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Pass the Corona ese... Novel Corona aka COVID-19


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5 minutes ago, nicklesndimes said:

am i alone in feeling that by the time that, say.....july gets here, that i will probably really let go of all these corona inhibitions?

 

i mean.....i understand cautiousness, but i really can't see wearing masks everywhere for the rest of time.

Serious??!!

 

You got a get out of jail ticket for facial recognition, you got the go ahead to get your ninja on, you get to keep to yourself even when out in public!

 

Dang, I am all for masking up when in public!!

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7 hours ago, CALIgula said:

It reads confrontationally?... i wrote it with a "you do you boo" tone 

Feels like I'm in opposite day or something.

You're implying I'm a science denier for stating a scientifically proven fact.

Concerned about other peoples business, what they do etc. and that's the exact opposite of "you do you" isn't it?

 

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I need one of those bullshit cloth masks or something, I been using 3M Cool Flow N95 dust masks (only when I go inside a place for work) and it's fucking with me I'll be short of breath sometimes. I still have 4 left of the 3M N95's street value $40 each right now.

 

449194156_ScreenShot2020-05-14at6_04_30AM.png.aff756fa595018597fd7c1d62616c40e.png

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5 hours ago, Hua Guofang said:

 

What is the relevance of this?

 

Also, where did you get that info?

The most comprehensive study done so far was in Italy and the results were released recently.

Average age of COVID-19 related death was 81 years old (which is higher than the average life expectancy). The vast majority had pre existing conditions.

 

I can't find a link to the actual Italian study I was going over earlier this week but here's a Bloomberg article making use of the data:

 

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-03-18/99-of-those-who-died-from-virus-had-other-illness-italy-says

 

235761177_ScreenShot2020-05-14at6_15_40AM.png.bd185c6e6bb30920878dfee1d7fe16a5.png

 

You've got a less than 1% percent chance of dying from COVID19 if you're healthy at almost any age. I'm assuming the food shortages (and subsequent conflicts that will result) caused by this economic impact are going to kill more people world wide than the actual virus itself by the time the dust starts to settle. People don't play nice when they're afraid of starving to death.

 

My wife currently can't get meat for our dog to eat anymore, we'd get cheap cuts of meat for him but everything "cheap" is currently sold out. This isn't a result of hoarding, it's a result of a breakdown in the supply chain. Not a big deal for someone "well off" in a first world country, we'll just pay more for food. Big deal if you're not well off though.

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27 minutes ago, Mercer said:

The most comprehensive study done so far was in Italy and the results were released recently.

Average age of COVID-19 related death was 81 years old (which is higher than the average life expectancy). The vast majority had pre existing conditions.

 

I can't find a link to the actual Italian study I was going over earlier this week but here's a Bloomberg article making use of the data:

 

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-03-18/99-of-those-who-died-from-virus-had-other-illness-italy-says

 

235761177_ScreenShot2020-05-14at6_15_40AM.png.bd185c6e6bb30920878dfee1d7fe16a5.png

 

You've got a less than 1% percent chance of dying from COVID19 if you're healthy at almost any age. I'm assuming the food shortages (and subsequent conflicts that will result) caused by this economic impact are going to kill more people world wide than the actual virus itself by the time the dust starts to settle. People don't play nice when they're afraid of starving to death.

 

My wife currently can't get meat for our dog to eat anymore, we'd get cheap cuts of meat for him but everything "cheap" is currently sold out. This isn't a result of hoarding, it's a result of a breakdown in the supply chain. Not a big deal for someone "well off" in a first world country, we'll just pay more for food. Big deal if you're not well off though.

I still don't understand the importance of that statistic though.  Why is the age of people dying relevant or that they had comorbidity relevant? People use this information as if it somehow lessens the danger of the virus/disease and I don't understand how that works.

 

40% of American adults are in the high-risk category*. That's a lot of people that have more than 1% chance of dying (that 1% stat is guess work, by the way*) if they walk out the door. Plus, you ignore that risk of death from non-corona related issues if the health system is overwhelmed and there are also the huge amount of unexplained deaths^ that suggest the morbidity rate is actually significantly higher than 1%

 

I know that you're taking the threat of this virus seriously, I don't mean to imply that you're cavalier. But the argument that suggests there is less to worry about than people think seems to have a very thin view of what the threat is and how a high-rate of infection will cause many knock on effects just as harmful as the virus itself.

 

PS - I  think your assumptions about the econ impacts killing more people than the virus are being made, far too early in the piece, there is a long way to go yet.

 

* said here, by this guy

 

^ stats below provided by the FT tracker here:

 

image.thumb.png.e271f37e4287caa485bd337ab6db9677.png

 

 

 

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Because it's a narrow view that ignores all other important data like most statistical analysis. If the average age is 81 years old it's not worth millions of people suffering, losing their businesses, homes, jobs, etc. This same logic isn't applied to say something like driving, or considering engaging in wars, etc. Like should we suspend all freedoms? No more sky diving, no more swimming, cancel electricity because 100,000 people a year die from electrocution every year in America according to the CDC. Should police confront obese people?

 

The lockdown isn't even going to prevent deaths like ending electricity use would, only slightly delay them. The vulnerable people (with low quality of life due to other illnesses) we are supposedly "saving" will still get COVID19 and die, maybe a couple of months later but still, it's not actually preventing any deaths. We should focus on protecting the vulnerable, not impoverishing everyone else. It doesn't make sense to take away peoples ability to make their own choices.

 

This lockdown/violation of liberty will only delay the inevitable, and will not stop the overall death toll, only delay it at the cost of millions of livelihoods and the resulting human suffering that will follow. I mean what's the point of all this? I guess it's a perspective thing. Millions are going to die from COVID19 anyway, the lockdown will not stop it, only delay it at the cost of the living.

 

TLDR: If you only focus on one single statistic, you lose the big picture here. 

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50 minutes ago, where said:

More like 300 a year 

I should be clearer for all you contrarians. I’m talking about overall/total deaths from electrocution, not just occupational deaths from electrocution.

 

Besides my point still stands if that number is just 100 deaths per year, or really even one per year if it’s consistent and statistically predictable. I’m not sure why you attempted to prove me wrong. What was your point?

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https://www.cdc.gov/media/releases/2016/p1117-preventable-deaths.html
 

 

all these preventable deaths, if you’re not going Karen and reporting/chastising people for bad eating habits, and staying indoors, by yourself all day working out you can’t really claim to care about these massive numbers of deaths every year we could prevent. If we all shut down the economy and acted like we don’t give a fuck about people who weren’t set with unemployment, jobs they can work from home we could prevent the majority of these deaths. Better yet we could have police with tazers overseeing lard asses on treadmills 1000v shock for slowing down. “It’s for thier own good” lol. Zero logical consistency for this mandated lockdown.

 

at least 1/3 of all deaths are “preventable” if you’re willing to go full totalitarian.

 

80E3EFE1-68F2-4085-9689-C3720DF3BADF.thumb.jpeg.c0a702cfc9798e1c109b047b2280de29.jpeg

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7 hours ago, Mercer said:

Feels like I'm in opposite day or something.

You're implying I'm a science denier for stating a scientifically proven fact.

Concerned about other peoples business, what they do etc. and that's the exact opposite of "you do you" isn't it?

 

Step 1. State my opinion on your business. 

Step 2. .....

Step 3. .... but you do you boo. 

 

Isn't that usually how it works? 

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I'm ready for this to be over. 

Trust me, just as much as anyone. 

 

I'll be getting a pay cut. 

I've got pussy lined up.

I'm going stir crazy and need to get out. 

 

With all that being said, patience is a virtue. 

So I'm willing to go without the money, pussy, and fresh air until this is over for everyone's benefit. It's called sacrifice. 

 

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I don't like this at all. It sucks not really being able to go out, and mundane things like going to get a pair of jumper cables turn into, "Well first I need to get a mask, then I have to bring wipes to disinfect, I have to remember what has been disinfected and what hasn't, can't touch my face until I get home to wash my hands and disinfect the door knobs"... like damn yo, just let me live and be normal.

 

At the same time though I get so much more work done at home. If I could permanently work from home and go out as needed, I'd be completely happy. I do think we're gonna see a case jump int he next couple weeks with everything reopening. 

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9 hours ago, Mercer said:

 If the average age is 81 years old it's not worth millions of people suffering, losing their businesses, homes, jobs, etc.

 

TLDR: If you only focus on one single statistic, you lose the big picture here. 

There it is.

 

If you're old, your life isn't worth as much as younger people.

 

And by the way, Mr Statistics, you're basing your conclusion on the data from only one country and a fraction of the global data, yet you complain about other people using non-representative stats. Secondly, it was you who posted about a single statistic, I was responding to your post..., with a single statistic in it.

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3 hours ago, CALIgula said:

I'm ready for this to be over. 

Trust me, just as much as anyone. 

 

I'll be getting a pay cut. 

I've got pussy lined up.

I'm going stir crazy and need to get out. 

 

With all that being said, patience is a virtue. 

So I'm willing to go without the money, pussy, and fresh air until this is over for everyone's benefit. It's called sacrifice.

Thats not virtue or a sacrifice my friend.  You've gotta bad case of cabin fever and its beginning to show. 

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I want my little girl to experience more than just the walls of this house. I want her to be around other kids her age and to see something new each day.

 

I can deal with being cooped up, I worked from home for 7 years and in China, everything could be delivered and sometimes I'd go without walking out my front door for days on end. Plus, the city I live in isn't known for having a lit to do, so we're conditioned for boredom here!!

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11 minutes ago, Hua Guofang said:

There it is.

 

If you're old, your life isn't worth as much as younger people.

True, If I had a choice I’d save an 18 year old over an 81 year old. You would too. In the bigger picture though, that 81-year-old with multiple health conditions is going to die anyway. The lockdown will not stop COVID-19 and we all know this. Herd immunity is the cure. So this massive sacrifice really isn’t going to help.

 

11 minutes ago, Hua Guofang said:

 

And by the way, Mr Statistics, you're basing your conclusion on the data from only one country and a fraction of the global data, yet you complain about other people using non-representative stats. Secondly, it was you who posted about a single statistic, I was responding to your post..., with a single statistic in it.

Why do we still drive automobiles if millions of people will be killed as a result?


Props if you (or anyone else) can answer that while maintain the logical consistency  behind the economic shutdown.

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16 minutes ago, Mercer said:

True, If I had a choice I’d save an 18 year old over an 81 year old. You would too. In the bigger picture though, that 81-year-old with multiple health conditions is going to die anyway. The lockdown will not stop COVID-19 and we all know this. Herd immunity is the cure. So this massive sacrifice really isn’t going to help.

 

Why do we still drive automobiles if millions of people will be killed as a result?


Props if you (or anyone else) can answer that while maintain the logical consistency  behind the economic shutdown.

That's a slippery slope, my friend. We're all going to die anyway. What about 18 year olds with type 1 diabetes, or asthma. There's a higher chance they'll die young too. Indigenous people and black people have lower life expectancy, is their life worth 10% less than others, if you're forced to make a choice? How about people from lower socio-economic backgrounds, there's a higher chance they will die or end up in prison, etc., so are they valued 20% less than others from good homes,, if your'e forced to choose? The ethical implications of one life being worth more than another doesn't stop with the one decision, they either all are equal or none are.

 

I think you're misunderstanding herd immunity. Nobody yet knows if having the virus will stop you from getting it again. There's a chance that we don't build immunity to this thing. Therefore, we're racing for a vaccine. The strategy is to tamp shit down as much as possible until we get that vaccine. And what I mean by that, is do what the successful countries have done - we're opening up again, bro! I'm going to a bar this weekend, because my govt acted early and dudes stayed the fuck home. There is very little of the virus known to be in our country, so we do phased opening up wtih a high state of surveillance and readiness to respond and push on until we (hopefully) get a vaccine. Then we move back to normal again. The massive sacrifce does help.

 

You also seem to ignore what would happen to the economy if the disease was allowed to run rampant through your society and the health system was fucked. Nobody seems to want to face the fact that your economy would be fucked ANYWAY if half the country got sick within a couple of months. Why are people ignoring that?

 

Your situation is so bad because your fed govt and many of your states were super-slow to respond properly. If I was in the US, that's where I'd be pointing my anger, you cats didn't need to be on such heavy lockdown for so long. You are suffering more because your govts fucked it up. (not ignoring China here, everyone gets to be mad at them)

 

I'll get to the car thing later, but the bottom line is, driving isn't free. There are rules, restrictions, fines, imprisonment and huge efforts going into reducing the road toll, just like there is for the virus. The difference is, cars are a known quantity, the virus is not. You act like we know all we need to know about this virus and that we can make an informed decision about its long term impacts.

 

We don't. It's novel. And that's the point.

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55 minutes ago, Hua Guofang said:

That's a slippery slope, my friend. We're all going to die anyway. What about 18 year olds with type 1 diabetes, or asthma. There's a higher chance they'll die young too. Indigenous people and black people have lower life expectancy, is their life worth 10% less than others, if you're forced to make a choice? How about people from lower socio-economic backgrounds, there's a higher chance they will die or end up in prison, etc., so are they valued 20% less than others from good homes,, if your'e forced to choose? The ethical implications of one life being worth more than another doesn't stop with the one decision, they either all are equal or none are.

 

I think you're misunderstanding herd immunity. Nobody yet knows if having the virus will stop you from getting it again. There's a chance that we don't build immunity to this thing. Therefore, we're racing for a vaccine. The strategy is to tamp shit down as much as possible until we get that vaccine. And what I mean by that, is do what the successful countries have done - we're opening up again, bro! I'm going to a bar this weekend, because my govt acted early and dudes stayed the fuck home. There is very little of the virus known to be in our country, so we do phased opening up wtih a high state of surveillance and readiness to respond and push on until we (hopefully) get a vaccine. Then we move back to normal again. The massive sacrifce does help.

 

You also seem to ignore what would happen to the economy if the disease was allowed to run rampant through your society and the health system was fucked. Nobody seems to want to face the fact that your economy would be fucked ANYWAY if half the country got sick within a couple of months. Why are people ignoring that?

 

Your situation is so bad because your fed govt and many of your states were super-slow to respond properly. If I was in the US, that's where I'd be pointing my anger, you cats didn't need to be on such heavy lockdown for so long. You are suffering more because your govts fucked it up. (not ignoring China here, everyone gets to be mad at them)

 

I'll get to the car thing later, but the bottom line is, driving isn't free. There are rules, restrictions, fines, imprisonment and huge efforts going into reducing the road toll, just like there is for the virus. The difference is, cars are a known quantity, the virus is not. You act like we know all we need to know about this virus and that we can make an informed decision about its long term impacts.

 

We don't. It's novel. And that's the point.

If i’m told to keep memes out of the news section please kindly keep political discussions out of the meme thread. I know you didn’t kick it off and we all threw a word in but let’s keep it movin with the memes 

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3 minutes ago, Kults said:

If i’m told to keep memes out of the news section please kindly keep political discussions out of the meme thread. I know you didn’t kick it off and we all threw a word in but let’s keep it movin with the memes 

YEah, fair enough.

 

Possible to have the relevant posts moved to the Carona thread?

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^^Trippy to think you live in a city generally accepted to be at least as BORING as mine.

Even less pubs in CBR than ADL

 

take your kid out for a walk.

from memory of canberra there's a shit ton of open space to be socially distant but not socially isolated out there.

Central segment of the lake would excellent for this but possibly not that visually exciting.

 

I don't want anything currently my life really hasn't been too affected. I could go out just nowhere for me  to go

 

Barring an afternoon at the pub with mates.

 

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1 hour ago, ndv said:

Thats not virtue or a sacrifice my friend.  You've gotta bad case of cabin fever and its beginning to show. 

What the fuck are you talking about? 

 

I could be like these idiots i see on YouTube and tv, disregard shit and go out... but im making the sacrifice and NOT going out. 

 

Again, what the fuck are you talking about? 

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Just now, CALIgula said:

What the fuck are you talking about? 

 

I could be like these idiots i see on YouTube and tv, disregard shit and go out... but im making the sacrifice and NOT going out. 

 

Again, what the fuck are you talking about? 

I am just messing with you.  I know you are serious, but I seen humor in your original post. 

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