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vendalism

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    NYC Subways - the good stuff-Best thread on 12 oz!

    in Metal Heads

    Posted

    Re: NYC Subways - the good stuff

     

    From the Dondi book- " For the shoot, Ahearn was granted wage of the yard ( m yard) and permission to spray on one broken subway car. When LEE declined to be filmed inside the yard, Ahearn hired Dondi to double for him. Shrouded in a doo-rag, he was filmed entering the yard, hitting one of the trains parked there, and getting chased by two d's(one of whom was played by IZ THE WIZ). Later, a realistic prop train was constructed in a sound stage and Dondi again doubling as Zoro,executed a Zoro portrait. On his own, Dondi created the Wild Style whole car. His amazing car appeared in the film, and set the aesthetic tempo for the entire production. "

     

    If you look at the Wild Style Car itself it's on an IRT train. I have Henry Chalfant and Martha Cooper shots of this car . It was most def not done in the Fresh Pond Yard where most of the scenes in the beginning of this movie are shot.

    IRT cars and BMT cars dont mix up in any yards except for 207th , Bedford Park and CI yards. The photos I have of this car are all shot in the Bronx. I will bet money that car was done on the 2&5's at either New Lots or Utica with no permission granted. Most likely the action shots were done in Fresh Pond but the actual car was not painted there.

     

    As for "Dreams Don't Die" I know at least the yellow and black "King 65" piece by Dondi was done on a scrap train in Fresh Pond because before I had not even had a tag name when my brother took me into a scrap yard off Linden Blvd in East NY which is now a maintaince yard for work trains. At the time in 1983 this yard was where they scrapped trains prior to the Sunset Park yard. They torched the trains in half and I saw that car cut in half laying on its side. My bro has pics of it. Strider & Web painted these scrap trains right before they landed in there.

    Half the M Yard prior to that was full of what I call "Dummy" trains. Scrap trains...you can even see pics of this time period on NYCsubway.org from that era if you go into the Fresh Pond Yard M Yard section Those trains had some real vintage 70's BMT graff. Early Iz, Uncle John & Vinny & TOP crew type shit.

     

    and on one more note there was one non graff related story flick filmed in there that had some good graff scenes...Its called " A Stranger Is Watching" Anyone remember that?

    Also filmed in the M Yard...

    NYC Subways - the good stuff-Best thread on 12 oz!

    in Metal Heads

    Posted

    Re: NYC Subways - the good stuff

     

    ven... much respect to you and all (i still got that great IGT with your letter in it), but i think you're wrong about the freight scene... there's a lot of great people doing a lot of work that stretches the boundaries. but at the same time, i believe fr8s really have to be dealt with different than walls. and there's a lot to be said for something that is readable and tight in a classic style for a train that might pass thru at 50 mph or someone might see rolling by a highway. that aspect of freights is one of the major things that's different that subways that people need to take into account... also, not all freight spots are as chill as all that. there's been periods of time when people did all kinds of inventive, different styles on freights, so much so that there's was a response against unreadable "spaghetti" pieces that's caused a trend towards straighter letters.. we're on that end of the cycle right now....

     

    in addition, what you see a lot with freights is a lot of kids who come from spots that don't have a graff tradition... they don't learn, don't see skills from others, but they come to freights and pick it up as they go along.... i mean, NY is a hell of a spoiler (or was) as a scene to come out of, with so many influences out there. with the freights, some kids who are part of it didn't have that, but they drew ideas from somewhere else, and then learned to chase numbers, just to do as much as they can. it's different from how a lot of us from graff-historic areas came up and it ends up with different outcomes. that variety is a good thing in the end, but confusing at times

    hell, i look at it like this... you do your thing for a while, and work at it and style evolves. if you keep pushing yourself, then once you develop a style, it keeps evolving if you keep at it. and there's definitely kids who got style out there.

     

     

     

    oh yeah, and blame Harry Belafonte and Hollywood for Beat Street!! if it wasn't for the music, that movie would be crap!

     

     

    You may be quite suprised how up I am on the freight scene of now and who does what. Their are definetly freight writers outside of the old school NYC crew right now painting frieghts whose work I respect. Writers like Heat, Myth , Isto , Lead , Seaz , Much , Sigh , ICH all do exceptional work in my opinion. The difference though is most writers do not take the time to do full on productions like you see here on the subways. Have you ever seen those Heat & Awe cars with the Charlie Brown characters on some reefers from a few years ago. That to me is proper graff 101. You just see a very limted amount of graff on freights like that. You can say what you want about trains going by at 50 MPH but most of the freight shots people post on threads here are taken at sidings or yards where the trains are standing still.

    You say simple styles are what writers are into freight wise but yet go into the Kwest thread on here and see how many freight writers consider him god's gift to the freight scene because the pieces he does are the exact opposite of simple. Why is that? It's obviously because the effort in detail he puts into his work. How many other writers put that much effort into their work other then the names I mentioned above and maybe another dozen or so outside that?

     

     

    As for kids not knowing or learnng style because they live in some rural area. They are on the internet posting their pics. So it's not like they are living in a secluded world. It's 2008 not 1988.

    The world is at your finger tips no matter where you are these days.

    NYC Subways - the good stuff-Best thread on 12 oz!

    in Metal Heads

    Posted

    Re: NYC Subways - the good stuff

     

    Amazing thread. It's strange how graffiti, style wise/color combos, never progressed past the old school stuff. These trains are incredible. New stuff these days holds nothing to it.

     

    I feel graff has progressed plenty as far as technique and style is concerned especially when it comes to the old school NYC writers who have been in the game for 20-25 years plus. Writers like Doc , Wane , Reas , Part , T-Kid , Pure , and everyone else who was great then got even much better now. The difference though is legal vs illegal. Having the time to paint legal walls has surely advanced the movement stylistically. Along with supplies that are now made for writers to paint with.

     

    Unfortunately what does not progress much style wise in graffiti is the freight scene. Most freight sidings or yards especially the ones in the boondocks are so chill to paint that its almost like painting in a legal environment. You can spend hours on end in some of these places.

    Yet so little of freight graffiti can even compare to what went down 25 years ago on subways, let alone what is being done on legal walls in NYC now. This part I don't get. Quality is just as important as quantity.

    NYC Subways - the good stuff-Best thread on 12 oz!

    in Metal Heads

    Posted

    Re: NYC Subways - the good stuff

     

    ^^^^Correct it was done by stage artists. That car actually ran for quite sometime too. It was done in the Fresh Pond "M" Yard. Wild Style and Dreams Dont Die were also filmed at Fresh Pond. Those two movies were filmed at least a year and half earlier when the yard was half full of scrap trains. Those trains were all scrapped by 1983. So I guess the MTA just let them paint an in service train.

    Most of the action scenes shot in Wildstyle were done in an around scrapped trains in Fresh Pond and and the same with Dreams Dont Die. So mosto f those cars didnt run. I'm not sure what the deal was with the "Wild Style" piece with the Zorro character next to it done by Dondi on the IRT's was though. I know that one ran. I wonder if it was painted with legal permission or not for the movie.

    NYC Subways - the good stuff-Best thread on 12 oz!

    in Metal Heads

    Posted

    Re: NYC Subways - the good stuff

     

    That And Arab on the BMT flats 2 posts above are definetly my shots. Damn those photos went through some serious 10 generation macro-versions. That "And" by Magoo is by far one of my top 10 favorite pieces on a train ever. That car was done on the Franklin Ave Shuttle. It didnt run very long. The photos were taken in Coney Island yard right before it headed over to the scrapyard. They would take off certain parts to use for other cars which is why some of the windows are missing before sending them to the scrapper.

    NYC Subways - the good stuff-Best thread on 12 oz!

    in Metal Heads

    Posted

    Re: NYC Subways - the good stuff

     

    8-2-00_elf_aid.jpg

    elf and aid. nice, and the 3C throw-up in between.

    img987.jpg

    maybe gos of graf can answer this. is the jamike piece on this car by JAM2 i see one of his classic vertical tags in the window from the inside- never knew he did burners(if thats him)

    AND that ADAM X video is fresh bro. one time i was in a party under the whitestone br. in the bx and ADAM X was on and stopped the set to talk some wild shit about smoking dust as i was dusted holding on to people as to not float to the ceiling. haha

     

     

    Knowing Adam very , very well(LOL) he was probably telling all you crazy dustheads to keep the peace. Some crazy shit went down at some of those Whitestone bridge parties.

     

    Thanks for peeping the video.

    NYC Subways - the good stuff-Best thread on 12 oz!

    in Metal Heads

    Posted

    Re: NYC Subways - the good stuff

     

    I never ever saw or heard about that Serve , Dune , Kaze car and I was benching IRT'S almost daily in the Bronx in 85. I have to believe that car never ran in service. Word spread quick about cars at East Tremont. I remember a couple other cars that only ran a day or two and then disappeared into oblivion on the 2's & 5's. Actually one was a Bio with a white outline and if I remember correctly a dark blue cloud, on the next car was an unfinished Raz wholecar . I saw it once underground at Atlantic Ave and no one else in the Bronx I know had flicked it. Another thing was that some cars being painted in the Ghost Yard in Brooklyn around 84 were winding up in the Scrap Yard without ever running in service. The Madseen window down with the Fed Purple cloud on a white car was one of them.

    NYC Subways - the good stuff-Best thread on 12 oz!

    in Metal Heads

    Posted

    Re: NYC Subways - the good stuff

     

    1000.jpg

     

    the first time i rode the 2s and 5s i saw this piece. it was either 1985 or 6.

    i remember seeing this and a tenth piece at atlantic. Freshman year at Midwood High.

     

    memory lane ~

     

    Rac 7 was definetly an underated writer. He had some seriously nasty blends and designs.

    I always dug his artwrok. Cat deserves more props.

    NYC Subways - the good stuff-Best thread on 12 oz!

    in Metal Heads

    Posted

    Re: NYC Subways - the good stuff

     

    Me and Elf used to pop the Rite Aid on White Plains Road easily for 10-15 packages of disc film, we had to use that shop up on 228th? (I think) for developing, it was closer than Canal and it wasn't too bad on our teen wallets...

    You know we just missed each other back in the day, I pieced with your peeps and you pieced with my peeps but we can still relate..funny too I saw you painted with my boy Chief across the ocean..small world

    aok ris mpc...

     

     

    I never used that disc film. That was definetly a Cav's special. LOL. I used 110 until 1985. Then I got one of those Minolta Freedom 35 automatic jammies. They were actually pretty cheap back then. Not as cheap as them $10 Keystone 110 cameras but cheap enough to get one for a B-day present. That disc film you can't do much with when it comes to enlarging the photo size. It just gets real blurry...and just trying to find a place to make those negatives out nowadays is a job in itself.

     

    Suprisingly we never crossed paths back then. I rolled pretty hard in the Bronx from late 84-86.

    Then by 86 I started painting BMT's with Mesh and Reas, so I was doing more painting and more benching on the BMT's for our shit . I still would come and bench on Tremont every now and then till the very end of it all.

     

    Yeah Chief is mad cool. I had a blast hanging with him and the Italy crew.

    NYC Subways - the good stuff-Best thread on 12 oz!

    in Metal Heads

    Posted

    Re: NYC Subways - the good stuff

     

    I hear ya..

    I say it all the time the film was easy to rack it was the developing that kept us from taking many more flicks... The 110's and my personal tool "the Kodak Disc" were the best of the times..I didn't have a 35mm until mid '88 and by then it was too late.. That fucking disc lasted so long after that too lol...

     

     

    I always found film very hard to rack up in the city itself. It was almost laways behind the counter on most shops. Once I had access to people with cars to go racking out to LI, NJ and upstate I was good to go. That was not until 1987 though. Previous to that I had to pay for film much of the time but if I was broke as a mofo I would do the grab and run on them outside stands on Canal St. I'd have half a dozen Chinese motherfuckers chasing me. So I was limited with photographing shit especially when alot more cooler shit was running in 84-85. I would of love to had flicked more throwups and insides back then. I especially regret not flicking them huge ass end to end Retardo Green Jon 156 throwups on the ridgies. A 10 car set of that shit would pull in and you could clearly see it coming from two stations away. I never see anyone with flicks of that shit either.

     

    Then developing was a whole other thing. One time me and Wane pulled the master scam at the one hour developing store on Canal St. We bootlegged the free 10 free reprint coupons that came when ever you developed a roll a film. I remember us walking out of there with hunudreds of photos for free for weeks at a time. Finally they caught on but we had other scams running too. I remember one time Ghost & I making hundreds of photos in a shop in Brooklyn. We went back and Ghost did a snatch and run. Im outside on a bike. He passes them to me and I ride off. We meet up a few blocks away. Funny shit. We were as crazy about flicks as we were about painting.

    NYC Subways - the good stuff-Best thread on 12 oz!

    in Metal Heads

    Posted

    Re: NYC Subways - the good stuff

     

    No disrespect taken at all. I'm just jealous we didnt have all this digital technology back in the day because their was so much more I wish I could of documented. I dont really care to much that some of my flicks are out there. I would just like to get photo credits when they are posted. The problem is my photos have gone threw so many hands that I dont think most people know the original source of the photos. So like I said above "It is what is"

     

    Lets keep it moving in here...who is going to bust out the rare 110, 126 disc film pic stash out of the closet? Hahahahaa

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