"War on Terror" Thread

[WORDISM45]

mexican troops crossed in to texas during the beginning of the mexican-american war.

 

 

i dont' really consider "9/11" as in "invasion" in the conventional sense since these men were technically civilians and didn't represent an army of any recognized nation. they had visas and were here legally. more of a terrorist attack.

 

 

wasn't texas a part of mexico at that point in time?

 

and yeah i know you said attack/invasion 9/11 was an attack not an invasion...

[Theo Huxtable.]

a small portion of texas was part of mexico. but most of texas was part of the US.

[Dawood]

casek, i just read back a little and realised this dude purple mushroom is an idiot. He clearly misunderstood your words. He also thinks miltary isn't necessary. Military is DEFINITELY necessary for any group of individuals seeking to not be slaves of the next group of individuals with a military.

[lord_casek]

casek, i just read back a little and realised this dude purple mushroom is an idiot. He clearly misunderstood your words. He also thinks miltary isn't necessary. Military is DEFINITELY necessary for any group of individuals seeking to not be slaves of the next group of individuals with a military.

 

and you know this, maaaaaaaaaan!

 

 

yeah, i figured it out a while back when PM was arguing with others.

he doesn't respect religion, liberty, or freedom.

[lord_casek]

cia torture jet crashes with 4 tons of cocaine on board

[lord_casek]

http://209.85.165.104/search?q=cache:JBv3YsAMrXgJ:www.npr.org/iraq/2004/prison_abuse_report.pdf+The+Taguba+Report&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=1&gl=us

[ILOTSMYBRAIN]

PM isn't an idiot.

 

He just has his own set of views.

 

I agree with some of them, just not all of them.

[smooth bruce]

casek, i just read back a little and realised this dude purple mushroom is an idiot. He clearly misunderstood your words. He also thinks miltary isn't necessary. Military is DEFINITELY necessary for any group of individuals seeking to not be slaves of the next group of individuals with a military.

 

Military are unnecessary for most nations and the fucking stupidity of your last sentence is an example of why you shouldn't even argue, it isn't 1725 anymore.

 

I also will ignore the comment about being an 'idiot' from a qu'ran believer as the irony is to overpowering.

 

and you know this, maaaaaaaaaan!

 

 

yeah, i figured it out a while back when PM was arguing with others.

he doesn't respect religion, liberty, or freedom.

 

I respect and understand the last two, obviously a lot more than you do, and I respect the right to practice the first in a free land. The problem you have is that your views of what constitute liberty and freedom are limited, you don't understand anything about history or your own culture and you think people are 'idiots' when they disagree with your indoctrinated stupidity about respecting troops (a clear example of not knowing the first thing about liberty and freedom).

[lord_casek]

you don't know shit about my culture or our history. you disrespect your god and your fellow man.

[angelofdeath]

there is a much better case to be made for a military or militia in todays world then there was in 1725.

 

you're some sort of anarcho-communist are you not purple mushroom?

[smooth bruce]

you don't know shit about my culture or our history. you disrespect your god and your fellow man.

 

I am an "idiot" who doesn't understand the noble goals of freedom and liberty that casek holds so dear...

 

Unlike Bolivia, Ecuador, Venezuela, Belize, Argentina, Guyana, Chile, Brazil, Cuba, Surinam, Columbia, Honduras, El Salvador, French Guiana, Grenada, Nicaragua, Panama, Paraguay, Peru, Uruguay, Afghanistan, Iraq, Iran, Saudi Arabia... ...

 

Should I continue with where you export your freedom and liberty that I don't understand or respect? Maybe we should respect the 'troops' involved in all of those events? I for one respect the warrior class even when it is a high level agent giving crates of weapons to other warriors to blow up churches and rape children then cut their heads off...

 

...yeah I am the idiot with no understanding of liberty, freedom and the warrior class.

[lord_casek]

see? you're probably also anti-jew aren't you?

 

and dude, this isn't my government right now. this isn't anyones government but the bush's and the bin ladens. we unfortunately lost our noble country a while back.

 

i don't believe in exporting democracy to anyone. democracy is a bad thing. that's why we live in a democratic republic.

 

and no, you said "my culture" not the culture of our military industrial complex.

[smooth bruce]

there is a much better case to be made for a military or militia in todays world then there was in 1725.

 

you're some sort of anarcho-communist are you not purple mushroom?

 

There is always a strong case for people being able to defend themselves and I guess within the current framework a Nation to have a defensive military. The difference is when the military leave their land it is no longer defense and subsequently we can throw all of Dawood's stupid notions of protection out the window.

 

Yes, some sort.

[smooth bruce]

see? you're probably also anti-jew aren't you?

 

No, that is not only a stupid assumption but a testament to the pre-determined category's you have people fit into.

 

So lets see...

 

I point out, off the head, a SMALL list of the countries you have brutally fucked over during the last 50 years and therefore I am probably anti-jew? Yeah that makes a lot of sense.

 

and dude, this isn't my government right now. this isn't anyones government but the bush's and the bin ladens.

 

Yes it is the United States government, it is your government.

 

we unfortunately lost our noble country a while back.

 

It was never noble and this is where you have a dream world in replace of a sound understanding of your country's history.

 

i don't believe in exporting democracy to anyone. democracy is a bad thing. that's why we live in a democratic republic.

 

Democracy is a bad thing? See that is why you are stupid and you also don't live in a democratic republic, you live in a polyarchy.

 

It seems you have this trend of not knowing anything about your country and replacing it with fairy tales.

[angelofdeath]

"The difference is when the military leave their land it is no longer defense"

 

i agree with that.

however, in my view the military is justified in following the attackers outside of ones borders, making children of their wives, killing them and bbq'ing their goats.

[smooth bruce]

"The difference is when the military leave their land it is no longer defense"

 

i agree with that.

however, in my view the military is justified in following the attackers outside of ones borders, making children of their wives, killing them and bbq'ing their goats.

 

Revenge crimes are equal to the crime of aggression but if you want to fight UN charters I am not going to stop you.

 

Subsequently we can apply your theory to pretty much every country I listed (and many more) and the US would be in deep shit.

[lord_casek]

yes, democracy is a bad thing.

 

 

if you lived in a neighborhood that was ruled by democracy, your neighbors could vote you out because they don't like your haircut.

in a democratic republic, people have personal freedoms and a choice. your neighbors can't do shit if they don't like your haircut.

 

dolt.

[Stereotype V.0002]

you think people are 'idiots' when they disagree with your indoctrinated stupidity

 

Are you serious? Every single sentence you’ve typed on here revolves around petty name calling. And you are obviously pretty indoctrinated yourself with all of the noam chomsky talking points you have memorized so well.....i’m waiting for you to start talking about the imperialist yanqui threat and the power of the proletariat. But dont get me wrong I am a big fan of your overly emotional and angsty responses, you are among the best of 12oz's many distinguished douchebags. I would guess you have some fucked up personal shit going on in your life. Ok, you can get back to liberating the oppressed animals now.

[Stereotype V.0002]

i'll address this first and work backwards: i think it was 16% support and about 8% fighting.

you've got to remember that we were only a handful of colonies back then, so it wasn't that many people.

 

yes, a standing army in todays sense does support that idea of a paid military service, but when that was said, there wasn't such a thing. so, yeah.

 

as for support and respect: i support "our troops" as any good citizen of a country would. i respect the warrior class of every nation, tribe, etc.

 

understand?

 

8% is pretty high that would be like 200,000 people, washington had 15,000 troops at the siege of boston im not sure if the numbers ever got higher than around that level. And the army was definitely compensated, the continental army and various militias had enlistment contracts with set payments of money and land.

[smooth bruce]

Are you serious? Every single sentence you’ve typed on here revolves around petty name calling.

 

Says the little cry baby who uses leet speak when he loses an argument.

 

And you are obviously pretty indoctrinated yourself with all of the noam chomsky talking points you have memorized so well.....i’m waiting for you to start talking about the imperialist yanqui threat and the power of the proletariat.

 

I have not read a Chomsky book in a fair while but most of this shit is pretty self evident

 

But dont get me wrong I am a big fan of your overly emotional and angsty responses, you are among the best of 12oz's many distinguished douchebags.

 

This is a prime example of you, the cry baby. Please stop following me around little cry baby.

 

I would guess you have some fucked up personal shit going on in your life. Ok, you can get back to liberating the oppressed animals now.

 

I have not liberated any animals lately but perhaps you should liberate yourself from the follow me around crying cycle you are in.

[smooth bruce]

yes, democracy is a bad thing.

 

You are an idiot.

 

if you lived in a neighborhood that was ruled by democracy, your neighbors could vote you out because they don't like your haircut.

 

You don't know how democracy works. You are an idiot.

 

in a democratic republic, people have personal freedoms and a choice. your neighbors can't do shit if they don't like your haircut.

 

dolt.

 

You don't know how democracy works. You are an idiot.

[angelofdeath]

"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well armed lamb, contesting the vote." Ben Franklin

 

"Democracy is the most vile form of government... democracies have ever

been spectacles of turbulence and contention: have ever been found

incompatible with personal security or the rights of property:

and have in general been as short in their lives as they have been violent

in their deaths. " James Madison

 

"A democracy is nothing more than mob rule, where fifty-one percent of the people may take away the rights of the other forty-nine." Thomas Jefferson

 

"The mass of people, as La Boetie and Mises recognised, always and everywhere consists of "brutes", "dullards", and "fools", easily deluded and sunk into habitual submission. Thus today, inundated from early childhood with government propaganda in public schools and educational institutions by legions of publicly certified intellectuals, most people mindlessly accept and repeat nonsense such as that democracy is self-rule and government is of, by, and for the people." hans hoppe

 

"politicians "seldom if ever get [into public office] by merit alone, at least in democratic states. Sometimes, to be sure, it happens, but only by a kind of miracle. They are chosen normally for quite different reasons, the chief of which is simply their power to impress and enchant the intellectually underprivileged….Will any of them venture to tell the plain truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth about the situation of the country, foreign or domestic? Will any of them refrain from promises that he knows he can’t fulfill – that no human being could fulfill? Will any of them utter a word, however obvious, that will alarm or alienate any of the huge pack of morons who cluster at the public trough, wallowing in the pap that grows thinner and thinner, hoping against hope? Answer: may be for a few weeks at the start…. But not after the issue is fairly joined, and the struggle is on in earnest…. They will all promise every man, woman and child in the country whatever he, she or it wants. They’ll all be roving the land looking for chances to make the rich poor, to remedy the irremediable, to succor the unsuccorable, to unscramble the unscrambleable, to dephlogisticate the undephlogisticable. They will all be curing warts by saying words over them, and paying off the national debt with money no one will have to earn. When one of them demonstrates that twice two is five, another will prove that it is six, six and a half, ten, twenty, n. In brief, they will divest themselves from their character as sensible, candid and truthful men, and simply become candidates for office, bent only on collaring votes. They will all know by then, even supposing that some of them don’t know it now, that votes are collared under democracy, not by talking sense but by talking nonsense, and they will apply themselves to the job with a hearty yo-heave-ho. Most of them, before the uproar is over, will actually convince themselves. The winner will be whoever promises the most with the least probability of delivering anything." HL Mencken

 

"Democracy is also a form of worship. It is the worship of Jackals by Jackasses." Mencken

"Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard." Mencken

"Democracy is the art of running the circus from the monkey cage." Mencken

[Stereotype V.0002]

Purple Rain- in the time it took for you to write that post, 18 fluffy little bunny wabbits were sodomized to death by the imperial storm troopers, on orders from their capitalist overlords. I hope you’re happy.

 

Says the little cry baby who uses leet speak when he loses an argument.

 

Thats too bad I lost, I wasn’t even aware I was in an argument. I thought I was making a witty observation on how you cant seem to help yourself from the 2nd grade name calling. I hope whatever personal shit you are dealing with gets better though. Now I have two serious questions if its alright with you- is chomsky part of the school curriculum down under? And secondly this is something I am actually curious about and never get a straight answer to....but given your politics, do you ever feel like a hypocrite living off the tit of capitalism, in a capitalist country, brought to you by all the things you whine about?

[MayorMeanBeans]

stereotype i hate to interject here and i do not agree with purple mushroom's politics at all (that however does not make me an idiot), but i think your question (and implied response) is problematic.

 

i agree with you on a certain level, "how can you talk shit about capitalism, while typing away on a keyboard that was created by capitalism". that makes sense.

 

however, would you say its wrong for an american in the midwest to talk abotu native american rights/justice? its sort of hypocritical, they're living on stolen land. okay, i understand that this is a far out example because of the general skull stomping the native americans have taken over the centuries.

 

but being born where and how your born is completely arbitrary. if purple mushroom feels like where he lives is wrong, the beauty of democracy is that he can say so, and we can ignore him. now, if he were really to subscribe to his policies he wouldn't be on the internet, he would be in india with the naxalites (i was there in parts of india in january where the naxalites are pretty active, and that shit is sort of scary man. police state status). plus, purple mushroom is definitely fighting the man by being an animal liberationist, supporting attacks on medical research labs (this is something i unequivocally reject, this is just wrong).

 

i have some questions for purple mushroom as well- you said your an anarcho-commie of sorts. i was just wondering what this entails, because that label sounds inherently contradictory. anarchism favors complete devolution of the state to the people, while communism favors heavily centralized power. how are these two reconciled? is there no vanguard party? it seems to me that when you have planned economies (as communism prescribes to stem competition), there has to be some sort of concentrated power, no? similarly, in the event of an anarcho-commie revolution, there is no army? maybe im wrong but im assuming there is none (judging by your rejection of regarding military as an institution worthy of existence)? how do you qualify this with most anarchist/commie people stating that armed revolution is necessary for the overthrow of capitalism, and at one point does a people's army become a military (when they win?)??

[lord_casek]

israel visits US to try and convince US to bomb iran

http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5iJZ9jtm0mjZovx5YirnDlYlkJKdQD8TIG6J00

[Stereotype V.0002]

however, would you say its wrong for an american in the midwest to talk abotu native american rights/justice? its sort of hypocritical, they're living on stolen land. okay, i understand that this is a far out example because of the general skull stomping the native americans have taken over the centuries.

 

The massacres of native americans were basically a century ago, so I don’t think it would be hypocritical. If some little house on the prairie motherfuckers were bitching about the plight of the indians while under the protection of the cavalry/the people who were killing the indians, then yes I would say they are hypocrites. The evil empire, raping and pillaging the third world (atleast in his mind) to keep up the high standard of living we have in the west IS going on right now, which is the difference. Not that I expect a real answer anyway, nobody wants to admit theyre a hypocrite.

 

now, if he were really to subscribe to his policies he wouldn't be on the internet, he would be in india with the naxalites (i was there in parts of india in january where the naxalites are pretty active, and that shit is sort of scary man. police state status). plus, purple mushroom is definitely fighting the man by being an animal liberationist, supporting attacks on medical research labs (this is something i unequivocally reject, this is just wrong).

 

Were you out there on business or part of a school thing? I have a family member who was in India recently on business, sounds like a pretty bizarre place in general. Anyway I really doubt people like him would end up with the naxals or farc or nepalese maoists with their balls actually on the line which is why I think they are generally harmless, maybe a little annoying. Eating an vegan diet on the move in the bush would be a little tricky anyhow. But there are exceptions to the rule, I saw a clip from al jazeera of a 20-something white American with al qaeda in southern Somalia which was pretty funny. I bet his parents are proud.

[angelofdeath]

"but given your politics, do you ever feel like a hypocrite living off the tit of capitalism, in a capitalist country, brought to you by all the things you whine about?"

 

word.

as milton friedman was always pointing out... that only a free capitalist society is one where freedom is present. that a free society allows one to have the view of a socialist. but if you try to have capitalist views in a socialist society, you are chunked in the gulag.

[angelofdeath]

menino,

to keep matters simple... anarcho commies are basically anarchists who think they can have a completely socialist private propertyless world without a state. to me the philosophy is totally contradictory, but whatever. people can think what they want as long as they dont do anything to me. however, most of these types support social democrats, which are all in favor of the state. and they simply cant let others live the way they want too. there is nothing in a free society stopping the commies from creating their own voluntary communes and living the way they want too. but they really cant, because there whole philosophy is based on coercion.

[MayorMeanBeans]

The massacres of native americans were basically a century ago, so I don’t think it would be hypocritical. If some little house on the prairie motherfuckers were bitching about the plight of the indians while under the protection of the cavalry/the people who were killing the indians, then yes I would say they are hypocrites. The evil empire, raping and pillaging the third world (atleast in his mind) to keep up the high standard of living we have in the west IS going on right now, which is the difference. Not that I expect a real answer anyway, nobody wants to admit theyre a hypocrite.

 

yeah, i agree with you, the native american example is a cheap shot on my part, cuz its implications are so unambiguous. however, by you saying that if purple mushroom doesnt like the good parts of capitalism, he should go live in the bad parts is a simplistic argument. he doesnt want capitalism period (purple mushroom i don't want to speak for you, and i don't mean to, this is just my line of thinking in the third person). thats why i thought that was sort of an impossible answer.

 

Were you out there on business or part of a school thing? I have a family member who was in India recently on business, sounds like a pretty bizarre place in general. Anyway I really doubt people like him would end up with the naxals or farc or nepalese maoists with their balls actually on the line which is why I think they are generally harmless, maybe a little annoying. Eating an vegan diet on the move in the bush would be a little tricky anyhow. But there are exceptions to the rule, I saw a clip from al jazeera of a 20-something white American with al qaeda in southern Somalia which was pretty funny. I bet his parents are proud.

 

i went for pleasure *. asterisk because i didn't really go sightseeing, i really just went to check it out, get a feel for it. ive been studying third world politics for four years now, and its fucked up that i read all day about political mobilization etc etc, but have never even been there. my pops has the sort of job where he gets a lot of frequent flyer miles, so i didn't have to pay for an airline ticket. i met some profs there and spoke to them, alot of indian poli sci students have blogs that i met up with out there. i met a lot of random people. i was only there for a month, but my base was hyderabad in andhra pradesh (there were bombings by bangladeshis there a little bit after i left). this is the Mecca Masjid that was bombed (i think the courtyard of it was bombed, where more people are):

 

 

 

 

 

 

regarding the naxalites (people i met called them naxalites, is the universal terms naxals?), i didn't notice them in the city at all, but they had the country side mad flyered up, i saw a couple bombed out bridges but other than that it wasn't really that big a deal.

 

of course, being an affluent person raises all sorts of contradictions (ie how can someone of my background feel the allure of the naxalite). by the end of teh trip i would get in constant arguments cuz i knew i was getting ripped off over 10-20 rupees, only to do the math and realize that was the equivalent of 50 cents. you just get into this mode of not wanting to get ripped off, regardless if the 10-20 rupees are marginal to you.

 

 

you gotta get used to getting stared at too

[MayorMeanBeans]

a couple more pictures cuz im sick of the agenda-setting hypothesis of media effects:

 

 

 

this is me and a professor of telugu poetry in front of the mecca masjid. you can see the courtyard better. people were gathered there for friday prayers when some bastards from bangladesh set some shit off. i met a telugu poetry professor because telugu is a language whose speakers are very separatist and want to secede from andhra pradesh. its sort of a quebec situation.

 

 

 

 

the sunset enjoyed by capitalists, libertarians and anarcho-commies a like. why do the naxalites care if they're poor, they're rich in sunsets. nh.

 

 

kind of hard to see, but this is a bombed out bridge by the naxalites. behind it is a dam. by blowing up this bridge, it became very difficult for supplies to get to the dam, and a lot of people lost electricity in the city. of course, the naxalites are very influential in the country, where there is no power, so im sure they scored a huge political victory. while the city got real pissed off.