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12 minutes ago, Dirty_habiT said:

Wow, Pelosi is such human trash.

 

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we've official jumped the shark, rush limbaugh is a  joke 

Why would 
I feel bad he got cancer after saying smoking didnt give you cancer for years. 

 

 

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Rush on nicotine:

“There is no conclusive proof that nicotine’s addictive... And the same thing with cigarettes causing emphysema, lung cancer, heart disease.”

 

Rush on the genocide of American Indians:

“Columbus saved the Indians from themselves.”

 

Rush on Michael J Fox having parkinsons disease:

"He is exaggerating the effects of the disease. He's moving all around and shaking and it's purely an act... This is really shameless of Michael J. Fox. Either he didn't take his medication or he's acting."

 

Rush on African Americans voting:

“[African Americans] are twelve percent of the population. Who the hell cares?”

 

Rush on the NFL:

“Look, let me put it to you this way: the NFL all too often looks like a game between the Bloods and the Crips without any weapons. There, I said it.”

 

Rush on global warming:

“If you believe in God, then intellectually you cannot believe in man-made global warming."

 

Rush on global warming 2:

"Global warming relies on the theory that we are destroying ecosystems. There is no evidence that we could destroy ecosystems."

 

Rush on global warming 3:

"For years I’ve pointed out that global warming is bogus."

 

Rush on feeding poor children in public school:

“If you feed them, if you feed the children, three square meals a day during the school year, how can you expect them to feed themselves in the summer? Wanton little waifs and serfs dependent on the State. Pure and simple.”

 

Rush on a 13 year old girl:

"Socks is the White House cat. But did you know there is also a White House dog?” (Rush Limbaugh, while holding up a photograph of 13-year-old Chelsea Clinton)

 

Rush on exercise:

“Exercise freaks … are the ones putting stress on the health care system.”

 

Rush on feminism:

"Feminism has led women astray. I love the women’s movement — especially when walking behind it.”

 

Rush on LGBT:

“When a gay person turns his back on you, it is anything but an insult; it’s an invitation.”

 

Rush on people in the military who didn't support the Iraq War:

"The phony soldiers."

 

Rush on women:

"Women still live longer than men because their lives are easier."

 

Rush on women protesting sexual harassment:

“They’re out there protesting what they actually wish would happen to them sometimes.”

 

Rush on the homeless population:

"Isn't that how the homeless became homeless? They used to be institutionalized and a bunch of liberals came along and said, "They have rights! You can't keep them there"?"

 

Rush on the heterosexuality:

"Heterosexuality may be 95, 98 percent of the population. [Heterosexuality is] under assault by the 2 to 5 percent that are homosexual.”

 

Rush on legalizing gay marriage:

I simply asked you to think what was your first reaction when you heard first about gay marriage? And I said you’re probably having the same reaction here. And gay marriage is now standard, normal operating procedure. [Pedophilia] could be, too.

 

Rush on what criminals look like:

"Have you ever noticed how all composite pictures of wanted criminals resemble Jesse Jackson?”.

 

Rush on Sandra Fluke who testified that women should have access to affordable contraceptives:

"It makes her a slut, right? It makes her a prostitute. She wants to be paid to have sex. She's having so much sex she can't afford the contraception. She wants you and me and the taxpayers to pay her to have sex. What does that make us? We're the pimps. (interruption) The johns? We would be the johns?

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If you listen to Sanders explain it, his plan to have debts paid off is through a tax on Wall St, at least the last i saw. A tax estimated at less than a half of a percent. Part of the argument being: if the government bailed out Wall St criminals with taxes, Wall St criminals can bail the public out with their taxes. 
 

The vague, disingenuous argument often made against paying off student debt, the argument this guy makes briefly, is like they’re going to create some magical new tax for the average American citizen. “Your money!” Is often the phrasing used. That is not the plan. At least not the plan Sanders has proposed.

This dude also talks shit about Sanders essentially never  having a real “job.” I think it’s a fairly safe argument saying that being the Mayor of a city, a member of the House, and a state Senator, is a tad tougher than being a voice actor for a kids show, a christian movie actor and a political commentator.

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Tax Wall Street Gambling to Cancel All Student Debt and Pay for College for All

https://berniesanders.com/en/issues/free-college-cancel-debt/

 

We can guarantee higher education as a right for all and cancel all student debt for an estimated $2.2 trillion. To pay for this, we will impose a tax of a fraction of a percent on Wall Street speculators who nearly destroyed the economy a decade ago. This Wall Street speculation tax will raise $2.4 trillion over the next ten years. It works by placing a 0.5 percent tax on stock trades – 50 cents on every $100 of stock – a 0.1 percent fee on bond trades, and a 0.005 percent fee on derivative trades.

 

If Wall Street can be bailed out for several trillion dollars, 45 million Americans can and will be bailed out of the $1.6 trillion burden of student loan debt and we can provide free college for all. Some 40 countries throughout the world have imposed a similar tax, including Britain, South Korea, Hong Kong, Brazil, Germany, France, Switzerland and China.

 

 

@abrasivesaintYou can't just extract an additional $2.4T from the Stock Market over the next 10 years without destroying it. Those numbers look small, but when you're gambling your own money on razor thin margins, you're better off moving your money someplace else than paying additional penalties whether your investment wins or loses. Simply charging a 0.5% on every trade alone would be enough to destroy liquidity almost as soon as that policy was put into place. Most day traders, and the people facilitating liquidity don't even earn that much for themselves per trade.

 

Besides, this ignores the immorality of helping yourself to the value in someone else's 401k, or other good investment. Especially if it's being used to buy votes, and encourage students to make a poor investments, like a college degree that won't pay for itself. If you want an arts degree, gender studies, or any other non in demand degree you should have to pay for it yourself. Why should everyone else have to work harder, or go without to pay for someone else's poor investment? I don't like bailing out failed banks, failed businesses, and failed students because not only does it waste money, it also removes the incentive to not fail. We need to encourage students to earn a degree that actually endows them with skills that are in demand in the job market. Earning a degree in this electrical engineering, software engineering, and other STEM majors are already guaranteed to pay for itself. Why fuck over the people who study, or work hard, in favor of someone going to college as a hobby, or way to avoid being productive?

Edited by Mercer
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@MercerI admittedly don’t know enough about stocks, investments or economics to argue one way or the other. We both know you are far more read up on economics than I am, haha.
 

I was just parroting what he laid out as his plan, because anytime a plan is proposed, the number 1 argument heard against it is “THEY’RE GOING TO TAKE YOU’RE MONEY.” Meanwhile that dude in West Virginia, that isn't well educated or well payed,  just parrots statements like “well i’m not letting some Commie take MY money!” like i just parroted his plan. Wasn’t really arguing for or against.
 

I will say i think some school debts are egregious vs the amount of income you’ll receive for that degree once employed. I also understand if you spent your college career studying nonsense and have no path to take after graduating, well that was possibly just poor management on your part, and the exact reason i dropped out of college 2 weeks into it. I was going to school because i felt like i was “supposed to” and was attending a pricey school that mommy and daddy were not paying for. So, I got my ass out quick, and paid my $3000 bill for going to class for 2 weeks.
 

However, i think the school system and system in general fails the population at preparing us for these decisions. The amount of responsibility in choosing your path and the information you are given can be vastly different. How many professors honestly say “Do not take this course! It is a dying field and your degree is toilet paper.” Almost none, because then they’re out of a job.

 

This very situation happened to myself, and everyone else in my graduating trade school class, in terms of machining. After spending 3.5 years of studying metal and manual machining we were told it was useless and CAD and CNC were the future. Both requiring further education. Well i was graduating a trade school with 3+ years of somewhat useless knowledge. It was basically like learning how to work on a Model T and in the real world it was all Teslas. You need someone to rethread a screw, or hand mill some metal, i’m your guy. Ask me to do anything involving a CNC machine or CAD besides load the chuck and hit the green start button, i’m fucked. 


I knew one person that continued their education and went to college to learn CAD, essentially earning a doctorates, in terms of time spent, on something we should have been learning in the first 3.5 years. They did not end up working in the field. So they chose to further their education and are now footing that bill. Here, i can agree it was poor planning and management on their part, and is their responsibility. 

 

Today, that machining program exists, and looks like this.. 

 

899B2C0F-046E-495E-93BD-D3AA6D556850.thumb.jpeg.80f676ec14ae24abcfe0a18dfb795b8e.jpeg


 

We weren’t taught any of that, besides blueprint reading, (exclude the CAD drawing/designing) and the bottom 2. Was it just unfortunate timing in the industry/schooling? Probably. But if i went to college for this and was tens of thousand of dollars in debt due to withheld information, i’d be PISSED. 
 

edit: now after all that. Do I think all tuitions should be covered and cleared? No. However, I can get behind clearing the slate for some people who followed their education into careers and are doing the right thing, and just being beaten down by the way things are. 

Edited by abrasivesaint
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I'll put it like this, you crash the stock market, and that inbred West Virgina dude is def gonna be even poorer. Just like the poor people in East Germany, were 10x Poorer than the poor people in West Germany. Communism takes everyones money and flushes it down the toilet, even if the effect is indirect, it still exists, and is painful to watch happen.

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As for the rest, I agree. The public school system is full of people telling you that college is super important but they're all full of shit. College graduates do earn more, because people like company CEO's, and Anesthesiologists are included in that number. I remember my teacher pointing out that if we didn't go to college, we'd end up like the janitor. Funny thing is the janitors had a strong union, and earned more money than the teachers did.

 

Think about it, teachers are the bottom of the barrel when it comes to earnings. Not saying there weren't people who went into college, and teaching on purpose, but the vast majority were just people taking the classes that interested them and were stuck with nothing to do with that degree in Physical Education,  History, or English Literature. These are the same people shaping the minds of our youth today, and pushing them towards their same failed path. 

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10 minutes ago, Mercer said:

I'll put it like this, you crash the stock market, and that inbred West Virgina dude is def gonna be even poorer. Just like the poor people in East Germany, were 10x Poorer than the poor people in West Germany. Communism takes everyones money and flushes it down the toilet, even if the effect is indirect, it still exists, and is painful to watch happen.

Could you not argue that our current Capitalist system takes everyones money and hordes it in the hands of a incredibly small population in comparison? The guy in West Virginia is getting his money taken either way.
 

In one case it’s going to the mansion on the hill, in the other everyone is fucked. I think a lot of people are tired of the money going to the mansion and are saying fuck the mansion, the toilet it is! Not saying i’m in that camp, just making the point. 
 

To be clear: i do not believe in outright Socialism or Communism.
 

I think aspects of all ideologies and systems could be implemented to some degree properly though. I think as a whole America is mostly on that path. 

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Have you seen how much being poor in Venezuela is,

6 minutes ago, abrasivesaint said:

Could you not argue that our current Capitalist system takes everyones money and hordes it in the hands of a incredibly small population in comparison? 

Yes, this is a fallacy, the money isn't "taken" from anyone. Capitalism doesn't take, socialism does. I'm not sure how one would come to the conclusion the money is "taken". That would have to be based on an assumption that everyone is entitled to an equal amount of money as a birth right, but w're not. We're only entitled to what we either create ourselves, or exchange for, or are given, and nothing more.

 

The poor also suffer when the stock market crashes, and the economy takes a nosedive. They lose jobs, customers, etc. Maybe he works as a carpenter for a rich lady in her mansion, a middle income retiree that relies on their retirement funds, some of which are in the stock market. It was eye opening to watch all the favorite street vendors in the financial district go belly up that worked out in front of the failed businesses skyscrapers during the 2008 crash. We're all in this together.

Edited by Mercer
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8 minutes ago, Mercer said:

As for the rest, I agree. The public school system is full of people telling you that college is super important but they're all full of shit. College graduates do earn more, because people like company CEO's, and Anesthesiologists are included in that number. I remember my teacher pointing out that if we didn't go to college, we'd end up like the janitor. Funny thing is the janitors had a strong union, and earned more money than the teachers did.

 

Think about it, teachers are the bottom of the barrel when it comes to earnings. Not saying there weren't people who went into college, and teaching on purpose, but the vast majority were just people taking the classes that interested them and were stuck with nothing to do with that degree in Physical Education,  History, or English Literature. These are the same people shaping the minds of our youth today, and pushing them towards their same failed path. 

Funny enough i had a story along the lines of the top paragraph but decided to save it and not post it. I’m glad i saved it. I also heard the same pitches about being the janitor.. 

 

I was once brought in for an interview for a machining job and seconds into sitting down the guy says “i’m going to tell you right now, you don’t have the job. However, you were the only applicant who was honest and said you basically didn’t know anything besides manual machining and the basics, when i know all these other guys, (shows me a stack of applications,) are lying about their abilities. He gave me some contact information for other jobs more suitable for my qualifications where i could “potentially” learn to operate a CNC machine and CAD. With life and bills to pay, that warehouse job paying $5 more an hour sounded better and more responsible than rolling the dice on a belief in a system that has already failed me once. I went to the warehouse. 
 

I have friends that purposefully went into teaching. I would like to think we can create a better system where he gets paid fairly well and isn’t in massive debt when he’s doing a major service to the community and population at large. This dude is a good person, one of the best i know, and is very much interested in making the world a better place.

 

I would have followed a similar path, however i was always told teachers don’t get paid shit, so i took the “selfish” road and didn’t do that. Having to earn a masters or doctorates to get paid less than what i’m making now sounds asinine. Especially because i spent 1 week reading 1 certification book, and here i am.
 

However, my job could be argued to be in the same range of importance as a teacher i suppose, because if i fuck up at my job, it could easily be the difference between the life and death of a stranger. 

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1 minute ago, abrasivesaint said:

Funny enough i had a story along the lines of the top paragraph but decided to save it and not post it. I’m glad i saved it. I also heard the same pitches about being the janitor.. 

 

I was once brought in for an interview for a machining job and seconds into sitting down the guy says “i’m going to tell you right now, you don’t have the job. However, you were the only applicant who was honest and said you basically didn’t know anything besides manual machining and the basics, when i know all these other guys, (shows me a stack of applications,) are lying about their abilities. He gave me some contact information for other jobs more suitable for my qualifications where i could “potentially” learn to operate a CNC machine and CAD. With life and bills to pay, that warehouse job paying $5 more an hour sounded better and more responsible than rolling the dice on a belief in a system that has already failed me once. I went to the warehouse. 
 

I have friends that purposefully went into teaching. I would like to think we can create a better system where he gets paid fairly well and isn’t in massive debt when he’s doing a major service to the community and population at large. This dude is a good person, one of the best i know, and is very much interested in making the world a better place.

 

I would have followed a similar path, however i was always told teachers don’t get paid shit, so i took the “selfish” road and didn’t do that. Having to earn a masters or doctorates to get paid less than what i’m making now sounds asinine. Especially because i spent 1 week reading 1 certification book, and here i am.
 

However, my job could be argued to be in the same range of importance as a teacher i suppose, because if i fuck up at my job, it could easily be the difference between the life and death of a stranger. 

Yea, unfortunately thats a supply and demand problem. There's just a million people who qualify to be teachers with a small demand by comparison. It's not some sort of nefarious masterplan by the rich to fuck over educators, in fact, most philanthropic efforts involve some form of funding, or promoting education. 

 

Consumer demand defines importance. If people pay a lot for something, it's important, if it's rare to have the skills/desire to meet this demand it makes the individual important. There are people making more of an impact outside of the financial realm but in general, if people really wan't or need something, it creates a demand in the market. The people with the ability to meet that demand create the supply, and the market works itself out accordingly. Teaching is important, but unfortunately there's a supply issue, and it's really tough to earn an above average wage in a field where someone with the same qualifications is willing to work for less.

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10 minutes ago, Mercer said:

Have you seen how much being poor in Venezuela is,

Yes, this is a fallacy, the money isn't "taken" from anyone. Capitalism doesn't take, socialism does. I'm not sure how one would come to the conclusion the money is "taken". That would have to be based on an assumption that everyone is entitled to an equal amount of money as a birth right, but w're not. We're only entitled to what we either create ourselves, or exchange for, or are given, and nothing more.

 

Could you not argue that through unchecked capitalism, major corporations can create monopolies, that throttle aspects of industries, say healthcare, which lead to situations like price gouging? Essentially “taking” more money than is truly warranted. 

 

10 minutes ago, Mercer said:

The poor also suffer when the stock market crashes, and the economy takes a nosedive. They lose jobs, customers, etc. Maybe he works as a carpenter for a rich lady in her mansion, a middle income retiree that relies on their retirement funds, some of which are in the stock market. It was eye opening to watch all the favorite street vendors in the financial district go belly up that worked out in front of the failed businesses skyscrapers during the 2008 crash. We're all in this together.

None of this i’ll question nor disagree with. I understand a stock market crash is not inconsequential to the average American. 

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Just now, abrasivesaint said:

 

Could you not argue that through unchecked capitalism, major corporations can create monopolies, that throttle aspects of industries, say healthcare, which lead to situations like price gouging? Essentially “taking” more money than is truly warranted. 

Monopoly, or rather the "price gouging" a monopoly leads to is almost always caused by government interference on "unchecked" capitalism. The first thing is Monopoly is a term that originally meant something the crown granted to certain merchants, as in the king has granted monopoly for ship building to X shipmaker. So the language surrounding that word is somewhat confusing to begin with.

 

Lets takea look at this shipbuilder that has a total monopoly on building ships, they could charge almost whatever they wanted but you'd have to acknowledge they'd sell less ships if they charge a billion dollars for a ship that would cost a million under free market conditions right? Now let's remove the ability for the crown to grant him monopoly, wouldn't the fact you could earn a billion dollars making a ship bring competitors into the ship building market, pushing the price back down to levels that reflect the actual cost of building a ship? Monopoly pricing is almost impossible to achieve in a free market without creating pressure for new competitors to pop up. One of my favorite example of this tendency towards destroying a monopoly was Dow's (of Dow Chemical) fight against the Bromine Cartels of Germany.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herbert_Henry_Dow

 

Quote

With his new company and new technology, Dow produced bromine very cheaply, and began selling it in the United States for 36 cents per pound. At the time, the German government supported a bromine cartel, Bromkonvention, which had a near-monopoly on the supply of bromine, which they sold in the US for 49 cents per pound. The Germans had made it clear that they would dump the market with cheap bromine if Dow attempted to sell his product abroad. In 1904 Dow defied the cartel by beginning to export his bromine at its cheaper price to England. A few months later, an angry Bromkonvention representative visited Dow in his office and reminded him to cease exporting his bromine.

 

Unafraid, Dow continued exporting to England and Japan. The German cartel retaliated by dumping the US market with bromine at 15 cents a pound in an effort to put him out of business. Unable to compete with this predatory pricing in the U.S., Dow instructed his agents to buy up hundreds of thousands of pounds of the German bromine locally at the low price. The Dow company repackaged the bromine and exported it to Europe, selling it even to German companies at 27 cents a pound. The cartel, having expected Dow to go out of business, was unable to comprehend what was driving the enormous demand for bromine in the U.S., and where all the cheap imported bromine dumping their market was coming from. They suspected their own members of violating their price-fixing agreement and selling in Germany below the cartel's fixed cost. The cartel continued to slash prices on their bromine in the U.S., first to 12 cents a pound, and then to 10.5 cents per pound. The cartel finally caught on to Dow's tactic and realized that they could not keep selling below cost, they then increased their prices worldwide

 

The modern use of the word monopoly means businesses without competition, but every time you create a new product, or service you have a monopoly. Like Apple invented the iPhone, but shortly after Samsung, and several other telcom manufacturers came out with competition. The only thing that could have possibly stopped them was the government interfering and saying "your product is too much like apple's" and granting apple a monopoly on smartphones via IP rights to smartphones. Thankfully they didn't, but the U.S. courts almost did. Monopoly is naturally occurring outside of just new inventions, for example Nike has a monopoly on air Jordans, Metallica has a monopoly on Metallica tickets, etc. Real estate works the same way where a particular land owner might have a monopoly on food within walking distance to other places on their property. They can monopolize entire city blocks, etc. None of them dare engage in Monopoly pricing though because again,  a competitor will most certainly take advantage of the market monopoly pricing creates and restore the market to non-monopoly prices.

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22 minutes ago, Mercer said:

Yea, unfortunately thats a supply and demand problem. There's just a million people who qualify to be teachers with a small demand by comparison. It's not some sort of nefarious masterplan by the rich to fuck over educators, in fact, most philanthropic efforts involve some form of funding, or promoting education. 

For the sake of conversation, i’ll argue a theoretical masterplan. 


We all know public education is not the best in most scenarios. Would a well educated public not have a much higher chance at leveling the playing field, creating problems for the more educated, more powerful and richer minority? I mean people get duped out of money all the time through sales pitches because they are uneducated in the situation. It is an absolutely huge bonus for those who were afforded the proper education.

 

If the average person was on par with say a “1%” in terms of education of how things like law, economics, engineering, manufacturing, (ect,) functioned, there would be far less disadvantages in society. Sure, you have the ability to educate yourself in these areas, but that requires a fuck ton of work, and potential for major debt. It is a major deterrent.
 

When most are thrust into the river and are forced to swim or drown, you don’t have all the time in the world to learn what species of trees, animals and shrubbery you just passed by floating down stream are. Some people are handed a boat, some are thrown in river. If we truly wanted a better society, would the men with boats not be benefited by teaching those in line to be thrown to the river what trees they could use to create a boat for themselves? What animals are best to eat and what berries are poisonous vs those that are nutritious.. 

 

Not everyone is Will Hunting and has this ability. Some people need to be lead to water to know to drink, but once they drink they understand what to do. Obviously there’s still people foolish enough to not know to drink but what can you do about those people? To the river they go! Haha.
 

I think you could argue that those with boats don’t want more boats made, because more boats means less trees and less trees means if their boat is damaged their supply for repairs is much smaller..  

 

In steps issues with overpopulation and supply and demand. 
 

Quote

Consumer demand defines importance. If people pay a lot for something, it's important, if it's rare to have the skills/desire to meet this demand it makes the individual important. There are people making more of an impact outside of the financial realm but in general, if people really wan't or need something, it creates a demand in the market. The people with the ability to meet that demand create the supply, and the market works itself out accordingly. Teaching is important, but unfortunately there's a supply issue, and it's really tough to earn an above average wage in a field where someone with the same qualifications is willing to work for less.

Should we not raise the standards then? If there’s an abundance of mediocre teaching prospects, raise the standard to create a higher quality pool to choose from.

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