good death is a rather difficult undertaking. perhaps effective in a country who engaged in the most international military aggression of the late century, the term appeals to an american sensibility, the very same that rationalizes such aggression with belief in a moral high ground. i can not foresee how the scale of global violence will decline if such terminology truly describes the western worlds attempt to forge peace.

 

perhaps a trivial concern in the sad circumstance, but i'm interested in how others perceive the madrid bombings will affect graffiti and it's existence on public transport. as much of graffiti relies upon the penetrability of train/tram/freight yards,

• a)how long do you think such access will remain viable if terrorists continue to use such vehicles

• b)would you be prepared to jeopardise this aspect of graffiti for greater commuter security?

 

p.s KaBar2, much of your argument in the last post is quite sound and consequently negates your main point. can you see similarities in what you find unacceptable regarding religion and the rights of the individual, and those actions of western countries and the rights of individual nations?

[KaBar2]

We Lost Several Replies Here

 

Too bad---there was a lot of good stuff on this thread.

 

To jump-start this discussion again, I don't see how the sound reasoning of my last post negates anything. Saddam Hussein, whom we "created" as a foil against Iran, over twenty years ago, is a horrible, brutal, murderous monster. The U.S. government has probably been trying to figure out a way to put the genie back in the bottle ever since the end of the 8-year-long Iran-Iraq War. I think President Bush held Saddam personally responsible for the assassination attempt upon his father's life during that trip to the Middle East. Even Bill Clinton hated Saddam, it's just that there wasn't that much that he could do.

 

Iraq should have been dealt with decisively in 1991. When I found out that George H.W. Bush cut a deal with Saudi Arabia to save Arab face (they did not want any major Middle Eastern city invaded and conquered by "infidels") I was highly pissed. Even in Kuwait, where we SAVED THEIR BUNNY RABBIT ASSES, they insisted that Saudi forces enter Kuwait City first. So, after the Allied forces (read "U.S. and UK") smashed their way through Iraqi defenses and sent the Iraqis scurrying like rats, they then halted on the outskirts of Kuwait City, and the pussified Saudis, who had not done any significant fighting whatsoever, drove into the city like conquering heroes. While the Iraqis were in Kuwait, they robbed and raped and murdered people by the hundreds. Middle Eastern TV never mentioned that. The U.S. forces did ALL the heavy lifting. Middle Eastern TV never mentioned that. They hailed the Saudi poseurs as if they had driven out the Iraqis with just a little U.S. help.

 

This shit in Fallujah is more of the same arrogant shit. In my opinion, the U.S. Marines ought to FLATTEN the fucking place as an object lesson to all the fascist motherfuckers who want to resist a legitimate, democratic, constitutional government. They say that 4 out of 5 people in Fallujah support the insurgents. Fine. The ones that don't better get the fuck out of there in a hurry, because I got a feeling the place is about to get hosed down in a big way. The Marines have the place surrounded. If the Iraqis had any sense, they would stop fucking around and get cooperative.

 

I predict the Marines will cut the place in several slices with fixed-wing air support and helicopter gunships, and then crush resistance in each piece of the pie, one by one, with tanks, artillery and ground troops. This is what the Marines do best. They have been begging the government to take the gloves off for a long time. The Iraqi insurgents in Fallujah ought to catch a clue, because they are about to be eradicated.

 

Riding around in thin-skinned vehicles getting shot up piecemeal is not the Marine Corps way of doing things. They are about annihilation of the enemy, not "peacekeeping." And they have a serious grudge about the four American contract security guys (read "mercenaries") killed last week. The rank-and-file Marines identify strongly with those four security contractors. And now it's time for some payback.

[AHER]

Re: We Lost Several Replies Here

 

Too bad---there was a lot of good stuff on this thread.

 

To jump-start this discussion again, I don't see how the sound reasoning of my last post negates anything. Saddam Hussein, whom we "created" as a foil against Iran, over twenty years ago, is a horrible, brutal, murderous monster. The U.S. government has probably been trying to figure out a way to put the genie back in the bottle ever since the end of the 8-year-long Iran-Iraq War. I think President Bush held Saddam personally responsible for the assassination attempt upon his father's life during that trip to the Middle East. Even Bill Clinton hated Saddam, it's just that there wasn't that much that he could do.

 

Iraq should have been dealt with decisively in 1991. When I found out that George H.W. Bush cut a deal with Saudi Arabia to save Arab face (they did not want any major Middle Eastern city invaded and conquered by "infidels") I was highly pissed. Even in Kuwait, where we SAVED THEIR BUNNY RABBIT ASSES, they insisted that Saudi forces enter Kuwait City first. So, after the Allied forces (read "U.S. and UK") smashed their way through Iraqi defenses and sent the Iraqis scurrying like rats, they then halted on the outskirts of Kuwait City, and the pussified Saudis, who had not done any significant fighting whatsoever, drove into the city like conquering heroes. While the Iraqis were in Kuwait, they robbed and raped and murdered people by the hundreds. Middle Eastern TV never mentioned that. The U.S. forces did ALL the heavy lifting. Middle Eastern TV never mentioned that. They hailed the Saudi poseurs as if they had driven out the Iraqis with just a little U.S. help.

 

This shit in Fallujah is more of the same arrogant shit. In my opinion, the U.S. Marines ought to FLATTEN the fucking place as an object lesson to all the fascist motherfuckers who want to resist a legitimate, democratic, constitutional government. They say that 4 out of 5 people in Fallujah support the insurgents. Fine. The ones that don't better get the fuck out of there in a hurry, because I got a feeling the place is about to get hosed down in a big way. The Marines have the place surrounded. If the Iraqis had any sense, they would stop fucking around and get cooperative.

 

I predict the Marines will cut the place in several slices with fixed-wing air support and helicopter gunships, and then crush resistance in each piece of the pie, one by one, with tanks, artillery and ground troops. This is what the Marines do best. They have been begging the government to take the gloves off for a long time. The Iraqi insurgents in Fallujah ought to catch a clue, because they are about to be eradicated.

 

Riding around in thin-skinned vehicles getting shot up piecemeal is not the Marine Corps way of doing things. They are about annihilation of the enemy, not "peacekeeping." And they have a serious grudge about the four American contract security guys (read "mercenaries") killed last week. The rank-and-file Marines identify strongly with those four security contractors. And now it's time for some payback.

 

Shut it n get flicks on

[AHER]

Re: We Lost Several Replies Here

 

Shut it n get flicks on

 

woops back 2 ma own thread sorrryyyyyyyyy!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Stevo_Mansfield]

LMFAO put flicks on...sick fook