misteraven Posted November 1, 2018 Share Posted November 1, 2018 Current topic... Politics vs Pop Culture For those not familiar with these weigh in topics, definitely search "Weigh In" for some other good ones, like the Social Media discussion and the political correctness vs Teen Violence discussion. I woke up to find all kinds of posts about this new Supreme Stormy t-shirt and thought this made an interesting topic, though we've touched on a bit in many other threads. It's clear Supreme isn't new to taking political positions publicly or leveraging the massive platform and fan base to help distribute their position and influence the masses. Though at the end of the day, I think the freedom of speech and the right of individuals, as well as wholly private business and institution to take whatever position they want is rightfully guaranteed, I also believe that there are also times when it's more appropriate to stay out of the conversation. There was a lot of interesting analysis that goes into how a major faux pas in Hillary's presidential campaign was her efforts to leverage celebrities and influencers to help validate her message and position. It was said that this effort largely backfired because the average Mr and Mrs Smith out there was already disenfranchised by the excess and disconnect seen between the public at large versus the "elite". How on average, people love to see celebrities and entertainers doing their thing, but are largely turned off once that same group attempts to use their position to preach a position, most especially politics and social issues; both of which often comes off as ironic and even condescending coming from that group. Time and time again, we've all seen how they'll say one thing, but clearly live by a different standard, which is clearly afforded to them due to their wealth and success and increasingly often, their political connectedness. In any case and with all that said, I found myself really disappointed in Supreme's position. From Supreme's "About" page: https://www.supremenewyork.com/about Quote Supreme grew to embody downtown culture, and play an integral part in its constant regeneration. Skaters, punks, hip-hop heads — the young counter culture at large — all gravitated toward Supreme. Seeing as how overwhelming left the mainstream media, celebrities, athletes and people in urban areas are, it would seem to me that Supreme's political position and releases aren't "counter culture" at all. In fact, it's precisely what seems to be embraced by everything from most educational institutions to fortune 100 companies to the social media and tech companies that increasingly work their way into most facets of daily life in this country. Now for those that have been here for more than a minute or know me personally, also are clear that I'm no fan of Trump. I don't hate the guy, but I also feel he's pretty far down the best and brightest of who this country has to offer. More so, however, is I'm absolutely opposed to this binary dichotomy of red versus blue and especially concerned and absolutely against the divisiveness that comes with it all. In the case of Supreme, it would have been much more interesting, as well as much more keeping with the ideology and attitude they claim and project, if they were to pass on jumping on the bandwagon and instead take the third option, which would really be in keeping with "counter culture" and at least in my own humble opinion and much more valid position if your end goal is to help contribute to a better country / world. The third position I'm referring to is to step back from the binary dichotomy we see, where you pick a team and then due your "civic duty" to vote and help perpetuate that establishment, and instead see it for what it is... A complete charade in that neither party really practices what they preach and has strayed so far from the ideologies in which they were founded as to be unrecognizable. To instead rally behind a team, declare the other team your enemy and then spend an absurd amount of time tearing each other part with largely emotionally driven debate and slander, with near zero effort going towards critical though and analysis of fact and unbiased sources of information. I'm literally seeing people I consider rational and intelligent download apps that help them navigate the mid term ballot initiatives by dumbing it down to putting letting you pick if you're blue or red and then putting either a big green check or a big red x next top the initiative up for vote in your region. At that point, what's even the point of holding elections anymore when people are that misinformed and that partisan? Then to literally lose their minds when the other guys win. Anyhow, I truly believe that no good will come from this. That as a country, we've been so dumbed down and so blinded by decisiveness, anger and hate that is what drives modern politics, that it's nearly impossible to see how it can be fixed. Not sure how to orchestrate this on a national level, but we have all been taught since a very young age that when you're about to blow your top and throw a tantrum, that perhaps its best to take a step back, breath, count to 10 and maybe give the situation a second thought if its important and if your goal is get through it successfully. It's sad that in today's America, thinking like this is counter culture, but if you take a moment to observe the landscape, it's truly the road less traveled. I'd like to point out that it's not my intent to sway you from one team to the other. Rather, its my hope to simply get people to take a step back and question why we're all being pummeled from every angle to do so, while also being rallied into a frenzy to believe that those on the other team are wrong / evil / nazi / criminal / monster / etc / etc... That perhaps we might be able to have discussions and realize that most people just wants whats best for themselves and their loved ones and just disagree on how to get there based upon their own unique experiences and day to day reality. That maybe, we need to stop blindly rallying behind one team or another and rather look at the issues, seek to understand them, their history, context and impact. To really understand that if the goal is to make the world better, that marginalizing, let alone vilifying those that don't agree, isn't productive to having constructive dialogues. That the entire world and all its complexities can not always be reduced to a binary of right versus wrong. So in closing, a couple things I want to bring to your attention before I open this up for respectful discussion... 1. Statistical Probability In A Binary System - http://www.pas.rochester.edu/~stte/phy104-F00/notes-2.html Note: Ever wonder why a third option is rarely mentioned and always considered non viable? If there's only two choices, statically, each will come up approximately half the time. When you introduce a third option, that all falls to shit. No consider why any party that pops up that is not red or blue is ignored at first and then systematically dismantled as soon as it shows promise, ensuring the continuity that the first two remain in power, even if only half the time. Feel free to search for more on this subject and then consider how often we see only two options available for so many things and then consider how it might benefit the two options to maintain that dynamic to perpetuate the system. 2. A Current Look At The Great Lie Of Dichotomy Podcast - http://www.thesurvivalpodcast.com/the-great-lie-of-dichotomy I've dropped links and reference to this before, but will do so again as its relevant and IMHO critical for people to listen to, understand and apply. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kults Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 There's certainly a lot to unpack here. I believe and agree with you on the demonizing of others who don't hold similar beliefs. There was a time when it was all about culture and that's what made people gravitate towards certain ideologies. Nowadays it seem we've thrown that to the wayside and def play more of a team sport angle. The biggest disappointment for me is the death of all things civil and not belittling the other for not sharing our specific stance on some pretty broad issues. What ever happened to nuance and critical thought I have no idea. The rise of social media did not help that's for sure. Everything has to be broken down into these re-tweetable blurbs and streams of unchecked ID. Hardly anyone even takes the time to formulate coherent and comprehensive personal opinions on issues anymore, much easier to tow the ideological line and repeat talking points ad nauseam. We're all guilty of this on some level, sign of the times I guess. Sometimes progress isn't always for the best and in this particular time I think a little regression and pumping the breaks on all things new could be wise. That could also just be my own age talking, that's how I see it though. As bad and as polarized to the extremes as the political parties have gotten, I think the media hold the lion's share of the blame in stoking the fires of division. It comes down to the money though. Of course some influential players are pulling strings, that much is blatantly obvious to anyone who can read past the headlines but I also think its the MONEY involved. Either sides play to their most rabid base for that lucrative ad revenue and in the process create the manufactured narrative for the more passive to latch onto to. I miss the days of center left/right. There just isn't a viable option for self declared moderates anymore. Everything has become binary in the extreme, that's never good, in politics or otherwise. I play my part in all that too, sometimes its easier to dismiss with a wave of the hand when really, some of it resonates but the overall point is just not something you can get behind. Trump played off of all this brilliantly. Ya, the guys a grade A DOUCHE. He played the field like a master chess player though. For decades the wishes and well being of the middle class were dismissed by both sides. It's all about class and nothing to do with race. Trump saw this and basically Hi Jacked the GOP to tow that 'everyman' line, to great success. I don't think even his most ardent supporters back everything he says, though they love that he sticks it to the establishment. This was a wake up call. Ruling class needs to Listen to what people want and not ignore them or they WILL vote in a vile reality star purely out of disenfranchised spite. Lastly, Supreme goofed on this one. Its not a big deal, I still love the brand, you wont ever catch me burning shit I bought with hard earned money cause some design director decided to score a few points in his downtown circle. The irony of course is that this move is anything BUT counter culture, way to play yourselves Supreme. It puts chinks in their otherwise uber cool armor but they still have a lot of that capital to burn, if anyone could get away with it, its them. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
where Posted November 3, 2018 Share Posted November 3, 2018 The fact you censor a political thread speaks volumes..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hua Guofang Posted November 3, 2018 Share Posted November 3, 2018 More details on the censorship please! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kults Posted November 3, 2018 Share Posted November 3, 2018 13 hours ago, Hua Guofang said: More details on the censorship please! He had posted spam. Not censorship. Just maybe keep the nonsense out of a serious thread. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
where Posted November 4, 2018 Share Posted November 4, 2018 Posted some images used to convey an idea relevant to the topic and said “let’s coalesce,” and it was deleted. Not that it matters, but that magnifies the polarization of people that will only have a discussion on their terms Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kults Posted November 4, 2018 Share Posted November 4, 2018 10 hours ago, where said: Posted some images used to convey an idea relevant to the topic and said “let’s coalesce,” and it was deleted. Not that it matters, but that magnifies the polarization of people that will only have a discussion on their terms Na. It was spam. You posted one image of some wonky wood carving. Use words. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
where Posted November 4, 2018 Share Posted November 4, 2018 That’s your opinion. Personally I don’t think you’ve got the right to dictate how I communicate, obv raven does cause it’s his site but if you wanna be on some I’m taking my ball and going home shit it’s whatever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kults Posted November 4, 2018 Share Posted November 4, 2018 1 hour ago, where said: That’s your opinion. Personally I don’t think you’ve got the right to dictate how I communicate, obv raven does cause it’s his site but if you wanna be on some I’m taking my ball and going home shit it’s whatever. Do whatever you want, just don’t whine about censorship when you post spam. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
where Posted November 5, 2018 Share Posted November 5, 2018 I guess, collaborator cb web cuck boy 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kults Posted November 5, 2018 Share Posted November 5, 2018 10 hours ago, where said: I guess, collaborator cb web cuck boy Fuck off back to your ramblings Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
where Posted November 5, 2018 Share Posted November 5, 2018 You’re not my dad!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
misteraven Posted November 5, 2018 Author Share Posted November 5, 2018 Here's the warning I gave @where Generally I wouldn't share this, but since you're claiming censorship, I figured you'd support sharing it. Pretty reasonable request and respectfully delivered, in my own opinion. There's a huge difference between censorship and simply looking to keep threads clean. Especially ones I've taken effort with. If it's not for you. fair enough... Easy enough to add the nonsense to the steady stream of nonsense on Instagram or elsewhere online. And indeed, 12ozProphet is not a democracy. If anything, I manage it somewhat like the Constitutional Republic that is the USA, meaning there's a handful or rules that super cede everything else. But beyond it, I tend to leave topics to a consensus. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iloveboxcars Posted November 6, 2018 Share Posted November 6, 2018 Those in power have successfully put rivalism and factionalism at the forefront of the political zeitgeist so that no matter what the most pressing matter is (climate change, our completely corruptible and corrupted political system, mental health, natural disasters) we can not focus on those things. We instead are funneled into a system that completely blinds us to any relevant or viable argument from the other side (cherry picked and personally curated news feeds based on your past browsing history) until we are where we are today. Their media and yours is the problem. Media is the problem. The continuous boom of the drum as each new misleading article headline and paragraph is written guiding you to the line you were designed to fall in until empathy no longer exists for someone of differing opinions is the problem. Every moment of hypocrisy is repeated and droned on about over and over again by the media as though being a hypocrite is some sort of crime. It fucking isn't. You, I, We shouldn't care that someone said/did one thing yesterday and said/did something opposite today. That isn't the root of the problem. Everyone is a hypocrite in some sense. Why are we reporting on it? When there are video and audio recordings of the president pandering to literal racists and demeaning over half the U.S. population, why do we care that in 2013 he criticized Obama for doing something and now he is doing that same thing? It's just so incredibly stupid. Our voting systems and political system needs such a substantial overhaul where do you even start? Do you start with the absolute ridiculousness of a two party system when ideologies are much more nuanced than black and a slightly lighter shade of black? Do you start with the people in power being able to vote for their own raises while telling us unions are bad? Do you start with the inherent flaw in a system that allows groups to obfuscate the truth to such a degree that "lying" would be a better term for it, and not face any repercussion? How about the fact that because I live near more people than someone in the bumfuck of Missouri that my vote isn't worth as much as theirs is on the national stage or that someone losing the popular vote by such a large amount is still able to become president? OR when business owners such as The Waltons are among the richest people in the world while living off of what is essentially welfare because they refuse to pay their employees a reasonable wage. When will we begin to design a system that no longer rewards sociopaths over all others? When do we say as a nation this isn't working anymore. When do we say they've figured out how to game the system and they've won this game, it's time to rebuild or go scorched earth? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kults Posted November 6, 2018 Share Posted November 6, 2018 This week.. ffs guys we get it already ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
where Posted November 7, 2018 Share Posted November 7, 2018 To contribute a relevant opinion since I appreciate this site I feel like elements of politics, esp left shit, are inherently parts of street culture but the second it’s overt it’s played. Heads will be commoditized all day but let them feel they’re paying heed to the artist credence and shit pops. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirty_habiT Posted November 7, 2018 Share Posted November 7, 2018 Lol "I hate Texas". Please, someone stupid wear that shirt over here. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
misteraven Posted July 23, 2019 Author Share Posted July 23, 2019 Still relevant or nah? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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