qbarawk Posted February 9, 2007 Share Posted February 9, 2007 Every day, there are more and more CL posts seeking "artists" for everything from auto graphics to comic books to corporate logo designs. More people are finding themselves in need of some form of illustrative service. But what they're NOT doing, unfortunately, is realizing how rare someone with these particular talents can be. To those who are "seeking artists", let me ask you; How many people do you know, personally, with the talent and skill to perform the services you need? A dozen? Five? One? ...none? More than likely, you don't know any. Otherwise, you wouldn't be posting on craigslist to find them. And this is not really a surprise. In this country, there are almost twice as many neurosurgeons as there are professional illustrators. There are eleven times as many certified mechanics. There are SEVENTY times as many people in the IT field. So, given that they are less rare, and therefore less in demand, would it make sense to ask your mechanic to work on your car for free? Would you look him in the eye, with a straight face, and tell him that his compensation would be the ability to have his work shown to others as you drive down the street? Would you offer a neurosurgeon the "opportunity" to add your name to his resume as payment for removing that pesky tumor? (Maybe you could offer him "a few bucks" for "materials". What a deal!) Would you be able to seriously even CONSIDER offering your web hosting service the chance to have people see their work, by viewing your website, as their payment for hosting you? If you answered "yes" to ANY of the above, you're obviously insane. If you answered "no", then kudos to you for living in the real world. But then tell me... why would you think it is okay to live out the same, delusional, ridiculous fantasy when seeking someone whose abilities are even less in supply than these folks? Graphic artists, illustrators, painters, etc., are skilled tradesmen. As such, to consider them as, or deal with them as, anything less than professionals fully deserving of your respect is both insulting and a bad reflection on you as a sane, reasonable person. In short, it makes you look like a twit. A few things you need to know; 1. It is not a "great opportunity" for an artist to have his work seen on your car/'zine/website/bedroom wall, etc. It IS a "great opportunity" for YOU to have their work there. 2. It is not clever to seek a "student" or "beginner" in an attempt to get work for free. It's ignorant and insulting. They may be "students", but that does not mean they don't deserve to be paid for their hard work. You were a "student" once, too. Would you have taken that job at McDonalds with no pay, because you were learning essential job skills for the real world? Yes, your proposition it JUST as stupid. 3. The chance to have their name on something that is going to be seen by other people, whether it's one or one million, is NOT a valid enticement. Neither is the right to add that work to their "portfolio". They get to do those things ANYWAY, after being paid as they should. It's not compensation. It's their right, and it's a given. 4. Stop thinking that you're giving them some great chance to work. Once they skip over your silly ad, as they should, the next ad is usually for someone who lives in the real world, and as such, will pay them. There are far more jobs needing these skills than there are people who possess these skills. 5. Students DO need "experience". But they do NOT need to get it by giving their work away. In fact, this does not even offer them the experience they need. Anyone who will not/can not pay them is obviously the type of person or business they should be ashamed to have on their resume anyway. Do you think professional contractors list the "experience" they got while nailing down a loose step at their grandmother's house when they were seventeen? If you your company or gig was worth listing as desired experience, it would be able to pay for the services it received. The only experience they will get doing free work for you is a lesson learned in what kinds of scrubs they should not lower themselves to deal with. 6. (This one is FOR the artists out there, please pay attention.) Some will ask you to "submit work for consideration". They may even be posing as some sort of "contest". These are almost always scams. They will take the work submitted by many artists seeking to win the "contest", or be "chosen" for the gig, and find what they like most. They will then usually have someone who works for them, or someone who works incredibly cheap because they have no originality or talent of their own, reproduce that same work, or even just make slight modifications to it, and claim it as their own. You will NOT be paid, you will NOT win the contest. The only people who win, here, are the underhanded folks who run these ads. This is speculative, or "spec", work. It's risky at best, and a complete scam at worst. I urge you to avoid it, completely. For more information on this subject, please visit http://www.no-spec.com. So to artists/designers/illustrators looking for work, do everyone a favor, ESPECIALLY yourselves, and avoid people who do not intend to pay you. Whether they are "spec" gigs, or just some guy who wants a free mural on his living room walls. They need you. You do NOT need them. And for those who are looking for someone to do work for free... please wake up and join the real world. The only thing you're accomplishing is to insult those with the skills you need. Get a clue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soulkillers Posted February 9, 2007 Share Posted February 9, 2007 go away Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhereEaglesDare Posted February 10, 2007 Share Posted February 10, 2007 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flavicon Posted February 10, 2007 Share Posted February 10, 2007 That post is ON POINT!!. Thank you for taking the time to write that. It actually made me laugh out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bo0da Posted February 26, 2007 Share Posted February 26, 2007 well said. im a graphic designer, and have seen many experience/competition jobs listed. i used to laugh and think cheeky cunts then find something worth applying to. Now i open up mspaint, light a fat spliff and bastardize their brief. making sure the end result is a hefty .bmp file that is full of crap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
porkism Posted February 26, 2007 Share Posted February 26, 2007 great post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GOLA Posted March 1, 2007 Share Posted March 1, 2007 i think if i had the runs, and i pooped onto a forum this is what it would look like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AerosolKid Posted March 23, 2007 Share Posted March 23, 2007 This thread makes me laugh...so it needs to be closed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pikapika Posted March 23, 2007 Share Posted March 23, 2007 Thanks for writing that. I liked reading it and it's most definitely true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delonemonkey Posted March 23, 2007 Share Posted March 23, 2007 yo i dont know why any of you guys would diss this thread. Hes obviously made good points and is trying to help out the more proffesional writers. He stuck up for the few people who piece and ripped the people who scam them. Thnks qbarawk for taking the time to write that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delonemonkey Posted March 23, 2007 Share Posted March 23, 2007 but ya this thread should be closed by now and only reviewed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RAWoNe Posted March 24, 2007 Share Posted March 24, 2007 nah man good point, people are fucking scumbags. if you want this thread closed you're the kind of dude pulling these scams. nicely put. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baz00kaT00th Posted March 24, 2007 Share Posted March 24, 2007 if your work is good enough, and u know how to sell it, u wouldnt have this problem. i mean, will u pay a crappy or mediocre neurosurgeon, ANY money? i guess the point should be rather that companies shouldnt hire half ass artists. but meanwhile if ur portfolio is weak, then why not use that opportunity to freshen it up with some work for a company even if it doesnt pay...so everything is just the way it should be! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murdoc1 Posted March 24, 2007 Share Posted March 24, 2007 This shit is mad true, and thanks for posting it, unfortunately there will always be the haters and ignorant artists who will be taken advantage of end up making life harder for the rest of us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chase86 Posted March 26, 2007 Share Posted March 26, 2007 It makes alot of sense ppl don't really respect up and coming artist, good post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
De sign Posted March 26, 2007 Share Posted March 26, 2007 yea, i freelance graohic designer. screenprinter. its classic. iv relised this. now i start off @ $250. up up and awayyy1!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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