breakfast menu Posted December 9, 2016 Share Posted December 9, 2016 i paid off my student loans this year, all of them. i am psyched about it. but since doing it months ago i didn't get any notice that it was all said and done, and you need that in case a credit report ever gets it wrong, or something. i did it proper (called to get the loan payoff amount and everything) so i had to see what was up. i called. the department of education added a balance of $0.12 to my debt after i paid it off. twelve cents. it's been accumulating interest for months. MONTHS! and if unchecked it would've gone delinquent and accrued even more fees. joke's on me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~KRYLON2~ Posted December 10, 2016 Share Posted December 10, 2016 That's how the man gets ya Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
One Man Banned Posted December 10, 2016 Share Posted December 10, 2016 Yeah, pretty much. But lucky you caught it, and even more lucky to have paid it off. Congrats are in order, it's a very lame milestone that many are still struggling to make. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brink Posted December 10, 2016 Share Posted December 10, 2016 Congratz my man Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~KRYLON2~ Posted December 12, 2016 Share Posted December 12, 2016 I was doing backflips when i paid my student loan debt off, it was only like 16k because i worked a full time job the whole time i was enrolled. I just didn't want to be to deep in the red right after graduating. I got some friends that are in real bad financial trouble because their degrees are pretty much worthless and non serviceable Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
breakfast menu Posted December 12, 2016 Author Share Posted December 12, 2016 thanks all, it's nice to close the book(s) on them. almost. i hope everyone who has outstanding loans pays it off and gets that feeling of security, word. the latest is i get to wait 30 days to see if the department of education discharges them or settles it, or whatever. it's dumb. it could be up to 23 cents by then, man Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
misteraven Posted December 12, 2016 Share Posted December 12, 2016 Not to thread jack, but this seems to naturally evolve towards a discussion on whether a college degree is even worth it anymore. Listened to an interesting podcast talking about the end of education as we know it. It seems to have been mostly objective and was just discussing the business of college versus the debt of college versus new technologies that could likely make college as we know it obsolete and even had a bit in there regarding robots and automation and how that is mostly being held back purposely because those that could easily automate would be impacting the economy to such a degree that it would greatly affect the business itself by creating massive unemployment that in turn means less customers. Anyhow, personally I went to college. Despite getting a full ride still incurred pretty large debt due to costs of living and because I was a dumbass and signed essentially every paper offered to me. I definitely learned a lot in college, but can't honestly say its anything I couldn't have learned from a good mentor or better self discipline. Seems basic, but shit like how to problem solve and how to focus. Though these broad strokes definitely play a part in my day to day, my degree and the specific skillset I was there to learn isn't often used and could easily be replaced bya couple good books, a few podcasts and a few months on lynda.com and itunes university. I believe there are even more options out there... Sites like Kahn Academy and Code Academy. Honestly its kind of nuts IMO for a kid these days to really go to college unless they're pursuing a licensed profession like being a doctor or engineer. Wondering what other peoples' experiences are in this regard? Forgot where I read it, but somewhere I read an article basically saying that the increase in pay from having a degree is more than offset by the cost of the education, even before factoring in the debt. Thoughts? Share... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shittles..TasteTheAsshole Posted December 12, 2016 Share Posted December 12, 2016 I'm with you on this Misteraven. I went to college & ended up with a five figure debt & didn't even get a job related to the field lol. If i could go back in time & invest in something else debt free, I would. It was a good life experience though not worth the debt for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
misteraven Posted December 12, 2016 Share Posted December 12, 2016 I'm with you on this Misteraven. I went to college & ended up with a five figure debt & didn't even get a job related to the field lol. If i could go back in time & invest in something else debt free, I would. It was a good life experience though not worth the debt for me. 5 figures isn't as bad as lots of what I've heard of. These days, graduating owing $120,000 - $150,000. I've even heard of people racking up $250k and more. So insane. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shittles..TasteTheAsshole Posted December 12, 2016 Share Posted December 12, 2016 Yeah that's nuts, I mean you can get a decent condo or in some places a small bungalow for 250K :grimacing: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
misteraven Posted December 12, 2016 Share Posted December 12, 2016 That is really nuts. $250k is actually several property down payments and then put up for rent. After a few years you pull equity and buy several more and continue. Literally wind up a real estate mogul. Or perhaps more realistic is invest in building a small online business... Spend some time on Code Academy and Lynda.com learning some basic design and development, $65 for a nice WordPress / WooCommerce theme on Themeforest and start small. Guessing after sticking with it for 4 years and using that money to invest, promote and grow, you'd find yourself in a better position at the end of those 4 years than a kid with a degree, looking for a job and carrying $250k of debt on their back. In regards to those in a creative field... Seeing a kid with a degree just tells me they don't know shit and they're in debt or have rich parents. I've advised several that they're better off moving to NYC, getting a job bar backing and beg the best studio they can find to let them work for free, even if its getting coffee and sweeping the floor. Guaranteed that if they're serious that by the time 4 years rolls around they're working with cameras, have a bad ass professional level portfolio and are likely earning money instead of carrying debt. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Jefe Uno Posted December 15, 2016 Share Posted December 15, 2016 Yeah, our educational system is pretty crazy. I got into tech by accident, really. I've always enjoyed design and technology, and as a kid just picked up basic programming and ran with it. Nowadays, there are so many resources available online for learning that type of thing (many for free), you can learn just about anything. Maybe not a true, deep understanding, but at least the basics. And from that, you can start to develop a network and learn from others. I ran into a kid I went to high school with a few years back. He was complaining how he hated his job as an accountant. The dude always hated math, but for some reason went to school to be an accountant. Still can't figure out that logic... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
One Man Banned Posted December 15, 2016 Share Posted December 15, 2016 Raven that's your 2nd post mentioning those places- they paying you to advertise? Lol. Yeah, went to school, racked up big debt similar to Raven. Lucky to have dwindled it down to where it might be gone in a year or 2. One of the things that was pointed out to me is that the people making student loans were doing so knowing that the odds would be stacked against people paying them back- forgot what the issue was here but a lot of loans were handed out in this fashion, at least at the time. School was a worthwhile experience overall, I guess. But- I will say that much of the learning and education that was the most meaningful did not come out of the classroom but from other activities as well as internship/training opportunities. When choosing an education these days one has to consider the overall cost of the education vs what you can earn with that education. There are definitely good job opportunities available that do not require a college education. There are also educational paths that you can get stuck on, like you earned a degree but a higher degree is needed to make up for the cost of living. The whole topic is worth exploring as far as what you get, is it needed, etc. I was commenting in another thread the other day that going to college does not equal being intelligent or being more intelligent than others. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
misteraven Posted December 15, 2016 Share Posted December 15, 2016 Yeah, our educational system is pretty crazy. I got into tech by accident, really. I've always enjoyed design and technology, and as a kid just picked up basic programming and ran with it. Nowadays, there are so many resources available online for learning that type of thing (many for free), you can learn just about anything. Maybe not a true, deep understanding, but at least the basics. And from that, you can start to develop a network and learn from others. I ran into a kid I went to high school with a few years back. He was complaining how he hated his job as an accountant. The dude always hated math, but for some reason went to school to be an accountant. Still can't figure out that logic... Yeah man, I agree totally... Honestly its a great time to be alive. Business has become a bit like what I think the wild frontier must have been like in that there's so much opportunity to explore new things and setup shop surrounded by tons of resources. I know entrepreneurism isn't a trait everyone has (and unfortunately seems to be discouraged by politicians and legislations if you you're to take a look at what's happening), but there's really not much excuse for not setting up a small website and developing a business model for it. Or, using the resources online to expand or diversify ones skill set, at least enough to be able to slide into a mentor or internship situation and then evolve it forward even further into a career. I know it sounds easier said than done, but truth is if you're motivated, the opportunities are certainly available. Looping this back to on topic, really is getting harder to justify the cost / investment of a degree all this considered. Unless of course you're going towards a licensed profession. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
misteraven Posted December 15, 2016 Share Posted December 15, 2016 Raven that's your 2nd post mentioning those places- they paying you to advertise? Lol. LOL, nah.... I really believe they're that good! On lynda.com I took a few courses on stuff I know very well and honestly, they're instruction is beyond anything I've seen anywhere else, whether books or live instruction. Actually learned some new stuff. On Kahn Academy I took some advanced math lessons for shit I was never able to grasp in school and again, they made it so freakin easy to understand. Definitely endorse them, but not being paid! Yeah, went to school, racked up big debt similar to Raven. Lucky to have dwindled it down to where it might be gone in a year or 2. One of the things that was pointed out to me is that the people making student loans were doing so knowing that the odds would be stacked against people paying them back- forgot what the issue was here but a lot of loans were handed out in this fashion, at least at the time. This is one of the largest looming financial catastrophes on the horizon. This and unfunded liabilities that some economists put at somewhere in the range of $250 - $400 trillion dollars since the government finally stopped reporting these (I believe under the Clinton administration). Both are reaching a critical juncture in the next decade. Scary stuff... School was a worthwhile experience overall, I guess. But- I will say that much of the learning and education that was the most meaningful did not come out of the classroom but from other activities as well as internship/training opportunities. When choosing an education these days one has to consider the overall cost of the education vs what you can earn with that education. There are definitely good job opportunities available that do not require a college education. There are also educational paths that you can get stuck on, like you earned a degree but a higher degree is needed to make up for the cost of living. The whole topic is worth exploring as far as what you get, is it needed, etc. I was commenting in another thread the other day that going to college does not equal being intelligent or being more intelligent than others. 100% agree. Shame that most kids graduating high school just aren't equipped to make this decision and most parents are brainwashed into thinking you're standing in society is lesser if you don't hold a 'respectable' degree. I've read / heard people actually talk down on professions like mechanics, despite the fact that there's opportunities there to earn incomes that far exceed the national average. I know of a guy that has a metal shop that literally earns 7 figures and dude has no college and is well under 30. Just customizes old cars and harley's. I really do hope we see a return to mentoring... No doubt this doesn't scale as easily as a financial institution can, but I believe it's far better if the goal is to get good at something and quickly setup in a practical sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
breakfast menu Posted December 16, 2016 Author Share Posted December 16, 2016 i'm all for a thread jack on this topic. i graduated with a debt in the five figures six years ago, took subsidized and unsubsidized loans. i transferred into a private name-brand school because i bought the hype about it; one of the biggest mistakes i made in education and elsewhere. (well, my parents bought the hype too.) the idea that everyone needs to go to college is insane, the costs around it are insane. that was one of my biggest beefs with the "free college for all" crowd this year - there was no way to control the costs of college, which has been wildly outpacing inflation for some time now, owing partially to an explosion in the size of college administrations and overhead. and as raven and many others pointed out, you can/often do make a living on more than a degree alone. plenty of people with degrees struggle to do that. i think some of what's taught in high school and some of what's taught in college should be swapped. remedial courses like pre-calc shouldn't be taught in college at all (and i took pre-calc in college). that stuff should stay at the high school level. if you test into college-level math, by all means, go; we need you. if you test into college-level writing and reading comprehension, by all means, go if it makes sense. at the same time, financial management courses and the like that are often only found in business school should be taught in high school. kids should know how to pay a bill, balance a checkbook, take out a loan, etc. this would never happen because financial institutions need consumers who don't know what they're doing. but i think this shit's vital. [another on my high school curriculum: a requirement that you work an hourly, entry level customer-facing job for at least 3 months; this does more to prepare someone for the real world than any course i've ever taken and the best people i've worked with, especially in adult professional life, have been people who've worked those jobs.] imo, college should be a place to learn and advance thinking and education on a particular topic. advance sciences, arts, etc. and i don't think the government should pay for all of it. outside of fields that require one, a degree DOES NOT and SHOULD NOT be viewed as a guarantor of a job. that's a deception. a liberal arts education isn't a guarantee of a job (which is okay!). merit and/or money should get you into a college if you want to pursue a liberal arts education. a more comprehensive high school curriculum and degree would help identify people who can and should pursue higher learning. i should've learned to fix cars. $0.02 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
__ __ __ __ Posted December 20, 2016 Share Posted December 20, 2016 I do front-end work in the web industry. I went to school when it was just starting to pick up momentum in regards to Visual Design taking over and Responsive websites were just starting to emerge. When I was in school the only parts I paid attention to was Graphic Design, HTML,CSS, Video and Sound Design(for trailers, video shit). Anyway, I was there for 3 years and got a 5 figure debt at the time not caring cuz I had a little one coming and just had to get up off the couch and figure out what can make me some decent money. Even 3 years ago I noticed there are so many free resources to learn how to code and build web apps etc. So for my field you don't need to go to school, you just need to know that you enjoy code enough to create small projects for yourself, truly study to learn the basics and push yourself to alway tryout new technology. Raven pointed out pretty much those most popular ones, however youtube has a lot of independent developers teaching. I think all creative fields pretty much just want to see that you know what you are doing and that you can own your work. We have hired people with marketing backgrounds that just like coding or graphic design, same with customer service people that wanna learn. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
misteraven Posted December 20, 2016 Share Posted December 20, 2016 I do front-end work in the web industry. I went to school when it was just starting to pick up momentum in regards to Visual Design taking over and Responsive websites were just starting to emerge. When I was in school the only parts I paid attention to was Graphic Design, HTML,CSS, Video and Sound Design(for trailers, video shit). Anyway, I was there for 3 years and got a 5 figure debt at the time not caring cuz I had a little one coming and just had to get up off the couch and figure out what can make me some decent money. Even 3 years ago I noticed there are so many free resources to learn how to code and build web apps etc. So for my field you don't need to go to school, you just need to know that you enjoy code enough to create small projects for yourself, truly study to learn the basics and push yourself to alway tryout new technology. Raven pointed out pretty much those most popular ones, however youtube has a lot of independent developers teaching. I think all creative fields pretty much just want to see that you know what you are doing and that you can own your work. We have hired people with marketing backgrounds that just like coding or graphic design, same with customer service people that wanna learn. That's awesome man, thanks for sharing that story. Seems this thread is becoming a bit of testimonial on the subject form various points of view. Would be really interesting to see the trend continue on here and hear from others that can chime and tell their story as to whether a college education had a net positive / neutral / negative effect on their career and overall life so far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
__ __ __ __ Posted December 20, 2016 Share Posted December 20, 2016 Yeah, I agree. For sure though, what I learned in school was out of date even when I was learning to code. I was interning at a place pushing for responsive web design as a standard and my teacher was like no its a fad...haha 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boodah Posted December 20, 2016 Share Posted December 20, 2016 I thought I was excaping student loans by diving into work after dropping out of school senior year. Biggest fuck up that I've learned is blaming an entire resume of shitty work-stays on my money problems. I have hopes for Trump's presidency, and the last eight years have been absolute hell. I made it through, beaten down by living at moms, drinking my way through nights of bleeding out money. A lot of it was my lack of wanting to work in a political state of CA's very personal problematic Bay Area bullshit, which was highly influenced by my East Coast family's ties in Obama's reign of terror. I know it's not commonly held in high regard here, but I started work when it was still the Bush era. Working in high end restaurants kind of forces you into trickle down economics, and I had the highest positions that I could, being front of house, which was usually right in the dead middle pack of a lot of heavy hitters. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
misteraven Posted December 21, 2016 Share Posted December 21, 2016 I thought I was excaping student loans by diving into work after dropping out of school senior year. Biggest fuck up that I've learned is blaming an entire resume of shitty work-stays on my money problems. I have hopes for Trump's presidency, and the last eight years have been absolute hell. I made it through, beaten down by living at moms, drinking my way through nights of bleeding out money. A lot of it was my lack of wanting to work in a political state of CA's very personal problematic Bay Area bullshit, which was highly influenced by my East Coast family's ties in Obama's reign of terror. I know it's not commonly held in high regard here, but I started work when it was still the Bush era. Working in high end restaurants kind of forces you into trickle down economics, and I had the highest positions that I could, being front of house, which was usually right in the dead middle pack of a lot of heavy hitters. Not sure I understand what you're saying. Can you please elaborate? Interested in hearing your story and all I can gather is you skipped the college route so would like to hear the different perspective you have from those that have spoken up so far. Only bits I understood was the high hopes for this next administration (hopeful as well as I'm not a fan of these last 8 years myself despite having been a hopeful supporter in 08). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
misteraven Posted December 21, 2016 Share Posted December 21, 2016 Yeah, I agree. For sure though, what I learned in school was out of date even when I was learning to code. I was interning at a place pushing for responsive web design as a standard and my teacher was like no its a fad...haha Not for nothing, but I also thought responsive design would be a trend. Reason is I'm old enough to remember the Flash era when companies would sometimes build a slick site in Flash and then stripped down version in HTML with a landing page that checked for the plugin and prompted you to have a minimum browser version and Flash plugin, but would give you an option to view an HTML version anyways. I still find it a little crazy that most people have a hard enough time developing and maintaining a decent site and now you need to account for 3 - 5+ viewport sizes and design / develop an optimized solution to each. I suspect if it wasn't for free / commercial themes and an abundance of open source bootstrap projects, responsive design would have stalled out. Now its simple enough to download a responsive theme and slightly tweak colors and general shit and maybe slightly customizing the desktop version of it. Still a pretty big pain in the ass once you get past that and need to start testing across mobile / tablet (portrait and landscape), then desktop and now responsive assets for 4k and retina. It's a lot to wrestle with unless you're pretty dedicated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boodah Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 Not for nothing, but I also thought responsive design would be a trend. Reason is I'm old enough to remember the Flash era when companies would sometimes build a slick site in Flash and then stripped down version in HTML with a landing page that checked for the plugin and prompted you to have a minimum browser version and Flash plugin, but would give you an option to view an HTML version anyways. I still find it a little crazy that most people have a hard enough time developing and maintaining a decent site and now you need to account for 3 - 5+ viewport sizes and design / develop an optimized solution to each. I suspect if it wasn't for free / commercial themes and an abundance of open source bootstrap projects, responsive design would have stalled out. Now its simple enough to download a responsive theme and slightly tweak colors and general shit and maybe slightly customizing the desktop version of it. Still a pretty big pain in the ass once you get past that and need to start testing across mobile / tablet (portrait and landscape), then desktop and now responsive assets for 4k and retina. It's a lot to wrestle with unless you're pretty dedicated. Hearst is spoken for since the early 19th century. Just released as news scandals in the middle 20th. It's just cowardice and racial vs. ignorance of language usage and racism as similarities so fine lined that no one cares to read last, trust and speak and hold old friends through 8 or 4 years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Jefe Uno Posted December 24, 2016 Share Posted December 24, 2016 Yeah, I agree. For sure though, what I learned in school was out of date even when I was learning to code. I had a similar experience. I worked at a sign shop in high school, and we started doing websites for local businesses. After high school I picked up a couple web classes at a community college. Some of the shit they taught wasn't just out of date, it was straight up wrong, haha. Learned more from Googling shit at the sign shop than I ever did in school. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MedicineCabinet Posted June 16, 2017 Share Posted June 16, 2017 file down 12 pennies and jam their doors. or just use gum 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirty_habiT Posted July 6, 2017 Share Posted July 6, 2017 I'm an example of someone who didn't go to college and managed to "make it". I'm going to be 35 in August and by myself I'm bringing in well above the average family income in Austin, TX. It really happened because I self studied and always liked to nerd out on linux stuff in my free time. I've done a ton of jobs that weren't my specialty getting to where I am now. It took a lot of work on my part that nobody could do for me or help me with. I was a diesel mechanic, a photo lab technician at Eckerds, my first job was a cook at KFC, I resurfaced counter tops and bath tubs using tools and techniques used to paint cars, I poured concrete with a good friend for a year, and I finally got my foot in the door at a web host back in 2002. I'll share a good resource that I've been reading the daily newsletters from lately that has great work place advice. Ladders.com (no I'm not being paid for advertising) used to specialize in 6 figure and up jobs only. It was a job search site and still is but I think they're under different owners now. Anyway, the point is they have some really great tips that they email out several times a week that I thought was click bait in my email box to begin with. I finally looked at one and realized, holy shit, this info is good info. For anyone having trouble finding direction or trying to figure out how to improve their chances of moving up the ladder there are some great mentors that have been writing articles for their emails on that site. On the subject of college: I never could figure out what I wanted to go to school for because I never could figure out what I'd be happy doing for any long period of time. Doing all the odd jobs I did taught me about working and getting along with people. A job is almost what I'd describe to be like jail, you're forced to be here because you have to pay bills, and you may not like everyone that is here but you still have to be here. The better you are at getting along with others and positioning yourself for success the easier time you'll have getting where you want to go. I know that's going to be a far fetched analogy for some people but it makes sense to me after dealing with coworkers that are annoying to me in a place that I want to be successful at. Today I'd like to attend some community college classes, but I want to do it by paying for the classes straight up out of pocket. I want to learn welding so that I can make things that I can potentially sell or do welding services for people that are willing to pay for them. In any case, I hope this is inspiration for someone that is reading and feels stuck. Keep working. Oh, one last thing, the biggest pay raises you will ever get are not going to be within the company you're currently at. It will be from jumping ship to a new job. Never be afraid to negotiate salary because employers want to lowball you and get good work for cheap when their budget usually allows for more than they're offering up front. Good thread and I hope to hear more good stories here. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 25, 2017 Share Posted July 25, 2017 Once you get out, they keep pulling you back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TPWF2021 Posted August 4, 2017 Share Posted August 4, 2017 I graduated high school a year later than planned, joined the marines seeing as I didn't want to be where I was at and if I was going to do it might as well do it all the way. Fast forward to now I am now out of the military 1year and 6 months, mid twenties without a clue as to what I want to do with myself I've been working jobs here and there, barbacking and warehouse jobs, just to make ends meet. I'm currently enrolled in college only really doing it for the money and I guess a education wouldn't be bad either. Still I can't see myself wasting another four years on an education I won't be using. Also currently on third round hiring process of fire rescue for the county. I guess what I'm trying to say is should I do this college thing or this fire rescue thing? I pologize for my shitty sentences and stuff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fist 666 Posted August 4, 2017 Share Posted August 4, 2017 @TPWF2021 GI Bill was a great experience for me. But you get out what you put into it. There is a new version of the Gi Bill (from montgomery or post 9/11) called Forever Gi Bill or some shit that could get passed within the next few months--with some variance on what type of schools it can be used for, such as coding bootcamps, if you're looking for something different than the traditional undergrad experience. Pick a city with a high cost of living and get some high BAH. Denver is about 2200/mo nowadays, Boston and NY are several thousand/month. Make it work for you. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tavaruawon Posted August 8, 2017 Share Posted August 8, 2017 Nice thread. Hella mad fitting-like for whats going on in my life right now, it's also pretty interesting to see where some of you folks have gone with your careers & lives over the years. I feel like I am at a critical point, a junction in my own life. School or Keep on with my trades. I dunno. My situation is hard as fuck to explain - I have been heavily, and deeply entrenched in Humboldt. All facets, 2010 is when I got to manage my first property. Agricultural Manager is what my resume says just to alleviate a 5 year employment gap. I began a transition back to the legitimate side of things and suddenly found myself working HVAC in the Bay Area. Those warehouse grows in Oakland, all the ducting, climate control and ventilation. Yeah HVAC. Meanwhile my little brother is graduating from UCSC (Santa Cruz) with a heavy environmental degree and it's like the race is on. These would be my last years to go beast in school on grants and test out ASAP just to have the piece of paper... that ironically doesnt seem to mean much. And with a lot of the trades I'm looking towards- I just dont want to go Union. Fuck the union. I've had people tell me to create two separate resume's, one for the cannabis industry and one for the rest... I am trying to walk both sides of the fence...this strange grey area the industry sits within. Federally fuckable, and state tolerance is so unpredictable. Hmm. Irons in the fire, I gotta sort my shit out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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