Spoter Posted February 15, 2002 Share Posted February 15, 2002 Originally posted by Graff Jesus in my opinion, if you do the same piece 200 times, you're just as weak as the kid who did 1 piece with that same style. numbers don't make you a king. sorry. maybe king of the streets where numbers and spots are key, but if it's something like 200 freights or walls... nuh uh. that shit don't ride with me. i agree with cracked on alotta subjects, but i definately side with graff jesus on this one.anyone could do one thing 1000 times.that doesn't mean shit to me.you gotta push yourself to evolve.there are exceptions:throwups /tags bombing.these elements were practically made to be done quick and repeatedly to leave a trail of signatures saying simply"i was here".pieces are the art part of graffiti.if you can't switch up your pieces then maybe you aren't an all around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smart Posted February 15, 2002 Share Posted February 15, 2002 Originally posted by >>>spot<<< Ianyone could do one thing 1000 times how many have YOU done? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spoter Posted February 15, 2002 Share Posted February 15, 2002 i put in work don't worry about it.i'm not gonna prove myself to some kid on the net.i might spend some time on this site, but i actually PAINT.kids like you think you know something.i guess the internet is where you belong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smart Posted February 15, 2002 Share Posted February 15, 2002 heh, yeah, ok... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
*die* Posted February 15, 2002 Author Share Posted February 15, 2002 it funny when your downing and realized what you've done after Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seeking Posted February 15, 2002 Share Posted February 15, 2002 mber and onorok do basicaly the same pieces everytime they paint, and people shit themselfs everytime they see one of their trains. what cracked was saying, i believe, is that trains are about exposure. you dont paint a train so you can get a flic of it then send it to a magazine. you do it to put that train, and your name, out into circulation. with the millions of trains out there, it would be impossible to come up with different styles for each one, especially if your painting several trains a week. i would rather see a consistent style that was dope, than a bunch of half assed styles from a writer just in the name variety. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mud_buddha Posted February 15, 2002 Share Posted February 15, 2002 Originally posted by seeking innocence mber and onorok do basicaly the same pieces everytime they paint, and people shit themselfs everytime they see one of their trains. what cracked was saying, i believe, is that trains are about exposure. you dont paint a train so you can get a flic of it then send it to a magazine. you do it to put that train, and your name, out into circulation. with the millions of trains out there, it would be impossible to come up with different styles for each one, especially if your painting several trains a week. i would rather see a consistent style that was dope, than a bunch of half assed styles from a writer just in the name variety. There's a difference between a little variety and distinct styles, although I do think distinct styles is definitely an approachable goals if that's what you're aiming for. If you've got letters down, you have the interest and are willing to experiment (which means you are willing to fail), you can easily do many styles. That's reality. These days, most people aren't willing to fail, so they get into a comfort zone and start repeating themselves (with very little variety.) To me that's boring. If I was interested in starting a "how can you not like that guy" thread I could put together a long list of "known" writers that bore the fuck out of me with their serial repetitiveness. Some of the most jocked "superstars" on this board put me to sleep with their shampoo instruction careers. Look at some of the train era kings from NYC. Those guys did a lot of pieces and I can't think of many people that did the same shit every time. BLADE did fifty million cars and there's so much variety there it's not even funny. SEEN did a billion diff. styles, too. Blockbusters, bar letters, pure wild styles, etc. (the fact that he does the basically the same piece every time nowadays disturbs me) DONDI made it impossible to do the same piece over and over again by painting five hundred different names. Even if he worked in the same style, each piece was distinct enough to be unique. Many people don't even provide that uniqueness, they just provide a carbon copy of what's come before with like two doo-dads switched around. Boring as fuck. There are plenty of other examples of people who switch it up successfully with volume. For modern guys, BATES & CYCLE are two that spring immediately to mind, although there are dozens of other examples. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest sodapop7 Posted February 15, 2002 Share Posted February 15, 2002 Originally posted by seeking innocence it should really tell you something that the only people who start topics like this are very inexperienced writers, insecure about their own place in graff... i dont know anyone that actually sits around talking about what a 'king' is. agreed..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Graff Jesus Posted February 15, 2002 Share Posted February 15, 2002 Originally posted by mud_buddha There's a difference between a little variety and distinct styles, although I do think distinct styles is definitely an approachable goals if that's what you're aiming for. If you've got letters down, you have the interest and are willing to experiment (which means you are willing to fail), you can easily do many styles. That's reality. These days, most people aren't willing to fail, so they get into a comfort zone and start repeating themselves (with very little variety.) To me that's boring. If I was interested in starting a "how can you not like that guy" thread I could put together a long list of "known" writers that bore the fuck out of me with their serial repetitiveness. Some of the most jocked "superstars" on this board put me to sleep with their shampoo instruction careers. Look at some of the train era kings from NYC. Those guys did a lot of pieces and I can't think of many people that did the same shit every time. BLADE did fifty million cars and there's so much variety there it's not even funny. SEEN did a billion diff. styles, too. Blockbusters, bar letters, pure wild styles, etc. (the fact that he does the basically the same piece every time nowadays disturbs me) DONDI made it impossible to do the same piece over and over again by painting five hundred different names. Even if he worked in the same style, each piece was distinct enough to be unique. Many people don't even provide that uniqueness, they just provide a carbon copy of what's come before with like two doo-dads switched around. Boring as fuck. There are plenty of other examples of people who switch it up successfully with volume. For modern guys, BATES & CYCLE are two that spring immediately to mind, although there are dozens of other examples. i could have not said it better myself. thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fiberoptical Posted February 15, 2002 Share Posted February 15, 2002 the net has no relation as to what really goes on in these streets.and or do the mags really represent the whole of a certain city... Half of the kids who have certain names in their mouths ain't seeing these streets, and ain't walking these fuckers either.The real kings know what the fuck is going on and give dap where it is due....the rest of yall should just shut up, not worry about it and paint..then you will have kings giving you respect ...reading half of this shit makes me cringe...what the fuck you talking about.,.ghost, mber,rolex,cycle,cope,saber..sure I am not a fan of all their shit, but these fuckers paint...and they don't seem to stop....and to me...that is a king..someone who just keeps going and going.....doing their thing.I would rather see any of them up in the streets, than all of your internet names arguing over wacked styled kings...and as far as I see it...wack styled or not..a king is a king.....niggas know...niggas know.. :mad: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
23578 Posted February 15, 2002 Share Posted February 15, 2002 Originally posted by mud_buddha There's a difference between a little variety and distinct styles, although I do think distinct styles is definitely an approachable goals if that's what you're aiming for. If you've got letters down, you have the interest and are willing to experiment (which means you are willing to fail), you can easily do many styles. That's reality. These days, most people aren't willing to fail, so they get into a comfort zone and start repeating themselves (with very little variety.) To me that's boring. If I was interested in starting a "how can you not like that guy" thread I could put together a long list of "known" writers that bore the fuck out of me with their serial repetitiveness. Some of the most jocked "superstars" on this board put me to sleep with their shampoo instruction careers. Look at some of the train era kings from NYC. Those guys did a lot of pieces and I can't think of many people that did the same shit every time. BLADE did fifty million cars and there's so much variety there it's not even funny. SEEN did a billion diff. styles, too. Blockbusters, bar letters, pure wild styles, etc. (the fact that he does the basically the same piece every time nowadays disturbs me) DONDI made it impossible to do the same piece over and over again by painting five hundred different names. Even if he worked in the same style, each piece was distinct enough to be unique. Many people don't even provide that uniqueness, they just provide a carbon copy of what's come before with like two doo-dads switched around. Boring as fuck. There are plenty of other examples of people who switch it up successfully with volume. For modern guys, BATES & CYCLE are two that spring immediately to mind, although there are dozens of other examples. what this guy said, and graff jesus too. it's funny i automatically started this vein of talking about freights because that's common between all the us cities. what graff jesus said definately holds true, however, as far as street stuff. on that note, i'm a big fan of those people who stick with certain shit, it's boring after a few years, but whatever, it's there. it's all right to have your six or three grades so you can bust out A grade shit in the cuttier spots, and C grade shit on main street. rambling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seeking Posted February 16, 2002 Share Posted February 16, 2002 mud buddha, while i agree with you for the most part, i think there are a couple of things that need to be taken into account. 1. back in 'the day' alot of the stuff that was incredible then, would be pretty mediocre if done today. which isnt to say that it wasnt fresh, but with advancements in styles, quality and what not, there is a new level that must be achieved to be considered good. now a days people expect alot more from other writers. or atleast people that arent dick riding ass kissers expect more. because of this, there is alot less lee-way to fail. your letters have to be alot better these days. one bar that isnt perportional and it throws the whole piece off. for instance, keo posted some old trains recently, one was by cliff i think. now, personaly, dudes letters were not good. his 'ff' was all smashed together and totally didnt fit. but it was still fresh. why? cause it was then. cause it was on a ny subway. cause the standards werent the same. but, if someone posted that same piece today, done on a freight, they would get laughed at. what is the whole point? the point is that you could get away with having letters that were a little more 'lacking'. each piece was dope simply because it was accomplished, not just because of the letters. 2. this is purely speculation on my part, but i have a hard time believing that dondi, seen or any of the old time guys were painting 400, 500 trains a year. i could be totally off, but it just doesnt at all seem logisticly possible. there simply werent that many cars to paint on. that right there, automaticly makes it more of a reason to come up with different styles, because you're not going for a 'quality, quantity.' like you do on freights. its a completely different ball game. back then, if you painted one car, it got seen by tens of thousands of people in one day. with freights, you can go weeks before anyone really sees it, much less anyone that even cares that its there. so whats my point? well firstly, ive never painted the same outline twice in my life, but im also not putting up those numbers, but regardless. i have no problem with someone who does the same thing ten, twenty, even fifty times, when they are putting in that much work. jase for instance. ive seen alot of his stuff that looked similar, but its still fresh because each one is solid. i dont know. who cares what i think, and im sure i could have said it in much fewer words, but whatever. dinner time. dont anyone mistake what im saying, im not dissing any of the old guys, just saying Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest montanaman Posted February 16, 2002 Share Posted February 16, 2002 this is wat i mean about niggahs disrespecting old skool ... im tired of idiots trying to tell us how to,, or why didnt we do this,, or that wasnt looking right ... hey die im sure in some shape or form u have done bubble styles in ur throwies.. and some time u try putting arrows in ur shiyt too. now who the hell u think brought this whole puzzle together ... these cats got ideas back in the late 70 and in the mid 80s... where all that matter was slap ur shit up and hope it runs for a while or did it make it out the yard or is it on the way to the buff line.... theres a lot here your not thinking about and beside they pioneer the way for many im sure u must have bit a chunk off of it and flipped it ....like u said when these cats where out there rackin paint u was in preskool eating crayola crayon ... u shouldve kept ur opinions to your self and not had started this thread...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cracked Ass Posted February 16, 2002 Share Posted February 16, 2002 It sounds to me like a lot of people have forgotten the original point of graffiti. Get up. A lot. I'm not impressed by these style chameleons with no recognizable persona. If being able to rock six hundred styles is your thing, great - do whatever brings you enjoyment. There are some kings who did a lot of styles well, and you knew who it was right away, and I give them props. But the idea of clowning kings like Cope or Mber for not varying their style enough for YOUR tastes is equal parts wackness, ignorance and stupidity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spoter Posted February 16, 2002 Share Posted February 16, 2002 all graffiti writers paint for fame to a certain degree, but i think in a lotta cases fr8 writers are the biggest fame whores.i mean to stratigically paint the same piece so many times has definately that purpose for fame.of course that's heart, but the pure fun of painting gets lost in that sometimes.shit, maybe it's just me, but i get bored quick with one piece.i love the constant challenge to experiment with new styles.it gives a diferent experiment, flavor, memory to that night it was painted.i'm not saying do a complete different piece every time, but man...some people just bore me to hell.i just can't imagine anyone going out night after night for years painting the same piece and look back and feel accomplished.i mean fame is a major part of graff and i'm not knocking that, but you started because it was fun.but if fame is your goal, you'll eventually get the recognition painting the same piece 1000 times, cause people will catch it regardless.but that's definately notwhat i'm about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Graff Jesus Posted February 16, 2002 Share Posted February 16, 2002 Originally posted by >>>spot<<< all graffiti writers paint for fame to a certain degree, but i think in a lotta cases fr8 writers are the biggest fame whores.i mean to stratigically paint the same piece so many times has definately that purpose for fame.of course that's heart, but the pure fun of painting gets lost in that sometimes.shit, maybe it's just me, but i get bored quick with one piece.i love the constant challenge to experiment with new styles.it gives a diferent experiment, flavor, memory to that night it was painted.i'm not saying do a complete different piece every time, but man...some people just bore me to hell.i just can't imagine anyone going out night after night for years painting the same piece and look back and feel accomplished.i mean fame is a major part of graff and i'm not knocking that, but you started because it was fun.but if fame is your goal, you'll eventually get the recognition painting the same piece 1000 times, cause people will catch it regardless.but that's definately notwhat i'm about. feel me? i know dudes like we're talking about. shit i used to paint with em. this one guy who'll go unnamed has been doing the SAME DAMN PIECE for about 5 years now. he just switches little "connectors and splits" and he thinks it's dope. that shit isn't fresh!!! i don't know about the rest of you but i'm not a fucking machine. my graffiti isn't meant to be mass produced - i try and make it a one of a kind type deal. hopefully if someone catches a good amount of my stuff they will remember it, flick it, etc. i like catching good pieces and being able to look back and say "damn i caught some ill shit today". i get pissed off when i see the same guy's style over and over again. yeah dude may be up, but when you see his pieces do you flick em? what's the purpose if you've got albums of photos, but they're all carbon copies? what's the purpose if someone sees your shit on the regular but can't tell if it's the same train just coming back again and again? (yeah i know that's taking it a bit far) what makes things worse is that there are legions of toys coming up now who look up to these so called "kings". it just makes the whole cycle repeat. these kids wanna emulate what they see, then they never try to get better. they just do the same crap over and over. fuck that! i feel 100% what you said spot - hopefully this banter will cause some people to wise up and see things our way. :( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smart Posted February 16, 2002 Share Posted February 16, 2002 Originally posted by Graff Jesus i feel 100% what you said spot - hopefully this banter will cause some people to wise up and see things our way. :( yeah, I'm gonna defect over to your side now, EVERYONE CLOSE YOUR MINDS! IF IT'S NOT YOUR BAG, IT"S WRONG! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spoter Posted February 16, 2002 Share Posted February 16, 2002 loook smart(ass):you tried to make a comment on a paragraph that wasn't even ignorant, and yet you sounded pretty close minded and yourself.to each his own, i was just explaining how people that paint the same piece approach graffiti differently than the ones that paint a variety. g.jesus:yeah i've mentioned the flicking thing too before.you can be super up with the same piece, but the ones that stick out in the memory of whoever caught it are gonna be the nice pieces.i think that's the difference between getting simply "spotted" and getting "noticed and flicked".and numbers don't mean as much as they should.both quantity and quality take effort in time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smart Posted February 16, 2002 Share Posted February 16, 2002 Originally posted by >>>spot<<< loook smart(ass):you tried to make a comment on a paragraph that wasn't even ignorant, and yet you sounded pretty close minded and yourself.to each his own, i was just explaining how people that paint the same piece approach graffiti differently than the ones that paint a variety. well, looking back, it seemed that you said doing the 'the same thing', which could be anything, 1000 times is somehow worthless... I was pointing out that to paint 1000 pieces, you would have to average a little less than 3 a day for a year or 1 a day for 3 years... if you only painted 1 a week, it would take nearly 20 years to paint 1000 pieces, so, it seems like a bit bigger effort than you're willing to give credit for... then you called me 'kid', suggested that I don't paint, then you called me 'kid' AGAIN and suggested that I 'think I know something', implying, of course, that I know nothing. Further, you implied that I was close minded for pointing out the flaws in your words, instead of offering a blanket condemnation of countless other writers... ok, you win... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dukeofyork Posted February 16, 2002 Share Posted February 16, 2002 goddammit, shut up already.. paint what the fuck you want, when you want, and quit fucking worrying about what other people think of your shit. if you arent doing it for someone else, youll do what you want, be it the same outline every time, or something different every time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dukeofyork Posted February 16, 2002 Share Posted February 16, 2002 i thought that the whole point was to have fun and paint anyway.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExtraExtra Posted February 16, 2002 Share Posted February 16, 2002 anyone who does pieces and cant do a tag... has always been wack in my book. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THEMISHE Posted February 18, 2002 Share Posted February 18, 2002 I don't see how anyone could be bored by Saber's pieces, especially his most recent ones, they have so much going its just fucking crazy. To each his own I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MONSTERKIDZ Posted February 18, 2002 Share Posted February 18, 2002 im not gonna mention any names BUT i do agree that mosy of the kids u see pumped in the mags suck and do not represent whos doing the best quality out there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
destroyall Posted February 19, 2002 Share Posted February 19, 2002 Originally posted by IMFINETHANKYOU I don't see how anyone could be bored by Saber's pieces, especially his most recent ones, they have so much going its just fucking crazy. To each his own I guess. i dont want to sound like im jumping on the bandwagon but saber is and always has been the man. not only does he come hard on just about everything he does, but its also the spots he gets. the majority of them are unbelievable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MONSTERKIDZ Posted February 19, 2002 Share Posted February 19, 2002 Saber is off the hook along with most of MSK the kids i was thinking off hand were the guys doing that cartoon 80's style that has become so played out or the guys doing "abstract" pieces covering up the fact that they have no letters seems like the kids of today are all over that shapey crap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AKTERONE LA! Posted February 19, 2002 Share Posted February 19, 2002 Word on the street!! Word has it that the reason was like always sed" East coast has always hated on the West"...and shit like "Cope never liked LA also"....yo I don't really know...but I do agree with sum writters up in here and is better if this shit was just left alone...old newz...regardless SABER will still leave a mark in LA!!!;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Gerbik Posted February 19, 2002 Share Posted February 19, 2002 what the fuck are you talking about?????????????????????????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
9ign Posted February 19, 2002 Share Posted February 19, 2002 Originally posted by Mr. Gerbik what the fuck are you talking about?????????????????????????? Yeah, what he said. -9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
E-DubleSkilZ Posted February 19, 2002 Share Posted February 19, 2002 HUH? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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