ndv Posted October 18, 2020 Share Posted October 18, 2020 (edited) Play stUpiD games, win sTUpid prizes. Edited October 18, 2020 by ndv Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elena Delle Donne Posted October 18, 2020 Share Posted October 18, 2020 4 minutes ago, Dark_Knight said: What can we do? Defund the military? oh yes. love this for us 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kults Posted October 18, 2020 Share Posted October 18, 2020 4 minutes ago, Dark_Knight said: What can we do? Defund the military? please don’t? so many of us depend on it for global stability (even though most would never admit it, ragging on America is a global pastime) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kults Posted October 18, 2020 Share Posted October 18, 2020 3 minutes ago, Elena Delle Donne said: oh yes. love this for us I hate to think of the world without the US as the dominant superpower e: honestly though no one has a say on that other than Americans, can’t fault you for feeling that way personally 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark_Knight Posted October 18, 2020 Share Posted October 18, 2020 How are we going to eliminate taxes then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mercer Posted October 18, 2020 Share Posted October 18, 2020 (edited) 17 minutes ago, Dark_Knight said: What can we do? Defund the military? That's kind of a goal post shift but, yes, in fact that's an excellent idea. Most of the waste comes from the military. As @misteravenhas mentioned up until 1913 there was no income tax, yet we had things like roads, a military, etc. It's tough to imagine some of the things we fund via taxes being funded any other way, but it's demonstrably possible for each service you're having trouble imagining being funded using non violence. That conversation is a long one. For now I'll stick with people funding their own health care individually, as a family, as a co-op, or not at all if they choose not to. Edited October 18, 2020 by Mercer 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark_Knight Posted October 18, 2020 Share Posted October 18, 2020 I like the idea, but I don’t believe it to be a plausible scenario. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elena Delle Donne Posted October 18, 2020 Share Posted October 18, 2020 (edited) 22 minutes ago, Kults said: I hate to think of the world without the US as the dominant superpower this is a good point. "defunding" is not "abolishing" here; i am for ~ defunding ~. i agree that simply subtracting our global presence is bad in most instances and that a lot of bad people would love that power vacuum. in many senses we are more progressive and egalitarian than much of the world. but i would argue that relatively little of that is capable of being spread by lockheed martin or academi and that while the current president loves the MOTHER OF ALL BOMBS and shit, we can do almost nothing with force alone now. but i also think a lot of people my age (our age? i'm early 30s) are sick of things being the way they were at the pentagon. our national pride and joy etc etc has tremendous opportunity costs that most of us aren't into paying anymore. i think a lot of people in their 30s and 40s grew up watching the wars in iraq and afghanistan happen and saw the united states military and our sick flavor of nationalistic imperialism at its worst. we really fucked shit up over there and killed 600,000+, too. we invaded a country based on cooked intelligence, stirred up a civil war, created isis, and flirted with doing it again in iran. we arguably became the bad guys. we're more than capable of doing it again; none of the people who made those decisions faced any consequences, and most of them live happy peaceful lives now. dick cheney is still alive, certainly a strong argument that there is no god. from less of an ideological standpoint: the rest of the world is kicking our ass in cyber. we look dumb as shit spending $1 trillion+ on an F35 that doesn't fly when china or russia can discover a zero day exploit that can ground all of them. we have a big expensive standing army and a defenseless power grid. the pentagon is rife with waste and fraud and abuse. biggest budget, never even been audited. Edited October 18, 2020 by Elena Delle Donne 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark_Knight Posted October 18, 2020 Share Posted October 18, 2020 3 hours ago, Qawee said: if i'm paying taxes, i would rather have my tax dollars go to pay for someones health care than a drone strike on a wedding in rural pakistan bump 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mercer Posted October 18, 2020 Share Posted October 18, 2020 I'd rather not hand my money over to an organization that spends a very small percentage actually helping people, and the other 90% on stuff like $70,000 guided bombs to drop on people that earn $2 a day. Honestly, most people think this idea of non-aggression is garbage today. But it wasn't too long ago most people thought homosexuality was an abomination, and slavery was a good idea. What are the chances todays popular beliefs are the right ones? I mean the current mess of a system brought us Cheeto Jesus, George Floyd's murder, the Iraq war etc. just needs a few tweaks here and there. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elena Delle Donne Posted October 19, 2020 Share Posted October 19, 2020 also i extremely want to get ahead of the insinuation that i'm psyched about joe biden on this front. he and hillary clinton and barack obama were all very cool with various sweeping military actions of questionable integrity/strategy/legality. obama loved a troop surge. hillary defended her iraq war vote a lot. none of them will do anything about this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mercer Posted October 19, 2020 Share Posted October 19, 2020 That's another way to measure a President's accomplishment, just like a sniper's kind of. It's the number of kills I think they can accomplish over 4 years that matter most, at least to me when I'm choosing. Some people measure by gallons of spray tan, other's, the number of kids sniffed, the important part is having absolute faith this system is near perfect, and just needs a few tweaks. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirty_habiT Posted October 19, 2020 Share Posted October 19, 2020 19 hours ago, Qawee said: if i'm paying taxes, i would rather have my tax dollars go to pay for someones health care than a drone strike on a wedding in rural pakistan Unfortunately you don't get to decide such things when the leaders of your country do what they want to do. This is EXACTLY one of the really good things that Trump is doing for this country. He's douching out "the bad hombres" in our government system as he can find them. BRAV FUCKIN O for doing that. I will support a fucking green woman with 3 dicks as president if she commits to the same goal. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirty_habiT Posted October 19, 2020 Share Posted October 19, 2020 Also, what you're referring to I think happened in 2008, according to this article: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wech_Baghtu_wedding_party_airstrike Your boy Barry was responsible for those strikes, they happened under his watch. I surely hope you wouldn't attempt top sit here and tell me that he didn't ok that to happen. I'd certainly be entertained to watch you try anyway. Fuckin next! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirty_habiT Posted October 19, 2020 Share Posted October 19, 2020 18 hours ago, Dark_Knight said: I don’t have the answers, no one does. I just think we should catch up with the rest of the civilized world. Which country is it that we should try to "catch up to" again? And what is it that they're doing "better" than we are doing? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirty_habiT Posted October 19, 2020 Share Posted October 19, 2020 17 hours ago, Kults said: they’re right in saying that about meds. it’s about the only upside. the gov hammers out deals with generic pill manufacturers to get boatloads of cheap knock off meds so the bloated system can even pay for it at all. grass always greener kinda thing for sure but trust me, I’ve lived under this dumpster fire of a medical system my entire life and it’s absolute trash. you over pay when you don’t need to and when you finally do need it, the service you get is so poor it cements the fact that you payed for fuck all for years. Do you think the access to more/better drugs (potentially opiates) has led to a drug problem in Canada that wasn't there before access to such medicines was as easy as it is now? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirty_habiT Posted October 19, 2020 Share Posted October 19, 2020 16 hours ago, Dark_Knight said: How are we going to eliminate taxes then? Cut government salaries to very low numbers where it's not "profitable" in any way to work in the government. You have to WANT to do it. Nobody becomes a teacher to make themselves rich, they do it because they want to teach kids. You cannot say this same thing about politicians. There's a ton of nepotism in politics and buddy deals. We need to make politics "fair" internally before it can be "fair" externally. Right now there is a whole lot of stuff going on internally that is unfair, dishonest, and immoral to the people of USA, and by proxy the rest of the world. You can see the effects reaching Ukraine from just this most recent "political round" we've had here. I would like to say that I'm blessed to be on this forum among people that are so smart. I would have never thought nearly 20 years ago now that I'd still be here and that we'd be having these kinds of discussions. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kults Posted October 19, 2020 Share Posted October 19, 2020 2 hours ago, Dirty_habiT said: Do you think the access to more/better drugs (potentially opiates) has led to a drug problem in Canada that wasn't there before access to such medicines was as easy as it is now? def not. By and large there is no legal opioid epidemic in Canada. why that is I don’t know but if i had to guess it’s likely because we don’t have the massive pharma lobbying that goes on south of the border. no doctors are handing out large/long term opioid scripts. we are however drowning in fentanyl. thanks china! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kults Posted October 19, 2020 Share Posted October 19, 2020 2 hours ago, Dirty_habiT said: Do you think the access to more/better drugs (potentially opiates) has led to a drug problem in Canada that wasn't there before access to such medicines was as easy as it is now? I should specify too, we don’t get better drugs, quite the opposite. the cheap drugs here are all generic knock offs. it’s like comparing RC cola to Coke. Cheap, sure. Better? Not even remotely close. they’re cheap but they aren’t ‘good’ its also very shady. Apotex founder (one of the larger generic meds manufacturer) murdered in his house not too long ago https://www.google.ca/amp/s/www.thestar.com/amp/news/canada/2020/01/15/barry-and-honey-sherman-were-murdered-within-hours-of-arriving-home-toronto-police-say.html ’Their bodies were in a seated position in their basement swimming pool room, held upright by belts around their necks attached to a low railing. Forensic sources have told the Star that it would be difficult to pinpoint a time of death two days later, given that the bodies were found in a humid environment.’ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark_Knight Posted October 19, 2020 Share Posted October 19, 2020 2 hours ago, Dirty_habiT said: Cut government salaries to very low numbers where it's not "profitable" in any way to work in the government. You have to WANT to do it. Nobody becomes a teacher to make themselves rich, they do it because they want to teach kids. You cannot say this same thing about politicians. There's a ton of nepotism in politics and buddy deals. We need to make politics "fair" internally before it can be "fair" externally. Right now there is a whole lot of stuff going on internally that is unfair, dishonest, and immoral to the people of USA, and by proxy the rest of the world. You can see the effects reaching Ukraine from just this most recent "political round" we've had here. I would like to say that I'm blessed to be on this forum among people that are so smart. I would have never thought nearly 20 years ago now that I'd still be here and that we'd be having these kinds of discussions. I think that’d be a great idea. But how are we going to have our elected officials propose something that is against their own interest? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ndv Posted October 19, 2020 Share Posted October 19, 2020 1 hour ago, Kults said: def not. By and large there is no legal opioid epidemic in Canada. why that is I don’t know but if i had to guess it’s likely because we don’t have the massive pharma lobbying that goes on south of the border. no doctors are handing out large/long term opioid scripts. we are however drowning in fentanyl. thanks china! I suspect, this is probably a genuine pros and cons to Canada's health care. But yeah, I would have to agree with you on the whole lobbying thing here in the US. Lobbying kinda became a weapon of mass usage and it's so wide spread in industries here in the US it's almost a must do (operating expense) if you wanna play in the global market/big business and protect yourself from outsiders (small business/start ups)? But more so just plain Greed. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirty_habiT Posted October 19, 2020 Share Posted October 19, 2020 The fentanyl problem is the same thing as the opiates problem. It's just stronger than heroine... the same "type of dope heads" use both drugs, and I'd say that fentanyl is just the new evolution of the heroine epidemic the world is facing. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirty_habiT Posted October 19, 2020 Share Posted October 19, 2020 3 hours ago, Dark_Knight said: I think that’d be a great idea. But how are we going to have our elected officials propose something that is against their own interest? I almost need to ask you.... is this an intentionally easy to answer question or rhetorical? I mean the obvious thing would be to not vote them in to begin with. The way it is set up now, the positions age and then new people get brought in. "The people" (us) are supposed to be the ones that are controlling who gets into these positions of power. When the election systems are cheated with 5k people from out of state going to a swing state and voting w/o ID's (don't know the accuracy, just heard this happened)... or many "leaders" pushing for open borders and no identification or documentation for people required to go vote. That's the kind of stuff that ruins a good thing. There are very selfish, very very greedy people, that don't give a rat's ass about any of our futures currently in the office, holding leadership positions in the USA. I'm not talking about our current President either. I'm talking about all these people that he has been firing left and right. The cronies are saying "he's firing good people so he can bring in his buddies and cheat the system", yet they are actually the ones that HAVE been cheating the system. They are upset that they've been found out and are being ousted. I bet there are a lot of them still in their jobs just wondering how long until what they've done is found out and they're head rolls too. This concept is the same thing as a kid punching another kid and then saying owwwww, falling down, rolling around crying, and saying the kid they just punched was punching them. It's such a stupid tactic and I know anyone reading this knows exactly the kind of thing I'm referring to. "He's firing good people so he can cheat the system, meanwhile we've been cheating the system with little disturbance for a very long time." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark_Knight Posted October 19, 2020 Share Posted October 19, 2020 I mean on a local and state level yeah, but the idea of getting the majority of Americans to rebel against the current system of the electoral process is just not going to happen. Just like us talking about defunding the military to help eliminate tax. You’ll never convince people to support that. Even the people who are anti tax would go against that. The people in charge control the narrative. Even if there are a larger group of critical thinkers out there now, I just don’t think it’s possible to convince the herd to go along with anything that isn’t told from them from above. On an optimistic view point : Bernie Sanders turned millions of Americans in to socialists and communists in 4 years time. So I suppose if one person with honest and true intentions like he had could come and shake things up just the same. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kults Posted October 19, 2020 Share Posted October 19, 2020 11 minutes ago, Dark_Knight said: On an optimistic view point : Bernie Sanders turned millions of Americans in to socialists and communists in 4 years time. So I suppose if one person with honest and true intentions like he had could come and shake things up just the same. oh CMON. “communism for thee but not for meeeee” https://www.google.ca/amp/s/www.politico.com/magazine/amp/story/2019/05/24/bernie-sanders-millionaires-226982 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark_Knight Posted October 19, 2020 Share Posted October 19, 2020 I think you missed the point I was making Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kults Posted October 19, 2020 Share Posted October 19, 2020 42 minutes ago, Dirty_habiT said: The fentanyl problem is the same thing as the opiates problem. It's just stronger than heroine... the same "type of dope heads" use both drugs, and I'd say that fentanyl is just the new evolution of the heroine epidemic the world is facing. ya kinda. It’s similar for sure and it is the same subset of people who use it. Fentanyl is 50x more deadly though, not to mention dirt cheap. lethal doses http://www.bccdc.ca/resource-gallery/Documents/Statistics and Research/Statistics and Reports/Overdose/Overdose Response Indicator Report.pdf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kults Posted October 19, 2020 Share Posted October 19, 2020 2 minutes ago, Dark_Knight said: I think you missed the point I was making Can you elaborate a bit? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark_Knight Posted October 19, 2020 Share Posted October 19, 2020 Whether you agree with him or not, his conviction was that of honesty and genuineness. Whether he practices what he preaches isn’t necessarily important in that regard. My point being is if he can drastically change the dynamic of American thought, someone else could too. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kults Posted October 19, 2020 Share Posted October 19, 2020 1 minute ago, Dark_Knight said: Whether you agree with him or not, his conviction was that of honesty and genuineness. Whether he practices what he preaches isn’t necessarily important in that regard. My point being is if he can drastically change the dynamic of American thought, someone else could too. disagree. how can you call it honest if he doesn’t practice what he preaches? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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