invisible empire

[lord_casek]

Chomsky talking about that quote[/url] in reference to the communist threat (surprise surprise) !

 

Which reminds me of something else I have been thinking about; How can you nwo guys discount leading critical theorists like Foucault or Chomsky? They are both radicals, are leading political minds of the 20th (and 21st) century, and are hugely critical of the state. So assuming you are aware of these two and have some understanding of their work. Then how is it that you can suggest that although they both have made a career out of being critical of state power, they fail to see this overarching organisation of shadowy figures attempting to dominate the world (that everyone on the internet happens to know about)? I mean do you think you are more politically aware than Chomsky? Or are you perhaps suggesting that he is in on the deal? haha

Seriously, I am honestly baffled!

 

 

Out of curiosity, what do you think of this? Remember, this is a Rothschild. One of the most powerful families in the world.

[angelofdeath]

i tend to steer away from most NWO conversations due to the super divisive nature of the discussion and that it is hard for both sides to sometimes prove or disprove certain 'theories.' instead of actual discussions we generally just get...'you fucking tin foil hats!' and that is about the extent of it.

what is and what isnt the NWO is up for discussion as we all know. we all know presidents have talked about etc etc, so there is no denying that a lot of what so called 'conspiracy theorists' are saying is true. however i think SOME of the conclusions drawn may not be true. but to deny the existence of people/groups/governments who would like to run the world through an enforcement government is just burying your head in the sand. any government is a 'conspiracy' to run the lives of other people.

 

as for chomsky... he is critical of the state in many areas. i think he is good on the drug war and overall is pretty decent on foreign policy. however, by simply subscribing to an internally contradictory philosophy like 'libertarian socialism' (complete oxymoron)i have to almost tune him completely out. while i like a LOT of gore vidals writings, chomsky isnt my cup of tea. to actually think for one minute an anarchist society without private property rights can be attained without coercing people out of their private property is a huge problem with this ideology. whereas 'free market libertarian's' believe only in force when used to defend something, these guys will literally have to pry the 'means of production' out of the cold dead hands of the people that own them. i have yet to debate one of these guys that would 'let' me own a 2000 acre farm in their 'free' society. i also reject their theory of 'working' as 'slavery' as you are entirely free to reject any working arrangement you want in a free market and are free to bargain however you see fit.

 

whereas libertarian socialists say... 'we want freedom but we have to force everyone out of their private property in order to attain 'freedom' i say you cannot have freedom with out private property. because without a theory of private property rights enforced by free people no one knows how to use what. you dont have a definition of what crime is. lib socialists say...'you can do whatever you want, as long as you dont try to own property... then we'll have to shoot you' where as i say....'you should be able to do whatever you want as long as you dont infringe on anyone else's life liberty or property. if you try to rape or kill someone, then we'll kill you'

[Removed]

Out of curiosity, what do you think of this? Remember, this is a Rothschild. One of the most powerful families in the world.

 

Again I really don't see this clip as holding any evidence of a global conspiracy. The use of the worlds 'global governance' in this context is in reference to the invited states at the UN summit. He goes on to comment on how difficult it is to reach a consensus. There is a lot of talk about the environment as an issue that requires a cosmopolitan solution.

 

He is a Rothschild, so what? A lot of the children of wealthy people choose causes they are interested in and become philanthropists to some degree. In fact it is not surprising at all when you consider he is young, amazingly rich, and well educated he is in a position where he can focus on an issue like this while the rest of us have to work to eat etc.

[lord_casek]

Again I really don't see this clip as holding any evidence of a global conspiracy. The use of the worlds 'global governance' in this context is in reference to the invited states at the UN summit. He goes on to comment on how difficult it is to reach a consensus. There is a lot of talk about the environment as an issue that requires a cosmopolitan solution.

 

He is a Rothschild, so what? A lot of the children of wealthy people choose causes they are interested in and become philanthropists to some degree. In fact it is not surprising at all when you consider he is young, amazingly rich, and well educated he is in a position where he can focus on an issue like this while the rest of us have to work to eat etc.

 

 

He's not that smart. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YuNLahhZFJ0

I know you hate Jones. This is worth a listen, though.

[Fist 666]

i wish i had good internet speeds so i could have a clue whats going on in here...

[Removed]

i tend to steer away from most NWO conversations due to the super divisive nature of the discussion and that it is hard for both sides to sometimes prove or disprove certain 'theories.' instead of actual discussions we generally just get...'you fucking tin foil hats!' and that is about the extent of it.

what is and what isnt the NWO is up for discussion as we all know. we all know presidents have talked about etc etc, so there is no denying that a lot of what so called 'conspiracy theorists' are saying is true. however i think SOME of the conclusions drawn may not be true. but to deny the existence of people/groups/governments who would like to run the world through an enforcement government is just burying your head in the sand. any government is a 'conspiracy' to run the lives of other people.

 

as for chomsky... he is critical of the state in many areas. i think he is good on the drug war and overall is pretty decent on foreign policy.

 

I think in this context Chomsky's critique is what's relevant, rather than his assertions of how he would like to see society organised. If social libertarianism would, or wouldn't work is a different conversation. It seems to me that someone who is so critical of state power would not ignore an even more powerful group if there was strong evidence for one. I imagine it would be the same for those who subscribe to market anarchism also. What does Mises and the gang have to say about the new world order? If the answer is nothing I would suggest this is even further evidence of the lunacy of this idea.

 

I am genuinely interested in your idea of these 'people/groups/governments who would like to run the world'. I hesitate to agree with you without knowing exactly what you are saying. Although, tentatively I would say this; I recognise that humanity has a tendency to be attracted to power, historically people have formed groups for the benefit of collecting power, these groups have traditionally grown into what we now understand as the nation state, although now in an economically liberal world there is another kind of group which is only loosely bound by national borders (ie multinational corps).

 

So, from a market anarchist perspective, would it be safe to say that outside of the influence of states, any group attempting to run the world would be prone to the same kind of competitive market forces that any company selling a product might?

 

It seems to me that a market anarchist perspective would argue that in absence of any form of substantial global governance the international political order is less likely to be distorted and possibly monopolised by a group attempting to dominate, rather than more likely. I have a suspicion that a Demand/Supply curve might be able to model this fairly easily, assuming there is a market for power, but I don't know that much about economics so I put it to you;

Do you think there is a way to economically model competitive interests in international power?

[Removed]

He's not that smart. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YuNLahhZFJ0

I know you hate Jones. This is worth a listen, though.

 

haha man Alex Jones is batshit insane!

It was all pretty reasonable until Jones launches into this completely off topic tirade about how "'a' world wide fund wants to exterminate 80% of 'us'" and it has something to do with Maoists etc. From that point onward it was clearly not going to be an interview with any merit. So I chose to stop listening, for similar kinds of reasons that I have spoken about previously in this thread.

[lord_casek]

haha man Alex Jones is batshit insane!

It was all pretty reasonable until Jones launches into this completely off topic tirade about how "'a' world wide fund wants to exterminate 80% of 'us'" and it has something to do with Maoists etc. From that point onward it was clearly not going to be an interview with any merit. So I chose to stop listening, for similar kinds of reasons that I have spoken about previously in this thread.

 

You missed the part about Rothschild claiming planets weren't were they are.

It's quite funny.

[angelofdeath]

I think in this context Chomsky's critique is what's relevant, rather than his assertions of how he would like to see society organised. If social libertarianism would, or wouldn't work is a different conversation.

 

fair enough.

i think more or less, i was in a round about way trying to say i've never heard him talk about any of this stuff because i dont really pay THAT much attention to him.

 

It seems to me that someone who is so critical of state power would not ignore an even more powerful group if there was strong evidence for one. I imagine it would be the same for those who subscribe to market anarchism also. What does Mises and the gang have to say about the new world order? If the answer is nothing I would suggest this is even further evidence of the lunacy of this idea.

 

mises and the economists of his type dont really talk about politics to begin and deal only more or less with human action and only touch on market interventions in as much as they effect the economy. there is a decent amount of things that some people consider 'conspiracy theory nut head stuff.' like, obviously they know the origin of the federal reserve system. legislation drafted in a secret meeting by heads of big banks more or less in THEIR favor. other than that, they more or less dont talk about 'conspiracy theories.' more or less i think they believe if there IS a NWO, the government is the enforcing arm and that is what they are dealing with. murray rothbard, lew rockwell and ron paul have questioned the JFK murders, gulf of tonkin, CIA operations, etc. that is about the extent of their 'conspiracy' theory talks.

 

on another note, pat buchanan has said the NWO was created with the bretton woods agreement. i think it depends what exactly your definition of NWO we are dealing with. are governments always looking to gain more power and centralize it as much as possible? arent there huge initiatives for world government? dont we all think if the US could run the entire world, they WOULD? arent there global governing bodies trying to regulate arms, the environment and a myriad of other things? that is about as far as i get in the NWO world... the other stuff more or less doesnt interest me that much. i'd rather go shooting than track down the bilderbergers.

 

for instance, i've listened to alex jones with ron paul on, lew rockwell on, tom woods on... while alex jones says the housing collapse was 'engineered' the austrians just say....'it happened because of government doing _______"

 

 

So, from a market anarchist perspective, would it be safe to say that outside of the influence of states, any group attempting to run the world would be prone to the same kind of competitive market forces that any company selling a product might?

 

i think more or less you are right, as long as they are not employing private armies that are looting and pillaging, kiling or otherwise using force, etc.

 

gotta run... more later

[ILOTSMYBRAIN]

I'd also recommend the book SuperClass by David Rothkopf.

 

Pretty interesting stuff in there.

[christo-f]

i tend to steer away from most NWO conversations due to the super divisive nature of the discussion and that it is hard for both sides to sometimes prove or disprove certain 'theories.' instead of actual discussions we generally just get...'you fucking tin foil hats!' and that is about the extent of it.

what is and what isnt the NWO is up for discussion as we all know. we all know presidents have talked about etc etc, so there is no denying that a lot of what so called 'conspiracy theorists' are saying is true. however i think SOME of the conclusions drawn may not be true. but to deny the existence of people/groups/governments who would like to run the world through an enforcement government is just burying your head in the sand. any government is a 'conspiracy' to run the lives of other people.

 

'

 

I think this paragraph above is a fairly decent summary of my thoughts on the matter too.

 

Many of the claims made by the Pro-NWO are totally unprovable and leap from seeing incomplete information or "something possible" straight to "This is proof". IT seems like they have never once played devil's advocate with themselves on the matter and suffer from strong confirmation bias. There is very little black and white on the pro side of the debate.

 

However, I would never say that there are not commercial and ideological interests that seek to maximise power to the most possible degree. Two of those interests is very obviously and correctly arms manufacturers and those that control credit. I think that there are very few that would argue that these two social/commercial groupings do not have massive power and that they abuse it horribly for selfish gain.

 

But to say that they come together to make some kind of coordinated and comprehensive pole of power that are in control of the nation state is a leap that cannot be proved, flies in the face of some very hard and obvious evidence and ends up discrediting the valid points of the Pro argument.

 

IT seems that the Pro side of the debate will leap to conclusions and claim that those who "don't see it" are either head in the sand or part of the problem and much of the Con see this and then dismiss the Pro outright because of their nature thus throwing the baby out with the bath water.

[christo-f]

I will however hark back to something that frankiefiver alluded to; it seems that there are a lot of people around who are very publicly trying to out this NWO group that have not yet commited suicide with a bullet to the back of the head.

 

And that is very strong argument to me against this NWO being what they make them out to be.

 

I mean I'd like to put Alex Jones under a ton of dirt just to make him STFU and his views don't threaten me in the least.....!!

[Zig]

come on though, what happened to talking about the quotes that are taken "out of context". i mean shit, here's a ton of them for you if you don't feel like posting them.

 

"We're living through exceptionally difficult times – the financial crisis and its dramatic impact on employment and budgets, the climate crisis which threatens our very survival, a period of anxiety, uncertainty and lack of confidence," he said in his maiden press conference. "Yet these problems can be overcome through a joint effort between our countries. 2009 is also the first year of global governance with the establishment of the G20 in the middle of the financial crisis. The climate conference in Copenhagen is another step toward the global management of our planet."

 

 

Herman Van Rompuy

 

"The powers of financial capitalism had another far reaching aim, nothing less than to create a world system of financial control in private hands able to dominate the political system of each country and the economy of the world as a whole. This system was to be controlled in a feaudalist fashion by the central banks of the world acting in concert, by secret agreements, arrived at in frequent private meetings and conferences. The apex of the system was the Bank for International Settlements in Basle, Switzerland, a private bank owned and controlled by the worlds' central banks which were themselves private corporations. The growth of financial capitalism made possible a centralization of world economic control and use of this power for the direct benefit of financiers and the indirect injury of all other economic groups."

 

Professor Carrol Quigley

(Highly esteemed by his former student, Bill Clinton)

 

"The New World Order will have to be built from the bottom up rather than from the top down... but in the end run around national sovereignty, eroding it piece by piece will accomplish much more than the old fashioned frontal assault."

 

CFR member Richard Gardner

 

"The drive of the Rockefellers and their allies is to create a one-world government combining supercapitalism and Communism under the same tent, all under their control... Do I mean conspiracy? Yes I do. I am convinced there is such a plot, international in scope, generations old in planning, and incredibly evil in intent."

 

Congressman Larry P. McDonald

 

"Today, America would be outraged if U.N. troops entered Los Angeles to restore order [referring to the 1991 LA Riot]. Tomorrow they will be grateful! This is especially true if they were told that there were an outside threat from beyond [i.e., an "extraterrestrial" invasion], whether real or promulgated, that threatened our very existence. It is then that all peoples of the world will plead to deliver them from this evil. The one thing every man fears is the unknown. When presented with this scenario, individual rights will be willingly relinquished for the guarantee of their well-being granted to them by the World Government."

 

Dr. Henry Kissinger, Bilderberger Conference, Evians, France, 1991

 

"The modern banking system manufactures money out of nothing. The process is perhaps the most astounding piece of sleight of hand that was ever invented. Banking was conceived in iniquity and born in sin. Bankers own the earth. Take it away from them, but leave them the power to create money and control credit, and with the flick of a pen, they will create enough money to buy it back again. Take this great power away from the bankers and all the great fortunes like mine will disappear, and they ought to disappear, for this would be a better and happier world to live in. But if you want to continue the slaves of bankers and pay the cost of your own slavery, let them continue to create money and to control credit."

 

Sir Josiah Stamp, Director and President of the Bank of England during the 1920's

 

"In searching for a new enemy to unite us, we came up with the idea that pollution, the threat of global warming, water shortages, famine and the like would fit the bill. In their totality and in their interactions these phenomena do constitute a common threat with demands the solidarity of all peoples. But in designating them as the enemy, we fall into the trap about which we have already warned namely mistaking systems for causes. All these dangers are caused by human intervention and it is only through changed attitudes and behaviour that they can be overcome. The real enemy, then, is humanity itself."

 

"The First Global Revolution", A Report by the Council of the Club of Rome by Alexander King and Bertrand Schneider 1991.

 

"We are grateful to The Washington Post, The New York Times, Time Magazine and other great publications whose directors have attended our meetings and respected their promises of discretion for almost forty years. It would have been impossible for us to develop our plan for the world if we had been subject to the bright lights of publicity during those years. But, the work is now much more sophisticated and prepared to march towards a world government. The supranational sovereignty of an intellectual elite and world bankers is surely preferable to the national autodetermination practiced in past centuries."

 

David Rockefeller, founder of the Trilateral Commission, in an address to a meeting of The Trilateral Commission, in June, 1991.

 

"The technetronic era involves the gradual appearance of a more controlled society. Such a society would be dominated by an elite, unrestrained by traditional values. Soon it will be possible to assert almost continuous surveillance over every citizen and maintain up-to-date complete files containing even the most personal information about the citizen. These files will be subject to instantaneous retrieval by the authorities."

 

Zbigniew Brezinski, Between Two Ages, America's Role in the Technotronic Era 1970

 

"In the next century, nations as we know it will be obsolete; all states will recognize a single, global authority. National sovereignty wasn't such a great idea after all."

 

Strobe Talbot, President Clinton's Deputy Secretary of State, as quoted in Time, July 20th, 1992.

 

"Since I entered politics, I have chiefly had men's views confided to me privately. Some of the biggest men in the United States, in the Field of commerce and manufacture, are afraid of something. They know that there is a power somewhere so organized, so subtle, so watchful, so interlocked, so complete, so pervasive, that they better not speak above their breath when they speak in condemnation of it."

 

Woodrow Wilson,The New Freedom (1913)

 

"I am a most unhappy man. I have unwittingly ruined my country. A great industrial nation is controlled by its system of credit. Our system of credit is concentrated. The growth of the nation, therefore, and all our activities are in the hands of a few men. We have come to be one of the worst ruled, one of the most completely controlled and dominated governments in the civilized world. No longer a government by free opinion, no longer a government by conviction and the vote of the majority, but a government by the opinion and duress of a small group of dominant men."

 

President Woodrow Wilson (who introduced the Federal Reserve act which allowed the privately owned Federal Reserve to begin in 1913)

 

"The real menace of our republic is this invisible government which like a giant octopus sprawls its slimy length over city, state and nation. Like the octopus of real life, it operates under cover of a self created screen....At the head of this octopus are the Rockefeller Standard Oil interests and a small group of powerful banking houses generally referred to as international bankers. The little coterie of powerful international bankers virtually run the United States government for their own selfish purposes. They practically control both political parties."

 

New York City Mayor John F. Hylan, 1922

 

"We are at present working discreetly with all our might to wrest this mysterious force called sovereignty out of the clutches of the local nation states of the world. All the time we are denying with our lips what we are doing with our hands."

 

Professor Arnold Toynbee, in a June 1931 speech before the Institute for the Study of International Affairs in Copenhagen.

 

"For a long time I felt that FDR had developed many thoughts and ideas that were his own to benefit this country, the United States. But, he didn't. Most of his thoughts, his political ammunition, as it were, were carefully manufactured for him in advanced by the Council on Foreign Relations - One World Money group. Brilliantly, with great gusto, like a fine piece of artillery, he exploded that prepared "ammunition" in the middle of an unsuspecting target, the American people, and thus paid off and returned his internationalist political support.

 

"The UN is but a long-range, international banking apparatus clearly set up for financial and economic profit by a small group of powerful One-World revolutionaries, hungry for profit and power.

 

"The depression was the calculated 'shearing' of the public by the World Money powers, triggered by the planned sudden shortage of supply of call money in the New York money market....The One World Government leaders and their ever close bankers have now acquired full control of the money and credit machinery of the U.S. via the creation of the privately owned Federal Reserve Bank."

 

Curtis Dall, FDR's son-in-law as quoted in his book, My Exploited Father-in-Law

 

"The real rulers in Washington are invisible, and exercise power from behind the scenes."

 

Supreme Court Justice Felix Frankfurter, 1952

 

"Today the path of total dictatorship in the United States can be laid by strictly legal means, unseen and unheard by the Congress, the President, or the people. Outwardly we have a Constitutional government. We have operating within our government and political system, another body representing another form of government - a bureaucratic elite."

 

Senator William Jenner, 1954

 

"The Trilateral Commission is intended to be the vehicle for multinational consolidation of the commercial and banking interests by seizing control of the political government of the United States. The Trilateral Commission represents a skillful, coordinated effort to seize control and consolidate the four centers of power political, monetary, intellectual and ecclesiastical. What the Trilateral Commission intends is to create a worldwide economic power superior to the political governments of the nationstates involved. As managers and creators of the system, they will rule the future."

 

U.S. Senator Barry Goldwater in his 1964 book: With No Apologies

 

"My country's history, Mr. President, tells us that it is possible to fashion unity while cherishing diversity, that common action is possible despite the variety of races, interests, and beliefs we see here in this chamber. Progress and peace and justice are attainable. So we say to all peoples and governments: Let us fashion together a new world order."

 

Henry Kissinger, in address before the General Assembly of the United Nations, October 1975)

 

“And remember, where you have a concentration of power in a few hands, all too frequently men with the mentality of gangsters get control. History has proven that. All power corrupts; absolute power corrupts absolutely.”

 

Lord Acton

 

oh, but i'm so SURE that these quotes aren't related in any way whatsoever right? I'm fabricating realities here... (must be the druggsss)

 

But if that isn't enough for you, then let's take a look at something that happened and was said only a few weeks ago by these same people at these institutions. Here are their ideas for our society:

 

 

oh yes, global governance in which we pay taxes to the elitist privately owned central banks so they can manage society. yes this is something that we should be working towards, this is the "New World Order (super /sarcasm here)".

 

Look, don't tell me this stuff isn't real or I'm wearing a tinfoil hat when all you do is say things are taken out of context, post some bull shit argument as to why you are in denial, and dismiss the film because you can't debate the issue at hand. I'm tired of the arrogance when trying to have a real discussion here about these issues. This isn't about whether or not it EXISTS. It clearly EXISTS. If you're in denial of that, something is wrong with your brain... maybe drinking too much tap water or something. lolz.

 

oh, and to the person who was laughing about the 80% population reduction thing. Just to give you an idea what these elitists think about world population levels:

 

"In the event that I am reincarnated, I would like to return as a deadly virus, in order to contribute something to solve overpopulation."

 

Prince Phillip of England, Reported by Deutsche Press Agentur (DPA), August, 1988.

 

hahaha..haha...ha... wait. that's not funny.

[Lesbian Fisting]

This isn't about whether or not it EXISTS. It clearly EXISTS. If you're in denial of that, something is wrong with your brain... maybe drinking too much tap water or something.

 

It doesnt clearly exist. It exists when you work from the conclusion backwards and find evidence that fits in to place where it is supports your theories and discard anything that doesnt fit. The first quote you posted is a clear example of such an issue. If you look at it wanting to see a conspiracy, it can fit the bill.

[Zig]

It doesnt clearly exist. It exists when you work from the conclusion backwards and find evidence that fits in to place where it is supports your theories and discard anything that doesnt fit. The first quote you posted is a clear example of such an issue. If you look at it wanting to see a conspiracy, it can fit the bill.

 

sighhhhhhhhhhhhh

 

on another note, your username made me hungry.

[shai]

Once again, I don't understand how otherwise intelligent people (most of you) could miss the obvious point here.

 

All of these scenarios- fantastic or mundane- add up to a consolidation of power. Simple as that. Whether it's for the best remains to be seen. Governments and heads of state have been doing this since the dawn of civilization with varying end results...I'm more concerned that transnational corporations have ingratiated themselves into these matters as they are beholden to nothing but profit despite of all of their claims of social responsibility.

[El Mamerro]

"We are grateful to The Washington Post, The New York Times, Time Magazine and other great publications whose directors have attended our meetings and respected their promises of discretion for almost forty years. It would have been impossible for us to develop our plan for the world if we had been subject to the bright lights of publicity during those years. But, the work is now much more sophisticated and prepared to march towards a world government. The supranational sovereignty of an intellectual elite and world bankers is surely preferable to the national autodetermination practiced in past centuries."

 

David Rockefeller, founder of the Trilateral Commission, in an address to a meeting of The Trilateral Commission, in June, 1991.

 

This quote is fucking amazing. Perfectly engineered and crafted to give you dudes conspira-boners, to a comically suspect degree. Haven't found a single legit source to its veracity, big surprise.

[Removed]

come on though, what happened to talking about the quotes that are taken "out of context". i mean shit, here's a ton of them for you if you don't feel like posting them.

 

oh, but i'm so SURE that these quotes aren't related in any way whatsoever right? I'm fabricating realities here... (must be the druggsss)

 

But if that isn't enough for you, then let's take a look at something that happened and was said only a few weeks ago by these same people at these institutions. Here are their ideas for our society:

 

 

oh yes, global governance in which we pay taxes to the elitist privately owned central banks so they can manage society. yes this is something that we should be working towards, this is the "New World Order (super /sarcasm here)".

 

Look, don't tell me this stuff isn't real or I'm wearing a tinfoil hat when all you do is say things are taken out of context, post some bull shit argument as to why you are in denial, and dismiss the film because you can't debate the issue at hand. I'm tired of the arrogance when trying to have a real discussion here about these issues. This isn't about whether or not it EXISTS. It clearly EXISTS. If you're in denial of that, something is wrong with your brain... maybe drinking too much tap water or something. lolz.

 

oh, and to the person who was laughing about the 80% population reduction thing. Just to give you an idea what these elitists think about world population levels:

 

 

 

hahaha..haha...ha... wait. that's not funny.

 

Well what is kind of funny, is that in order to refute claims of out of context quotes you present another collection of mostly out of context, or in some cases incorrect, quotes. Where did you get these from? I would make a quick guess that it is from another conspiracy theory website. Which leads me to a further question; How is it that you distrust all mainstream channels of information, yet are happy to believe some clown on the net who recently learnt how to "ctrl c, ctrl v"?

 

Christo; You are spot on when saying this argument is polarised over both parties having an inability to commonly recognise evidence. But so far all I have done is argue against such simplistic claims of a shadowy group working in unison to secure ultimate and ever lasting power over humanity. I out and out reject this kind of statement, which seems to be the dominant message of the Zeitgeists, and Alex Jones' etc. However I am very happy to recognise competing international powers, including arms dealers and creditors. I am also very happy to discuss any argument made concerning any powerful self interested group, so long as it is vaguely logical. So far nothing has been presented by the 'pro' party of that nature. All the 'pro' assertions have been 'watch this video', or 'how can you disprove this quote?'. Lets see some actual arguments so we can discuss them!

 

To explore your point on evidence a little, I am interested in how these kinds of conspiracy theories parallel contemporary political debates, often (miss)quoting political actors on very similar subjects to the conspiratorial topic, yet largely refuse to recognise mainstream assertions or critique of these ideas. It seems to me that there is a strong similarity to the way that Intelligent Design proponents piggy back evolutionary research, distorting evidence to suit their purpose.

 

AOD; I recently read through a few articles by Rothbard who was critically analysing Reaganomics, and what he saw as the illiberal actions of the Reagan government. So surely there are other market anarchists who have written critically about the state? To my understanding market anarchists hold the assumption that private institutions need to provide a service in order to be the beneficiaries of power/money. Thus giving the method of societal organisation legitimacy. I also understand that market anarchists are hugely anti monopoly, and argue that monopolies would not be possible without the distorting effect of state actions. So if it was understood by Austrian Economists (or any other anarchists for that matter) that there was a banking elite who are propped up by various state powers, and are on the verge of consolidating a monopoly with infinite repercussions. Wouldn't they comment on this? Wouldn't this be a serious problem for the anarchist ideology?

[Zig]

This quote is fucking amazing. Perfectly engineered and crafted to give you dudes conspira-boners, to a comically suspect degree. Haven't found a single legit source to its veracity, big surprise.

 

*******EDIT no i'm wrong i'll admit.

 

"Some even believe we (the Rockefeller family) are part of a secret cabal working against the best interests of the United States, characterizing my family and me as 'internationalists' and of conspiring with others around the world to build a more integrated global political and economic structure---one world, if you will. If that's the charge, I stand guilty, and I am proud of it."

 

that's what he said on page 405.

 

here, buy the book. http://www.amazon.com/David-Rockefeller-Memoirs/dp/0679405887

 

oh plz frankie, more mostly out of context quotes? this is ridiculous. why are you dismissing the things said in these quotes as insignificant? all you are saying is that it is taken out of context. what does that even mean? the quotes above speak for themselves, most of them.

[Removed]

are you serious dude? Page 405 of Rockefeller's autobiography, "Memoirs". really?

 

this is the level of denial your in. it was written in his OWN fucking auto-biography. god.

 

here, buy the book. http://www.amazon.com/David-Rockefeller-Memoirs/dp/0679405887

 

oh plz frankie, more mostly out of context quotes? this is ridiculous.

 

Yeah my man, I could say the same of you!

 

Ok one quick example before I leave. I am familia with the Lord Acton quote 'power tends to corrupt and absolute power corrupts absolutely'. This is in reference to the notion of 'papal infallibility' which was put forward by the catholic church essentially to absolve any responsibility of individual popes should they happen to contradict each other over time. lord Acton being a gentleman of liberal leanings, and a catholic at the time, was very upset the this, as most liberally minded people would be! Many still talk about limited/conditional/constitutional power without entering into the confused and shady world of conspiracy theory.

 

There are several slight variations of this quote, wiki has one, the Oxford dictionary online has another. However, I have never seen such a distorted version as the one you have quoted.

[Zig]

Yeah my man, I could say the same of you!

 

Ok one quick example before I leave. I am familia with the Lord Acton quote 'power tends to corrupt and absolute power corrupts absolutely'. This is in reference to the notion of 'papal infallibility' which was put forward by the catholic church essentially to absolve any responsibility of individual popes should they happen to contradict each other over time. lord Acton being a gentleman of liberal leanings, and a catholic at the time, was very upset the this, as most liberally minded people would! Many still talk about limited/conditional/constitutional power without entering into the confused and shady world of conspiracy theory.

 

There are several slight variations of this quote, wiki has one, the Oxford dictionary online has another. However, I have never seen such a distorted version as the one you have quoted.

 

yea, who the hell is saying Lord Acton was referring to the New World Order? haha are you serious? it's the logic of his quote that applies to the concept. it has nothing to do with what he was referring to, it's the same issue.

 

it's a timeless statement. it applies to reality, regardless of the times.

 

wow you chose the Lord Acton quotes out of ALL those quotes to exhibit the out of context, very impressive.

 

yo, just... forget this. i'm done here, believe what you want.

[christo-f]

Yeah, last thing I've got to say on this is I wonder what the Chinese, the Indians, Russians and a bunch of other non-european/Westerners think of this.

 

They seem to be largely under-represented in this whole scheme but make up a large part of the world....

 

 

 

 

 

 

And BTW, your Kissinger UN quote is so fucking far off point it totally discredits anything you say on the matter because it makes you look like you'll believe anything to suit your argument.

 

 

You're a nut, I'm out.

[Removed]

Here I have a quote for you too. This one is printed by a reputable organisation and referenced clearly.

 

New World Order Phrase used by President George Bush , in a speech made in September 1990 , calling for a new era of international cooperation. It reflected optimism after the end of the the Cold War , and his wish to avoid the need for a unilateral US response to the Gulf War crisis. The mood of optimism soon dissipated, and the approach to international cooperation was not shared by Bush's son, President George W. Bush , when faced with his own crisis in Iraq .

 

The Concise Oxford Dictionary of Politics

http://www.oxfordreference.com/views/ENTRY.html?subview=Main&entry=t86.e1561

 

I chose the Lord Acton quote because I recognised it to be false. I thought I would throw in a bit of background info too. I'm guessing between Christo, Mams and myself we could probably debunk the rest too if you like. Either way, presenting a bunch of quotes is neither evidence for, or an argument about, anything. You need to clearly state your case if you want to be given any kind of credit.

[angelofdeath]

Thus giving the method of societal organisation legitimacy. I also understand that market anarchists are hugely anti monopoly, and argue that monopolies would not be possible without the distorting effect of state actions. So if it was understood by Austrian Economists (or any other anarchists for that matter) that there was a banking elite who are propped up by various state powers, and are on the verge of consolidating a monopoly with infinite repercussions. Wouldn't they comment on this? Wouldn't this be a serious problem for the anarchist ideology?

 

surely, if you have read any of these guys or paid any attention to the ron paul presidential compaign, you will note that being critical of the FED as a monopoly and calling for a return to a commodity monetary standard is what separates austrians from all other schools of economists.

 

in fact you could probably narrow this particular topic down to being perhaps the most talked about austrian topic.. central banking.

 

it is safe to say they know the origins of the FED, who wrote the act and whose benefit it serves. the mises institute just had a conference at jekyll island where the FED was essentially created.

 

check this for more:

 

http://mises.org/media.aspx?action=search&q=jekyll%20island

http://mises.org/media/2840

[lord_casek]

This quote is fucking amazing. Perfectly engineered and crafted to give you dudes conspira-boners, to a comically suspect degree. Haven't found a single legit source to its veracity, big surprise.

 

http://www.trilateral.org/AnnMtgs/Trialog/library_annmtgs/Tokyo_1991.pdf

[El Mamerro]

And surprisingly enough, no mention of that quote anywhere on that PDF, based off a 15 minute overview admittedly. I only see logical, measured assessments of the state of the world, discussed by a number of internationals, mostly asian. Rockefeller is mentioned several times, but there is absolutely nothing in there written by him.

 

if the quote is in there, I'd appreciate some direction as to where to find it.

[lord_casek]

And surprisingly enough, no mention of that quote anywhere on that PDF, based off a 15 minute overview admittedly. I only see logical, measured assessments of the state of the world, discussed by a number of internationals, mostly asian. Rockefeller is mentioned several times, but there is absolutely nothing in there written by him.

 

if the quote is in there, I'd appreciate some direction as to where to find it.

 

 

Sorry, just searched their archives and came up with that as being the only thing in that month/year respectively.

[Removed]

surely, if you have read any of these guys or paid any attention to the ron paul presidential compaign, you will note that being critical of the FED as a monopoly and calling for a return to a commodity monetary standard is what separates austrians from all other schools of economists.

 

in fact you could probably narrow this particular topic down to being perhaps the most talked about austrian topic.. central banking.

 

it is safe to say they know the origins of the FED, who wrote the act and whose benefit it serves. the mises institute just had a conference at jekyll island where the FED was essentially created.

 

check this for more:

 

http://mises.org/media.aspx?action=search&q=jekyll%20island

http://mises.org/media/2840

 

haha ok I haven't really read much of what they have said, or followed the Ron Paul campaign, but I know this is your field hence why questions were directed at you.

[nsmbfan]

i always think its funny when peons look inside the political spectrum and go, "YEP, ALL SEEMS NORMAL TO ME!!"

 

it's like snipers versus anti snipers. in one camp you got someone so dedicated to go so far as to devote their life to exposing the powers that continually fuck them over and harm the world - then you got the happy go lucky optimistic mormon faced shit stick that thinks they have a serious bead on this whole thing based on what they interpreted from their mainstream newscast.

 

always question authority.

 

about the movie: it is too long, and very disheartening to watch after the phrase 'new world order' is crammed up your cramhole for the first 15 minutes. but i progressed forward 30 more minutes before falling asleep and writing this review. damn my ADHD. oh well, hotel sluts await.

 

oh and why does spitfire even come into crossfire?

[El Mamerro]

Equally as funny when peons look into the political spectrum and say "YEP, EVERYTHING LOOKS EVIL TO ME!"