God exists. Prove me wrong.

[Dirty_habiT]

3 minutes ago, abrasivesaint said:

Neither am I, and if you believe you KNOW what happens, i’m happy for ya.
 

I believe it will be a lot of nothing, I won’t know. Some people who have had near death experiences make claims of visions of God. My near death experience from bleeding out on the side of the road from a severed artery was a whole lot of nothingness, i didn’t know i was unconscious.. And if it's a whole lot of nothingness when i’m dead, i fear not, for i won’t know. 

 

Do i know this as a certainty? Absolutely not. Just like i don’t think it can be said God and an afterlife exists as a certainty. 

 

 

I say "know" what happens, but I cannot pinpoint specific details about my future.  I'm just referring to the ultimate goal for my life.

 

I think not everyone has near death experiences even if they are near death.  What you experienced (or "didn't experience") could be easily attributed to the fact that it wasn't your time. 

 

Have you considered that you were "helped" by being unconscious during this event vs. writhing in pain until help arrived?  I didn't consider that angle until just now reading your post but that very well is something that people could call a blessing in disguise.  Can I prove it?  Of course not.

 

Being uncertain is human nature.  I believe that is how science was created.

 

One of the big points I've been trying to make is that there isn't much problem in believing God exists if he doesn't vs. not believing in him if he does exist.  Much less painful to go one way vs. the other.  Faith doesn't have to be some huge time commitment as much as it's just an acknowledgment that you're just a dude here sharing this place with his Children, trying to live the best life you can for yourself and for others.

[where]

1 minute ago, abrasivesaint said:

There’s a lot of Jihadi’s in the Middle East who feel the same way.. 
There were a lot of Crusaders who felt the same way..

 

If you believe you have the right to do “what you feel is right in the moment” in the name of your God, then you have a lot more in common with a Jihadi than you may want to believe hombre. 

 

you trying to imply meaning and that i dont already know this shit just makes you look a certain way and we were trying to have a dialogue Im not going to mix words I dont seek conflict but if someone disrespected god in my presence i would put hands on that person, the setting would determine if i actually touched them but there would be an altering of the vibe thats for sure 

[Tails0nE]

But wouldn't that contradict the whole "love thy neighbor" concept..?

[abrasivesaint]

1 minute ago, where said:

you trying to imply meaning and that i dont already know this shit just makes you look a certain way

What am i implying, and what type of way do i look?

 

I think what i said was pretty clear, but if not, let me be clear. If you think it is acceptable to commit in act of violence in the name of your God, then you share this same belief with Jihadi terrorists. 

 

 

1 minute ago, where said:

 

and we were trying to have a dialogue Im not going to mix words I dont seek conflict but if someone disrespected god in my presence i would put hands on that person, the setting would determine if i actually touched them but there would be an altering of the vibe thats for sure 

Define disrespect, because i’ve had no problem saying what i’ve said here to anyone in real life, as i have, as they continued to scream at me that i was going to burn in hell. 

[abrasivesaint]

If God is responsible for the creation of humankind, but does not have the ability to create humankind without pedos, rapists, murderers, and so forth, then God sounds like a weak ass programmer to me and we should hire a new one.
 

If God intentionally created pedos, rapists, murderers and so forth, then i have issues with the sick fuck, and we should hire a new one. 
 

If it is not God’s responsibility for the errors in humankind, then it sounds like we are nothing more than play things to be discarded. Which leads me to believe God has no concern for my well being. 

It’s reasons like these, that i have no faith in such a being. 

Edited May 17, 2021 by abrasivesaint

[where]

11 minutes ago, abrasivesaint said:

If God is responsible for the creation of humankind, but does not have the ability to create humankind without pedos, rapists, murderers, and so forth, then God sounds like a weak ass programmer to me and we should hire a new one.
 

If God intentionally created pedos, rapists, murderers and so forth, then i have issues with the sick fuck, and we should hire a new one. 
 

If it is not God’s responsibility for the errors in humankind, then it sounds like we are nothing more than play things to be discarded. Which leads me to believe God has no concern for my well being. 

It’s reasons like these, that i have no faith in such a being. 

I love simple people, they come in all shapes and sizes, have a good one.

[abrasivesaint]

2 hours ago, Kults said:

 

its fine to be an atheist but do you really wanna double down on shit like this..?

 

Gonna be a pretty big matzah ball hangin out if you're wrong

Just to come back for this because i sort of had to move right by it, i feel this same way about climate change. Do i know if it’s fact? Nope. But i don't think we should be stubborn ass creatures when we can work on finding better ways to potentially avoid it. 
 

Further, how am I supposed to know that the Christian God i was told to believe is the “one true” God? Because my parents forced me into that particular faith? Well they also lied to me about Santa Claus. What if that big matzah ball turned out because i didn’t believe in Zeus? 
 

There’s various religions throughout human history that have believed in various gods. I don’t put my faith in any of them. 

Edited May 17, 2021 by abrasivesaint

[abrasivesaint]

2 minutes ago, where said:

I love simple people, they come in all shapes and sizes, have a good one.

You can just admit you don’t have an answers for me, and that you still choose to believe in your god because you’d rather believe than risk not believing, as @Dirty_habiThas stated. 

[Dirty_habiT]

21 minutes ago, abrasivesaint said:

Just to come back for this because i sort of had to move right by it, i feel this same way about climate change. Do i know if it’s fact? Nope. But i don't think we should be stubborn ass creatures when we can work to finding better ways to potentially avoid it. 
 

Further, how am I supposed to know that the Christian God i was told to believe is the “one true” God? Because my parents forced me into that particular faith? Well they also lied to me about Santa Claus. What if that big matzah ball turned out because i didn’t believe in Zeus? 
 

There’s various religions throughout human history that have believed in various gods. I don’t put my faith in any of them. 

The flaw in this is that your parents didn't later tell you that religion wasn't true. Santa is fun as a child. Belief in God cannot be equated to it. 

[Tails0nE]

38 minutes ago, abrasivesaint said:

If God is responsible for the creation of humankind, but does not have the ability to create humankind without pedos, rapists, murderers, and so forth, then God sounds like a weak ass programmer to me and we should hire a new one.
 

If God intentionally created pedos, rapists, murderers and so forth, then i have issues with the sick fuck, and we should hire a new one. 
 

If it is not God’s responsibility for the errors in humankind, then it sounds like we are nothing more than play things to be discarded. Which leads me to believe God has no concern for my well being. 

It’s reasons like these, that i have no faith in such a being. 

 

I don't think god purposely creates people like that.. he gives people the free will to do what they want if that wasn't the case we wouldn't be on here talking about getting handjobs from flaming skeletons.. but if you bring up the existence of god you gotta also bring in the devil as well and the temptation he gives people on the daily basis.. if there's an absolute good then there's gotta be an absolute evil as well.. you know ying and yang or as above so below or whatever.. ya know..?

[where]

the creation started evolution that created humans, we chose to be better and not animals, even if you dont try to ascribe meaning to that it is a thing 

[where]

the trinity is better evidence for god than any evidence anyone has against god

[Dirty_habiT]

1 hour ago, Tails0nE said:

But wouldn't that contradict the whole "love thy neighbor" concept..?

God is vengeful. I would argue that someone saying something that has the intention to inflame is not very neighborly. 
 

Disrespecting God in my presence would draw my ire as well. I may not choose to enact violence but I would play it by ear. It's definitely a reason to not continue interacting with an individual.  I'd say physical violence would be justified only in the most extreme situation. 
 

Of course this doesn't discourage the idea of unattributable or unjustified violence.  Could catch an ass beating just "on principal" too and there's nothing necessarily wrong with that. 
 

Some people have to learn to control their mouth in public the hard way. I think nowadays they get called Karen a lot if they're female. 

[Dark_Knight]

17 minutes ago, where said:

the creation started evolution that created humans, we chose to be better and not animals, even if you dont try to ascribe meaning to that it is a thing 

dogs are whales

[where]

Just now, Dark_Knight said:

dogs are whales

technically, yea 

[Tails0nE]

I can agree that the slander would be considered not neighborly and get why it can be perceived as such but I don't agree of the potentiality to be catching hands off of someone's, most likely very ignorant, opinion on the subject.. cause that can still be considered equally not neighborly as well even if they do annoy the fuck out of you to the extreme.. but that's when I think the free will comes into play to be able to hone in on your emotions pull back the reigns a bit and walk away and disconnect yourself from that person entirely as you said now that I can agree on.. but, easier said than done for sure.. like if you wanna think or behave a certain way kudos but I don't want nothing to do with ya.. but I feel the same way people need to watch their mouths in public is the same way people need to watch the hands being giveth, BUT, granted there are indeed times were the fade is justifiable.. just matters on the circumstances there'd be too many variables to pinpoint if the ass eating would be considered right or wrong so that would solely depend on the situation at hand..

 

Also if someone was inflaming god's name and his existence who are we to be the ones to react in god's name because of such..? 

[Kults]

3 minutes ago, Tails0nE said:

Also if someone was inflaming god's name and his existence who are we to be the ones to react in god's name because of such..? 

 

 

 

[abrasivesaint]

1 hour ago, Tails0nE said:

 

I don't think god purposely creates people like that.. he gives people the free will to do what they want if that wasn't the case we wouldn't be on here talking about getting handjobs from flaming skeletons.. but if you bring up the existence of god you gotta also bring in the devil as well and the temptation he gives people on the daily basis.. if there's an absolute good then there's gotta be an absolute evil as well.. you know ying and yang or as above so below or whatever.. ya know..?

 

I hear you. and fair points. A devil naturally comes into the conversation in terms of many beliefs of God. However, if a God is the creator of humankind, then i believe that God must take responsibility for the shortcomings of his creations, not blame a devil or the product for exploitation of it’s flaws. If we are a creation that can not be adjusted, then so be it, we are flawed. I have hard time believing such a supreme being could create something so flawed and be like “well, i tried,” and i’m supposed to devote my life to their will.
 

I can’t say i simply believe in the idea of ying and yang as an absolute either. That because one may exist, that the other must as well. I think it often can appear or feel that way because we tend to find or look for meaning in just about everything because Nihilism is a mother fucker. 

Edited May 17, 2021 by abrasivesaint

[Tails0nE]

I get where you're coming from it's pretty logical so I feel you on that.. but I also don't think he/she/or whatever up there has the kind of "meh.. well at least I tried oh well.." kind of attitude when it comes to hoomanz.. the average mind is very moldable and easy to manipulate I mean look at everything that's transpired this year.. so I don't think it's too far fetched to say that some evil deity or something supernatural out there can and does manipulate people and their minds to act out in an evil manner to expose the flaws in said creation and use them to their bidding.. kind of like Constantine where they say the war between heaven and hell is basically who can influence humans more.. they can't directly touch or interact with them it's more so mental manipulation or whatever.. kind of crazy thought yeah but who knows idk I just thought about it as I'm typing this out now.. shout out my boy Keanu..

 

But yeah I'm not religious by any means whatsoever just throwing out thoughts on the subject since Ive been pretty baked most of the day.. interesting topic and viewpoints once you take away the emotion and connection..

[Dirty_habiT]

I think for someone who "isn't sure" you've conveyed your thoughts very intelligently.

[mr.yuck]

I just read through this entire thread and came to a new conclusion. I had never entertained that God was real let alone Jesus Christ. I now have a new working theory that Jesus Christ is a time traveler from the future. He pops up every couple thousand years when the chips are down to refresh his story for the times.

[Joker]

Five pages. Five pages debating this tired argument. 

 

You believe in God and creation? Hooray!! You go and do your thing. You believe in the Big Bang thing? Yippee for you!! You go and do your thing. I cannot figure out why this argument continues to pop up when the outcome is always... always the same. You believe, you debated, but didn't change the non-believer's mind - or - you don't believe, you debated, but didn't change the believer's mind. Instead you spent five pages having the same argument with no outcome. Check back here in ten years for the same thread to be started with the same argument, same outcome.

 

God is what you want God to be, real or not. God is either creation to you, or a character in Family Guy. You either believe in God or you don't. End of conversation. Right? I cannot understand why this is so hard. 

[misteraven]

19 minutes ago, Joker said:

Five pages. Five pages debating this tired argument. 

 

You believe in God and creation? Hooray!! You go and do your thing. You believe in the Big Bang thing? Yippee for you!! You go and do your thing. I cannot figure out why this argument continues to pop up when the outcome is always... always the same. You believe, you debated, but didn't change the non-believer's mind - or - you don't believe, you debated, but didn't change the believer's mind. Instead you spent five pages having the same argument with no outcome. Check back here in ten years for the same thread to be started with the same argument, same outcome.

 

God is what you want God to be, real or not. God is either creation to you, or a character in Family Guy. You either believe in God or you don't. End of conversation. Right? I cannot understand why this is so hard. 

 

Dude, do you know how to make Krink? Asking for a friend.

[mr.yuck]

@Jokernot for nothin homie, but I think I have a pretty fresh new take on Jesus. 

[Dirty_habiT]

I understand, that sentiment @Joker.  I think everyone here still has the same relationship they did before this thread was created.  I could be ignorant but I'm not going to act any differently towards anyone on this site just because they believe or don't believe.  I have a better idea of who shares a common idea about the subject now though.

 

Sometimes it's better to not polarize yourself but in this case I think it's ok.  I bet there are a ton of religious graffiti writers.  In fact the two guys that I started painting freights with in the mid 2000s were good friends from a Catholic school.  They're great friends to this day.

 

On another side of that token, 2 brothers from Queens taught me everything I basically know about letter structure and where to begin your graffiti journey.  Those two brothers were/are Muslim.  Also, both great dudes.

 

I do remember going to their house one time and their very Muslim non English speaking mother was like super fucking pissed they brought me into their house.  She was chewing the older brother out for it I was fairly certain.  In any case, those guys didn't share my beliefs and this was no problem.

 

It's only a problem for those that make it a problem.

[Dirty_habiT]

43 minutes ago, mr.yuck said:

@Jokernot for nothin homie, but I think I have a pretty fresh new take on Jesus. 

 

Fun to riff about but my suspicion is that Jesus is not actually a time traveler from the future.  I don't know that for fact, but it just seems a little stretchy.  Thinking about it is really the goal of this thread and I think every now and then people should get a reminder to re-evaluate their ideas and values.  I'm constantly trying to figure out ways I can improve myself and be a better person to those around me.  You guys definitely get to see a spicier side to me that I don't share with everyone but that's because we're here on a forum.

 

I bet if we were all at a keg party together and nobody knew who anyone else was, just about every single one of us would be friendly with one another.  It really would be as simple as that.

[Joker]

46 minutes ago, misteraven said:

 

Dude, do you know how to make Krink? Asking for a friend.

Rack a container of shoe polish from your local drug store, discard the shoe polish liquid and clean the container out. Then, fill the empty container with Krink. Presto! 

[misteraven]

1 hour ago, mr.yuck said:

@Jokernot for nothin homie, but I think I have a pretty fresh new take on Jesus. 

 

Congratulations, you won the internet for today.

 

 

 

[Joker]

5 minutes ago, Dirty_habiT said:

I understand, that sentiment @Joker.  I think everyone here still has the same relationship they did before this thread was created.  I could be ignorant but I'm not going to act any differently towards anyone on this site just because they believe or don't believe.  I have a better idea of who shares a common idea about the subject now though.

 

This is really all I'm getting at. Seems to me that anyone who is an atheist, even agnostic, is not going to be swayed into believing in God or creation based on the confidence of a young woman waving a lollipop around. 

 

I'm married to a Jehovah's Witness, have been for 25 years. She grew up that way, her entire family is, most of her friends are, I would never argue with any of them against their faith. 

[Dirty_habiT]

I admittedly don't know much about the JW's.  My brother married a Mormon woman.  It's not weird, we just don't talk about beliefs.  Oddly enough my brother who married the Mormon woman, that despite having the same upbringing I had, recently decided that he is Buddhist.

 

Welp ok, cannot argue with that decision either.  I'm not even unhappy w/ it, but it did surprise me.