U.S. Marines give golden shower to dead Taliban soldiers

[Decyferon]

^ probably just a drop in the ocean!

[LUGR]

Well if you think about all the pee in the worlds oceans, that might explain why they buried him at sea?

[toluene_causes_tumors]

i used to have typical bullshit white guilt sympathy for afghani people but no mas. fuck em. kill em all. rebuild the country with strip malls, then profit.

[Weapon X]

But most Afghani people I've met in Canada have been cool. As have been Iraqis. It's Iran that needs to get carpet bombed the fuck up and have the women and children killed, IMHO.

[Decyferon]

there is nothing wrong with the Iranian people it is the people in power in Iran that need to be wiped out.

[Walid Jumblat]

Erm no, Bin Laden died a decade ago of kidney failure and the bullshit faux news broadcast to the public was that his body was dumped at sea. But please show me were it is tradition in Islamic culture to bury the dead at sea?

 

Who is the real terrorist when a foreign army invades and occupies a country seeing civilian deaths as collateral. Soldiers are nothing but pawns in a bigger game, but wow you have morals because you don't think it is right to piss on a dead body. Speaking of 'them' the US (CIA) created the Taliban to fight the Soviets in the 70's. It's all documented, but the fairy tales just keep getting told, the minute you sign up to any army in any nation you become a slave.

 

The military, since McNamara, is a no longer a place for patriotism and honor. Instead it is all about a rationalized and calculated approach to war that is based around men in steel ships sitting 30 miles off shore raining remote control death on people they will never see.

 

[Weapon X]

there is nothing wrong with the Iranian people it is the people in power in Iran that need to be wiped out.

 

There is everything wrong with persian people. those who prefer to be called persian are actually against the state of iran. it doesn't mean that 99% of them are not upright animals that should be put down for the sake of society.

[LUGR]

Hmmm most Iranians I have met around the world have been cool. It's Canada that needs to get carpet bombed the fuck up and have the women and children killed, IMHO.

[Fist 666]

i like where this is going.

[Decyferon]

Hmmm most Iranians I have met around the world have been cool. It's Canada that needs to get carpet bombed the fuck up and have the women and children killed, IMHO.

 

THIS

 

every Iranian person I have met has been cool and friendly, whats that all aboot?

[Dr. Scientist]

Wrong. They are number of recruits is down because we are in the middle of downsizing. We do not need as many.

 

Also the quality of recruits we are currently getting are by far some of the best when it comes to measurable benchmarks. If you are not quality, you are not getting in.

 

Judging by the way they're pulling kids out of high school in NYC and aggressively recruiting kids out on the street in front of Army "career centers" tells a completely different story.

 

I have friends who work in the public school system that have recruiters beating their doors down, begging and crying, even offering border line bribes to get inside and get at those kids cause enrollment in the military is at a low point.

 

. . .but hey, I never claimed to know everything. I'm just basing my opinion on what i see here in New York.

[LUGR]

Yeah, I am sure the recruiters were crying. What kind of example would that be to prospective soldiers?

 

idiot

[CILONE/SK]

If it is at a school, it is because of the quotas for the ASVAB. It is not related to actual recruiting goals.

 

I find myself in alot of high schools dealing with tests and counselors, but I am not a recruiter. I could care less if anyone actually joins, but I will ensure that we meet our testing goals because that is my mission. Not only is the amount of people taking the ASVAB a goal, but also the amount of schools that let us test is measurable too.

 

Just because you see something, it is not always what you think it is.

[CILONE/SK]

Also if a recruiter can get a large DEP pool, they will not have to contact as many people when their mission increases. So, they make contacts and get kids qualified, but they will put them on hold until there is a need.

 

I know all about this, because it is what I do.

[Realism]

Yeeeaaah, I'm gonna have to say that Cilone is probably a little more informed about military recruitment than someone who has friends that have dealt with recruiters at work.

 

There was an awesome argument about such things in another thread.

[Dr. Scientist]

Yeah, I am sure the recruiters were crying. What kind of example would that be to prospective soldiers?

 

idiot

 

Yes I'm an idiot and that's exactly what I meant, word for word. They were in the gym in front of 300 students, wearing full uniform, on their hands and knees crying into an American Flag with a bald eagle perched on their shoulder.

 

Yeeeaaah, I'm gonna have to say that Cilone is probably a little more informed about military recruitment than someone who has friends that have dealt with recruiters at work.

 

There was an awesome argument about such things in another thread.

 

I said up top that I didn't really know and was only going by what I see and hear in New York. The recruiters told my friends that their numbers were down, and blah blah blah. . . The staff and the recruiters spend a lot of time together talking shit, they're there a few days a week all year long. So I'm just telling you what I heard. . .

 

. . . but I'll take CILONE's word for it. I trust that he knows more about it than I do.

[Walid Jumblat]

Vast majority of Iranians I have met have been really well educated, definitely relaxed and a lot of the women have been fucking bangin. I can easily say that per capita I have met more cool Iranians than I have met cool Poms. The only people I have met where I have a problem with the majority have been the Lebanese. However that is probably because I've been subjected to a pretty specific group of Lebs only, the ones who ended up in Sydney as refugees.

[Decyferon]

my wife is half iranian (she hates iranians, mainly the men) the other half is german

 

Vast majority of Iranians I have met have been really well educated, definitely relaxed and a lot of the women have been fucking bangin. I can easily say that per capita I have met more cool Iranians than I have met cool Poms. The only people I have met where I have a problem with the majority have been the Lebanese. However that is probably because I've been subjected to a pretty specific group of Lebs only, the ones who ended up in Sydney as refugees.

 

[Walid Jumblat]

They do exist (sorry about that, didn't mean to be insulting!), unfortunately my main exposure has been backpackers and the Barmy Army. Not really a representative sample group given that I fucking hate most cricket fans along with backpackers and their bullshit spiritual journey bullshit they think they've had because they went to a full moon party in Thailand and dropped an E. I fucking hate hippy bongo playing dreadlock shit tattoo mooching ass backpackers.

[CALIgula]

Erm no, Bin Laden died a decade ago of kidney failure and the bullshit faux news broadcast to the public was that his body was dumped at sea. But please show me were it is tradition in Islamic culture to bury the dead at sea?

 

Who is the real terrorist when a foreign army invades and occupies a country seeing civilian deaths as collateral. Soldiers are nothing but pawns in a bigger game, but wow you have morals because you don't think it is right to piss on a dead body. Speaking of 'them' the US (CIA) created the Taliban to fight the Soviets in the 70's. It's all documented, but the fairy tales just keep getting told, the minute you sign up to any army in any nation you become a slave.

 

The military, since McNamara, is a no longer a place for patriotism and honor. Instead it is all about a rationalized and calculated approach to war that is based around men in steel ships sitting 30 miles off shore raining remote control death on people they will never see.

 

 

Ok, first, you show me proof that Bin Laden died 10 years ago....especially when al qaeda confirmed that he indeed was killed by the U.S....then I will show you proof of the burial at sea thing....matter of fact....no.....i will show you proof without you proving your conspiracy theory to me:

 

Islam

 

The sacred texts of Islam prefer burial on land, "so deep that its smell does not come out and the beasts of prey do not dig it out". However, if a person dies at sea and it is not possible to bring the body back to land before decay, or if burial at land becomes impossible, burial at sea is allowed. A weight is tied to the feet of the body, and the body is lowered into the water. This would preferably occur in an area where the remains are not immediately eaten by scavengers. Also, if an enemy may dig up the grave to mutilate the body, it is also allowed to bury the deceased at sea to avoid mutilation.[2]

In the Sunni Fiqh book Umdat al-Salik wa Uddat al-Nasik, the condition for sea burial is:

It is best to bury him (the deceased) in the cemetery... If someone dies on a ship and it is impossible to bury him on land, the body is placed (O: tightly lashed) between two planks (O: to obviate bloating) and thrown into the sea (O: so that it reaches shore, even if the inhabitants are non-Muslims, since a Muslim might find the body and bury it facing the direction of prayer (qibla)).[3]

secondly, i agree with you about faux news...i fucking cant stand them and they do in fact lie...everyone from hanity to greta to oreilly to stossel to beck....ESPECIALLY glenn beck.

 

i kind of agree with your slave comment, BUT even though we created the monster known as the taliban to fight communism, the fact is that we were initially at war with al qaeda..the taliban just gave al qaeda a safehaven by giving them a country to stay in...when we went in the country to get al qaeda and bin laden, the taliban fought against us....and about "invading a foreign country"...its more of overthrowing an oppressive govt while finding al qaeda rather than invading them....go read "a thousand splendid suns"...you'll understand...i have the hardback copy of the book if you need to borrow it.

[CALIgula]

The only people I have met where I have a problem with the majority have been the Lebanese. However that is probably because I've been subjected to a pretty specific group of Lebs only, the ones who ended up in Sydney as refugees.

 

so, when your location says "beirut" thats sarcasm because there are a lot of lebanese in sydeny?

 

i remember the whole incident with the lebanese people on the beach attacked the lifeguards and then there were full on riots against them

 

 

 

[CALIgula]

But most Afghani people I've met in Canada have been cool. As have been Iraqis. It's Iran that needs to get carpet bombed the fuck up and have the women and children killed, IMHO.

 

 

hey, heres an idea.....lets not "carpet bomb the fuck" out of anybody...especially women and children.

 

instead how about spend our money on...oh...i dont know....jobs....the economy....maybe even education??...maybe that will help with the lack of tolerance for other people.

 

 

and here i was thinking canadians were tolerant...you're in toronto right weapon?...i believe theres a huge iranian population in toronto...so, something must have happened to you where you want their women and children to die.

 

care to share?

[cuntflaps]

Ok, first, you show me proof that Bin Laden died 10 years ago....especially when al qaeda confirmed that he indeed was killed by the U.S....then I will show you proof of the burial at sea thing....matter of fact....no.....i will show you proof without you proving your conspiracy theory to me:

 

Islam

 

The sacred texts of Islam prefer burial on land, "so deep that its smell does not come out and the beasts of prey do not dig it out". However, if a person dies at sea and it is not possible to bring the body back to land before decay, or if burial at land becomes impossible, burial at sea is allowed. A weight is tied to the feet of the body, and the body is lowered into the water. This would preferably occur in an area where the remains are not immediately eaten by scavengers. Also, if an enemy may dig up the grave to mutilate the body, it is also allowed to bury the deceased at sea to avoid mutilation.[2]

In the Sunni Fiqh book Umdat al-Salik wa Uddat al-Nasik, the condition for sea burial is:

It is best to bury him (the deceased) in the cemetery... If someone dies on a ship and it is impossible to bury him on land, the body is placed (O: tightly lashed) between two planks (O: to obviate bloating) and thrown into the sea (O: so that it reaches shore, even if the inhabitants are non-Muslims, since a Muslim might find the body and bury it facing the direction of prayer (qibla)).[3]

secondly, i agree with you about faux news...i fucking cant stand them and they do in fact lie...everyone from hanity to greta to oreilly to stossel to beck....ESPECIALLY glenn beck.

 

i kind of agree with your slave comment, BUT even though we created the monster known as the taliban to fight communism, the fact is that we were initially at war with al qaeda..the taliban just gave al qaeda a safehaven by giving them a country to stay in...when we went in the country to get al qaeda and bin laden, the taliban fought against us....and about "invading a foreign country"...its more of overthrowing an oppressive govt while finding al qaeda rather than invading them....go read "a thousand splendid suns"...you'll understand...i have the hardback copy of the book if you need to borrow it.

 

Osama Bin Laden was one of the 54 children of Mohammed bin Awad bin Laden, a construction magnate who made his fortune by cozying up to the royal family of Saudi Arabia. The bin Laden family has had an intimate relationship with the upper reaches of global power politics for the past half a century.

 

In 1976 Salem bin Laden, Osama’s half-brother, co-founded Arbusto Energy with George W. Bush.

 

In 1996, after the bombing of the Khobar Towers for which Osama took credit, the Saudi Binladen Group was given the contract to rebuild the facility (see article on page 14).

 

Also in 1996, FBI agents in the Washington field office were investigating the World Assembly of Muslim Youth, a suspected terrorist organization that included Abdullah Bin Laden, the group’s president and treasurer, and Omar Bin Laden. BBC News uncovered internal FBI documents showing how the agents were ordered to stop their investigation. The case was only reopened the week after 9/11 and the day after both brothers fled the US with FBI permission.

 

In 1998, another FBI investigation into the Bin Laden brothers, this one initated by the New York field office, was called off by the State Department because, it was revealed, the Bin Laden family had been granted Saudi diplomatic passports in 1996 and thus had diplomatic immunity inside the United States.

 

On the morning of 9/11, Osama bin Laden’s half-brother, Shafig bin Laden, was the guest of honour at a meeting of the Carlyle Group in Washington which George H.W. Bush was also addressing.

 

In the days after 9/11, two dozen members of the Bin Laden family and over 100 members of the Saudi royal family were flown to assembly points in Texas and Washington and then flown out of the country. At least one of these flights took place during the total ban on civilian air traffic over North American airspace. Declassified FBI documents show that the Bureau believed the Bin Laden family flight out of the country—carrying suspected terrorists Abdullah and Omar Bin Laden—was chartered by Osama Bin Laden himself, but some of the passengers, including Abdullah, were not even interviewed in person by the FBI before their departure.

 

Of course, for the purveyors of the official conspiracy theory of Al-Qaeda, none of this has any relevance because the Saudi Binladin Group, the family business conglomerate, issued a terse, two-sentence statement in April of 1994 publicly disowning Osama. The facts, however, indicate that this public disowning was in fact a ruse.

 

In 2004, Osama’s half-brother Yeslam Binladin admitted that the family shared a joint Swiss bank account with Osama. The account was not closed until 1997, the year after the Khobar Towers bombing.

 

Yeslam’s ex-wife, Carmen, has also stated that she “cannot believe” that the family “have cut off Osama completely,” as have Vincent Cannistraro, the former head of the CIA Counter Terrorism Center, Michael Scheuer, the former head of the CIA Bin Laden unit, and the French intelligence service, which released a report two days after 9/11 indicating they believed the Bin Laden family to be covertly aiding Osama.

 

Nonetheless, the question remains: do the Bin Laden family connections to the highest circles of power in the American political establishment have any relevance to the story of Osama Bin Laden? Is there any evidence that American intelligence was involved with Osama himself over the years?

 

During Operation Cyclone, the US government funded the Afghan mujahedeen in their struggle against the Soviets in the largest covert operation in CIA history to that time. An estimated $5 billion in arms and funding were supplied to the jihadis, including stinger anti-aircraft missiles and other equipment that kept the Soviet Red Army bogged down in the country for years.

Officially, the CIA’s contact was limited to the Afghans themselves, and no funding was given to the so-called Arab Afghans like Osama Bin Laden, the Muslims from the Arab world who came to Afghanistan to aid in their fight against the Soviets. In reality, however, CIA funds were being funnelled to the ISI, the Pakistani intelligence service that distributed those funds to the Arab Afghans through an organization called MAK, or the Bureau of Services. Osama Bin Laden was the one in charge of MAK’s finances.

 

This much was admitted by Osama’s brother Salem in 1985, who confessed that Osama was “the liaison between the US, the Saudi government and the Afghan rebels” at the time. In 1986, Salem asked the Pentagon for anti-aircraft missiles on Osama’s behalf.

 

The former chief of the US visa bureau in Jeddah, Michael Springmann, has testified that during his time there, he was respeatedly ordered by CIA officials to approve visas for Bin Laden’s mujahedeen cohorts so that they could be provided training at US military bases. 11 of the 19 alleged 9/11 hijackers would go on to get their visas from the same consulate.

 

FBI whistleblower Sibel Edmonds has admitted that in her time at the FBI she saw proof that the US had maintained a “very intimate relationship” with Bin Laden all the way though the 1990s up to September 11th.

 

The Guardian reported that Osama had travelled to the American Hospital in Dubai for kidney dialysis treatment in June 2001. While there, he was visited by the local CIA station chief. When the CIA official later boasted about having met Osama Bin Laden, he was promptly recalled to Washington.

 

In a July 2005 article in the Guardian, Robin Cook, the former speaker of the House of Commons, asserted that the name Al Qaeda itself actually referred to the database containing CIA assets from the Afghan mujahedeen struggle.

 

Even Osama’s alleged responsibility for the 9/11 events has been repeatedly called into question.

 

In the weeks after the attack, the Taliban offered to hand Bin Laden over if the US provided proof that he was connected to 9/11. Bush turned the offer down. After the invasion of Afghanistan began in October, the Taliban again tried to hand him over, this time dropping the request for proof of Bin Laden’s guilt. Bush again refused.

 

After video of what the Pentagon alleged was Osama Bin Laden confessing to the 9/11 attacks emerged in December 2001, a German national news program conducted its own investigation into the tape. According to its own, independent translators, every single point in the video that the Pentagon alleges indicate Osama’s foreknowledge or complicity in the 9/11 attack has been mistranslated, and the video does not in fact provide any proof of confession.

 

Famously, FBI spokesman Rex Tomb told investigative journalist Ed Haas that the FBI did not include 9/11 on Bin Laden’s “most wanted” profile because there was no hard evidence connecting him to the crime.

 

And yet within the first minute of TV coverage of the second plane hitting the World Trade Center on 9/11, Osama Bin Laden was named as the likely perpetrator of the event. This idea solidified into a near certainty within hours, and the 24/7 news coverage shifted almost immediately to the question of when the US would invade Afghanistan.

 

In an interview the day after 9/11, confronted with this tendency of the press to jump to conclusions about Osama Bin Laden, ex-CIA station chief Milt Bearden made some unexpected statements about the supposed terrorist mastermind.

 

And now, in May of 2011, after Osama Bin Laden has been allegedly tracked down and allegedly shot by a Navy Seal team, after a trillion dollars and two wars have been waged in the name of fighting his shadowy, non-existent terror organization, as the very fabric of our society itself has been torn asunder in the neverending hunt for the terrorist boogeyman under our collective bed, perhaps it is time to ask once again what Osama Bin Laden means to us, after all.

 

If one were to base their understanding of Osama Bin Laden solely on mainstream media coverage of him over the last 10 years, a very different picture would emerge to the one that you have just been presented.

 

This media-constructed image would be one of a radical Muslim who appeared out of nowhere in the 1990s to begin a string of increasingly devastating terror attacks on American targets. After masterminding the 9/11 attacks in some undefined manner from a cave fortress in the hills of Afghanistan, he supposedly outwitted and outmanoeuvred the combined might of the most powerful military and the most technologically sophisticated intelligence dragnet in the history of the world for an entire decade, all the while releasing videos and audiotapes from his secret compound to taunt his would-be captors. Finally, we are told, he was tracked down and shot in a special forces raid during which live video transmissions were inexplicably unavailable and then buried at sea before his death could be confirmed by any independent third party.

 

What emerges from the official Osama Bin Laden story is not a person but a comic book villain, a faceless, mysterious, motivationless embodiment of “terrorism” with all the reality of a Lex Luther or Cobra Commander. His is a powerful myth, made all the more powerful because it has been constructed and promoted by the very politicians and string-pullers who claim to be opposing him. Like Orwell’s Emmanuel Goldstein, his face can be put before the public from time to time to produce the Two Minute Hate, a cathartic projection of anger upon an empty image. We know to hiss when his picture is dangled before us and cheer when we are told he is dead. But always, always, it is stressed that he is fearsome, that he is ruthless, and that the only way to stop him is to surrender our rights and freedoms. Even in death, we are told, he and the mythical army of devotees he supposedly ruled over, are a clear and present danger to our society necessitating the continuation of the neverending wars against abstract nouns, TSA agents groping children at the airports and extra-judicial no-fly lists that are turning in to no-ride lists and no-buy lists.

 

The only thing we can say for certain is that the Osama Bin Laden character has now been disposed of in a far-fetched burial story only fitting of his cartoonish myth. And now the public is already being prepared for his replacement myths, a gaggle of similarly cartoonish characters no less connected to the Western intelligence establishment than Osama himself.

 

But after finally waking from the 10 year nightmare of the Osama Bin Laden fable, are the public willing to go straight back to sleep? Or are they going to start questioning the official narratives that are cemented into place in the wake of every large-scale event, narratives that always support more government intrusion in our lives, expanded wars of aggression around the globe and an ever-expanding police state?

 

It’s an important question, and one that must be answered quickly, while the public is still wary and skeptical of a government that has lied to them time and time again and then refuses to provide that public with a single credible shred of proof that the largest manhunt in the history of America has ended with the disposal of this intelligence asset, Osama Bin Laden.

 

For if the public does choose to go back to sleep and dismiss the copious documentary evidence that the entire war on terror is a fraud being perpetrated by the same people who claim to be fighting the terrorists, we may never be able to awake from whatever nightmare they have planned for us next.

 

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/events/newsnight/1645527.stm

http://www.historycommons.org/context.jsp?item=a98diplomaticpassports#a98diplomaticpassports

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2005/jul/08/july7.development

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2001/oct/14/afghanistan.terrorism5

 

The assassinated Pakistani Prime Minister Benazir Bhutto saying on TV he is dead.

 

Less than two months after this interview, on December 27th 2007, Bhutto was assassinated while leaving a campaign rally for the PPP at Liaquat National Bagh, where she had given a spirited address to party supporters in the run-up to the January 2008 parliamentary elections.

 

After entering her bulletproof vehicle, Bhutto stood up through its sunroof to wave to the crowds. At this point, a gunman fired shots at her and subsequently explosives were detonated near the vehicle killing approximately 20 people. Bhutto was critically wounded and was rushed to Rawalpindi General Hospital. She was taken into surgery at 17:35 local time, and pronounced dead at 18:16.

 

SEAL Team 6 members among 38 killed in Afghanistan

Reporting from Kabul, Afghanistan, and Washington — Their name conjures up the most celebrated moment of America's post-Sept. 11 military campaigns. Now the Navy SEALs belong to a grimmer chapter in history: the most deadly incident for U.S. forces in the 10-year Afghanistan war.

 

Three months after they killed Al Qaeda leader Osama bin Laden in neighboring Pakistan and cemented their place in military legend, the SEALs suffered a devastating loss when nearly two dozen of the elite troops were among 30 Americans who died when their helicopter was shot down in Afghanistan early Saturday.

http://articles.latimes.com/2011/aug/06/world/la-fg-afghanistan-chopper-20110807

 

The Death of bin Ladenism

By Amir Taheri

Published: July 11, 2002

 

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Osama bin Laden is dead. The news first came from sources in Afghanistan and Pakistan almost six months ago: the fugitive died in December and was buried in the mountains of southeast Afghanistan. Pakistan's president, Pervez Musharraf, echoed the information. The remnants of Osama's gang, however, have mostly stayed silent, either to keep Osama's ghost alive or because they have no means of communication.

 

With an ego the size of Mount Everest, Osama bin Laden would not have, could not have, remained silent for so long if he were still alive. He always liked to take credit even for things he had nothing to do with. Would he remain silent for nine months and not trumpet his own survival?

 

Even if he is still in the world, bin Ladenism has left for good. Mr. bin Laden was the public face of a brand of politics that committed suicide in New York and Washington on Sept. 11, 2001, killing thousands of innocent people in the process.

http://www.nytimes.com/2002/07/11/opinion/11TAHE.html?ex=1089432000&en=373a282aeff2716a&ei=5070&todaysheadlines

 

CIA agent alleged to have met Bin Laden in July

Two months before September 11 Osama bin Laden flew to Dubai for 10 days for treatment at the American hospital, where he was visited by the local CIA agent, according to the French newspaper Le Figaro.

 

The disclosures are known to come from French intelligence which is keen to reveal the ambiguous role of the CIA, and to restrain Washington from extending the war to Iraq and elsewhere.

 

Bin Laden is reported to have arrived in Dubai on July 4 from Quetta in Pakistan with his own personal doctor, nurse and four bodyguards, to be treated in the urology department. While there he was visited by several members of his family and Saudi personalities, and the CIA.

 

The CIA chief was seen in the lift, on his way to see Bin Laden, and later, it is alleged, boasted to friends about his contact. He was recalled to Washington soon afterwards.

 

Intelligence sources say that another CIA agent was also present; and that Bin Laden was also visited by Prince Turki al Faisal, then head of Saudi intelligence, who had long had links with the Taliban, and Bin Laden. Soon afterwards Turki resigned, and more recently he has publicly attacked him in an open letter: "You are a rotten seed, like the son of Noah".

 

The American hospital in Dubai emphatically denied that Bin Laden was a patient there.

 

Washington last night also denied the story.

 

Private planes owned by rich princes in the Gulf fly frequently between Quetta and the Emirates, often on luxurious "hunting trips" in territories sympathetic to Bin Laden. Other sources confirm that these hunting trips have provided opportunities for Saudi contacts with the Taliban and terrorists, since they first began in 1994.

 

Bin Laden has often been reported to be in poor health. Some accounts claim that he is suffering from Hepatitis C, and can expect to live for only two more years.

 

According to Le Figaro, last year he ordered a mobile dialysis machine to be delivered to his base at Kandahar in Afghanistan.

 

Whether the allegations about the Dubai meeting are confirmed or not, the wider leaks from the French secret service throw a worrying light on the rivalries and lack of coordination between intelligence agencies, both within the US and between western allies.

 

A familiar complaint of French intelligence is that collaboration with the Americans has been essentially one-way, with them happy to receive information while giving little in return.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2001/nov/01/afghanistan.terrorism

 

Pakistan's Musharraf: Bin Laden probably dead

ISLAMABAD, Pakistan (CNN) -- Pakistan's president says he thinks Osama bin Laden is most likely dead because the suspected terrorist has been unable to get treatment for his kidney disease.

 

"I think now, frankly, he is dead for the reason he is a ... kidney patient," Gen. Pervez Musharraf said on Friday in an interview with CNN.

 

Musharraf said Pakistan knew bin Laden took two dialysis machines into Afghanistan. "One was specifically for his own personal use," he said.

 

"I don't know if he has been getting all that treatment in Afghanistan now. And the photographs that have been shown of him on television show him extremely weak. ... I would give the first priority that he is dead and the second priority that he is alive somewhere in Afghanistan." http://edition.cnn.com/2002/WORLD/asiapcf/south/01/18/gen.musharraf.binladen/

 

Dr. Sanjay Gupta: Bin Laden would need help if on dialysis

(CNN) -- Speculation about the whereabouts and health of Osama bin Laden picked up over the weekend when Pakistan's president, Gen. Pervez Musharraf, said he thought bin Laden had likely died of kidney failure.

 

CNN medical correspondent Dr. Sanjay Gupta spoke Monday with CNN's Paula Zahn about bin Laden's appearance in recently released videotapes and the possibility that the accused terrorist leader was undergoing kidney treatment.

 

ZAHN: For a point of reference, I'd like for you to analyze pictures of Osama bin Laden that apparently were taken prior to September 11. Describe to us the color and the tone of his skin, and then I want you to contrast that with pictures we know to have been taken much later.

 

MORE STORIES

Musharraf: Bin Laden likely dead

 

EXTRA INFORMATION

Gallery: Bin Laden's changing faces

 

 

GUPTA: You can look [at pictures from a December 2001 video] and notice that he has what some doctors refer to as sort of a frosting over of his features -- his sort of grayness of beard, his paleness of skin, very gaunt sort of features. A lot of times people associate this with chronic illness. Doctors can certainly look at that and determine some clinical features. http://edition.cnn.com/2002/HEALTH/01/21/gupta.otsc/

 

Karzai: bin Laden 'probably' dead

KABUL, Afghanistan (CNN) -- Osama bin Laden is "probably" dead, but former Taliban leader Mullah Omar is alive, Afghan President Hamid Karzai has said.

 

Karzai's comments came on the eve of the anniversary of the start of the U.S.-led military campaign in Afghanistan as part of the war on terrorism.

 

The campaign ousted the Taliban regime, which the United States said harbored bin Laden's al Qaeda terrorism network, the group blamed for the September 11 attacks.

 

"I would come to believe that [bin Laden] probably is dead," Karzai said on CNN's "Late Edition" on Sunday.

 

"But still, you never know. He might be alive. Five months ago, six months ago, I was thinking that he was alive.

 

"The more we don't hear of him, and the more time passes, there is the likelihood that he probably is either dead or seriously wounded somewhere."

 

But he said Omar is certainly alive. "We know of that," he said. "And we have come close to arresting him several times, but he's been able to escape."

 

U.S. forces also have searched for Omar.

 

Karzai, leader of Afghanistan's interim government, said Omar is a difficult man to track down "because nobody knows him by face. Nobody can recognize him. If you came across him today, somewhere in Afghanistan or in the rest of the world, you wouldn't recognize him. So that's part of the problem with him.

 

"I believe he is most of the time inside Afghanistan. He could go, from time to time, toward our borders, but he stays around the Afghan area, sometimes close to the borders," Karzai said.

No threat

 

He contended the Taliban, which the United States designated a "terrorist" group, is a minimal threat to his government. http://edition.cnn.com/2002/WORLD/asiapcf/central/10/06/karzai.binladen/

[cuntflaps]

Thursday, 18 July, 2002, 09:15 GMT 10:15 UK

Bin Laden 'probably' dead The US Federal Bureau of Investigation's counter-terrorism chief, Dale Watson, says he thinks Osama bin Laden is "probably" dead.

 

It is thought to be the first time a senior US law-enforcement official has publicly offered an opinion on whether Bin Laden, the prime suspect believed to be behind the 11 September attacks, is dead or alive.

 

"Is (Bin Laden) alive or is he dead?" Mr Watson said. "I am not really sure of the answer... I personally think he is probably not with us anymore but I have no evidence to support that."

 

The remarks, made at a law-enforcement conference in Washington on Wednesday, follow recent statements from both an Arabic newspaper editor and the chief of German foreign intelligence that Bin Laden is still alive. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/south_asia/2135473.stm

 

and now to the burial

 

Sea burial of Osama bin Laden breaks sharia law, say Muslim scholars

 

US decision to dispose of body in the sea prevents grave site becoming a shrine but clerics warn it may lead to reprisals

Osama bin Laden's burial at sea was quickly criticised by Muslim scholars who claimed it had breached sharia law and warned that it may provoke calls for revenge attacks against US targets.

 

Others used the sea burial question to question whether he was dead at all, with doubts fuelled by the absence of authentic photographs of his corpse.

 

US officials said tests using DNA from several of Bin Laden's family members had provided "virtual certainty" that it was his body. A woman believed to be one of Bin Laden's wives identified the al-Qaida leader, and he was visually identified by members of the US raiding party, the Pentagon said. Burying him on land could have led to his grave becoming a focus of contention and pilgrimage as well as posing tough questions about where he should be laid to rest.

 

"Finding a country willing to accept the remains of the world's most wanted terrorist would have been difficult," a US official said. "So the US decided to bury him at sea." The burial reportedly took place from the deck of the aircraft carrier USS Carl Vinson in the North Arabian sea.

 

Senior US officials told news agencies that his body was disposed of in accordance with Islamic tradition, which involves ritual washing, shrouding and burial within 24 hours. http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/may/02/sea-burial-osama-bin-laden

 

. If someone dies on a ship and it is impossible to bury him on land

He died on land didn't he?

 

If he did in fact live in Pakistan where he was killed surely his neighbours would have seen him?

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Fvooj3hPhk

 

 

Bush Tells Barnes Capturing Bin Laden Is ‘Not A Top Priority Use of American Resources’ http://thinkprogress.org/politics/2006/09/14/7472/barnes-osama/

 

Pentagon Denies Osama Capture

James Joyner · Saturday, February 28, 2004 · 1 Comment

 

AP: U.S., Pakistan Deny Bin Laden Was Captured

 

Pentagon and Pakistani officials on Saturday denied an Iranian state radio report that Osama bin Laden was captured in Pakistan’s border region with Afghanistan “a long time ago.”

 

The claim came as Pakistan’s army hunted terror suspects in a remote tribal region along the border, believed to be a possible hiding place for the al-Qaida’s leader. http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/pentagon_denies_osama_capture/

 

Albright thinks Bush

hiding bin Laden Former Secretary of State Madeleine Albright told Fox News Channel analyst Morton Kondracke yesterday she suspects President Bush knows the whereabouts of Osama bin Laden and is simply waiting for the most politically expedient moment to announce his capture.

 

Kondracke made the announcement about what Albright told him backstage before an appearance on another Fox show on “Special Report With Brit Hume.”

 

Kondracke was incredulous that a former secretary of state could believe something like that about a U.S. administration.

 

“She was not smiling when she said this,” offered Kondracke, who believes Albright is serious about the conspiracy theory.

 

 

Madeleine Albright

 

Albright is on a media tour to promote her new book, “Madam Secretary, A Memoir.”

 

She was mildly critical of Bush administration policy in Iraq on camera in later appearances on “The O’Reilly Factor” and on MSNBC’s “Hardball With Chris Matthews.”

 

“I’m one of these people that said I understood the ‘why’ of the war, but I didn’t understand the ‘why now’ or the ‘what next,’” she told O’Reilly. “I still have a lot of questions. And I think that we don’t know, frankly, what the effect of Saddam’s capture is on the general situation in Iraq. President Bush and Secretary Rumsfeld have, in fact, warned about violence still going on, and the effect within the rest of the Middle East of a prolonged trial or an execution or generally how he is treated.” http://www.wnd.com/2003/12/22353/

[Realism]

DID

 

NOT

 

READ

[cuntflaps]

DID

 

NOT

 

READ

American right? Seeing you like pictures...

 

Reading this thread has been a amusing though, clearly having demonstrated that there is a firm grasp on knowledge and events.

[Realism]

Knowledge and events

 

Tell us more about this scholarly sounding book learnin'

[cuntflaps]

Knowledge and events

 

Tell us more about this scholarly sounding book learnin'

 

Ever read or type a sentence with more than 15 words?

 

i used to have typical bullshit white guilt sympathy for afghani people but no mas. fuck em. kill em all. rebuild the country with strip malls, then profit.

 

Weapon XXX

Quote:

Originally Posted by Decyferon (View Original Post)

 

there is nothing wrong with the Iranian people it is the people in power in Iran that need to be wiped out.

There is everything wrong with persian people. those who prefer to be called persian are actually against the state of iran. it doesn't mean that 99% of them are not upright animals that should be put down for the sake of society.

 

Hmmm most Iranians I have met around the world have been cool. It's Canada that needs to get carpet bombed the fuck up and have the women and children killed, IMHO.

 

I mean that is some scholarly discussion right there folks, makes you wonder why America is one of the most loved countries in the world today.

[Walid Jumblat]

Hang on a minute Cuntflaps, you didn't post one single fucking thing that makes an argument for him being dead, alive or living on the moon.

 

You posted a huge bunch of supposition and speculation in newspapers and and acted like that is some kind of evidence.

 

 

You quote Iranian state press in one of the first items saying that he'd been captured. You really think that the Iranian state is an objective observer?! Read Fars ISNA, Press TV and IRNA for two weeks and try and corroborate even half of what they say. Then move to Pakistan and read The Nation, Geo, Dawn and a bunch of the others, pay close attention to people like the Rehman Malik and try corroborating half of the claims that these organisations and people make on a daily basis.

 

Secondly, posting claims of this and that doesn't mean SQUAT. Are you really trying to argue that opinion pieces, personal theories and speculation in newspapers is anything to draw conclusions from?

 

You post an interview with Benazir Bhutto who doesn't even make a claim that he's dead and then mention that she was killed soon after. So fucking what? are you implying that she was assassinated because that erroneous mention of OBL? If so then make an explicit argument instead of trying to provoke people to use their imagination to support your theory.

 

Bhutto was going back in to Pakistan with the outright pledge to take on the militants and those in the military and ISI who were supporting them. It was fucking obvious that they were going to try and stop her. Are you even aware of the extreme levels of political violence that country experiences on a daily basis?! The country is absolutely saturated with political violence, it is the norm there and she was overtly taking on the most violent and capable organisations in the country. Does it not sound much more feasible that they killed her??

 

And FFS, she wasn't claiming that OBL was dead. She was talking about Omar Shiekh who murdered Daniel Pearl not fucking OBL. You don't think she simply got her shit wrong? Show me one other time and place where Benazir Bhutto makes the claim that OBL is dead because if that's all you've got for us to go on you're fucking kidding yourself.

 

The Chinook that went down in Afghanistan actually didn't have ST6 on it, they were the initial news reports that came out that have since been retracted.

 

 

 

 

You haven't offered SHIT here other than a stoooopid amount of reasons why you shouldn't be taken seriously.

 

Goddamnit, I took the time to read all that shit you posted only to find that you don't even know how to make an argument, let alone do serious research.

[Walid Jumblat]

so, when your location says "beirut" thats sarcasm because there are a lot of lebanese in sydeny?

 

i remember the whole incident with the lebanese people on the beach attacked the lifeguards and then there were full on riots against them

 

 

One of the most embarrassing moments in my country's recent history, the whole ugly episode.

 

Nah, I say Beirut because Walid Jumblatt is the leader of the Progressive Socialist Party in Lebanon and the leader of the Druze community. He's 'also one of the freakiest looking fuckers I've ever seen and has a funky-ass name.