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Steady Shine

Why does train painting not flourish In the U.S

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Why don't U.S writers paint trains? This has got me stumped.

 

I have seen all the world VS u.s arguements on this board and hopefully this will not turn into one. I am very interested in why there is a small or non existant train scene in the U.S

 

First off why this confuses me.

 

I come from a city with a population of under 2 million that has a large urban sprawl. The train system is by comparison to anywhere else extremely small. Five lines, all under an hour to travel from one end to the other.

 

What stops us painting trains?

 

-Electric fences

-Sensor fences

-Sebsored yards

-Guard dogs

-Alot of guards

-razor wire trenches

-Fucking MOATS (yes 6m moats full of water like the fucking dark ages)

 

Does shit still get crushed?

 

Fuck yes. We even manage to get our shit running in traffic depending on layup and backjump times.

 

Why then in a city as incredibley populated as NYC do trains never get done?

 

Every train system in the world needs layups for dealing with track clashes. A system that carries 7 million or something a day surely has to have A FUCKING LOT of trains which in turn equals MULTIPLE LARGE yards to store them.

 

What other cities in the U.S have train systems? <-- I would really like to know this

 

I thought maybe it was just an evolution within the country a move away from trains and onto street bombing. But then I see how much the freight trains catch love so that theory went out the window.

 

If you love street bombing and throwups (I do too) but you love painting freight trains (me too) then how is real steel panels on a clean commuter not held in the 1st place regard ?

 

The only defense I have ever heard is that they are 'too hard' to be done in NYC.

 

Again I am not trying to start any kind of fight but to state FACTS the tourists that visit NYC absolutely KILL trains.

 

This thread has been sparked by the mass transit strike that has hit NYC. It makes me want to keel over and die thinking of not being there for that situation. Please tell me someone is taking advantage of it.

 

So to round off this chapter of undrafted semi drunk dribbling train passion can some U.S writers shed some light on ....

 

How much steel actually does get painted?

OR

Why steel dosnt get painted?

OR

Again, what other cities have transit systems?

OR

any other similar shit you think I might want to know

 

Peace in advance to the cats that might drop some knowledge and eat a dick to the generic 12oz toys that will come in to throw some hate in any and every thread they find

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its not to be said that cleans dont get done, the intimidation factor is there for a lot of less established writers as the likely hood of catching a running panel is near impossible, the interest isnt there for the 95 % of the poppulation... Thus leaving a select few who eat sleep and breath metal who hit them

 

Now this is where you're misunderstanding, in the city im from our system gets hit all the time, not only out of towners but our writers as well, the simple fact is that these writers aren't putting the pictures up on the internet left right and center, of that 5% of writeres left you could say that the likely hood of self promotion is non existent.....

Thus creating a misunderstanding of the actual amount done,

 

Your concepts are not the first time ive heard of the fact that your security is through the roof. Not so long ago we had a European visitor who was laughing at our train security...

 

There you have it I hope that you've got the idea now

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i've done cleans in a few cities

pictures don't get around.

 

i know a couple of guys who are going way harder than i ever did or hoped to.

but their shit is not becoming public. it's for their own enjoyment.

law enforcement is a bitch here.

 

if those pictures got out and a case was built against those guys, it would probably mean hundreds of thousands in fines, a raided house, confiscated stuff plus jail time in a u.s. prison.

 

plus we have the option of freights.

freights in europe suck

but in the u.s., their are millions of them and they travel all over the continent.

 

for info on u.s transit systems

(which cities have them, links to the sites of the transit systems so you can see how tiny some are..)

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_metro...s#United_States

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i know in most places they simply will not let bombed trains run, as soon as they see them monday morning, they are taken off the line and buffed, letting literally no one see them...this is where you get into the debate of doing graff for fame vs. personal sake...but yeah, its kinda like asking why is it cool to walk down the street smoking a joint in europe, but not in the u.s? things are just different here

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Age old question..

I think the answer is, more people do paint cleans than you would think in the US.

Freights are so popular so the mentality is different.

Booyahh...

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Ok so similar scene to my environment. (not europe)

 

Which is to say basically 20% of writers are actually driven to do it and not much runs and everything is kept well on the downlow.

 

Also this is not a call for fucking info or pictures. I will buy a magazine for that. It is natural to assume it dosn't get spread on here. Obviously with the physical security measures we also have our own nazi investigation squads, giant fines and serious jail time.

 

Originally posted by EnimeeOne@Dec 22 2005, 02:11 AM

Freights are so popular so the mentality is different.

 

Yeah we paint alot of freights also. The freight fleet size of the U.S must be mind boggling. Freights are easy(er) here (moats, dogs and pissed off workers with tools) so we do them alot. Maybe its uneducation by what are the U.S freight spots like with the 'crazy bum/derelict' culture? suckers ever get bashed ? :haha: Any freight car series or certain companys that have their trains run across your boarders into mexico and canada n shit? those would be fucking dope to paint.

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In my city alone there is transit lines and they do get painted as well goes for people I know in other cities who are crushing their transit lines. but for obvious reasons these cats don't post pictures of them online. This leads to the misconception of americans on cleans, not a lot of people post the flicks. They do it for themselves not for self promotion on the net.

 

Plus, the freight scene is fucking huge and yes, our freights travel through canada and back as well as mexico and back. So painting a freight means your shit will get caught in three countries not to mention freights don't get buffed like cleans so your shit lasts. Plus freights are a breeze to paint in my city, it's almost too easy.

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Originally posted by you enjoy myself+Dec 21 2005, 11:20 AM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (you enjoy myself - Dec 21 2005, 11:20 AM)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--QuoteBegin-Steady Shine@Dec 21 2005, 05:06 AM

How much steel actually does get painted?

OR

Why steel dosnt get painted?

OR

Again, what other cities have transit systems?

OR

any other similar shit you think I might want to know

 

Peace in advance to the cats that might drop some knowledge and eat a dick to the generic 12oz toys that will come in to throw some hate in any and every thread they find

 

oh man, nice questions.

 

go fuck yerself.

 

 

:haha:

[/b]

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well this is a very controversial topic if you lived here you would know why but alll the sensor cameras moats etc.. are no comparison to the us we have bulls crooked ones at that , that will killl you and leave you on the tracks and here they dont go to your house and bust you they build cases against you and do complete investigations even what im typing right now can be saved to a police database ..

 

 

also europes' entire mentallity towards graffiti or anything in that matter is passive like the second rennaissance and we americans get run over by trains killed and busted anll of the time

 

 

no the scene has not gone to city bombing only but thats how everyone starts out thats how you get respect...further more ther are a lot of toys whish is all they do is city shit...

 

oh yeash i dont agree with that 5 percent statement its more like 10 to 15 percent depending on where you live a lot of trains get hit but here bulls and cops are fucking corrupt and their not the only people you have to worry about.. other writers, bums, railworkers any of these people under the wrong circumstances can get you killed cause i dunno about europe but hee people are really defensive about "their spot" and walking into another niggas' "spot" can get you stabbed or worse lest we forget captain save a hoes which are normal people who try to be "heroes" and kick your ass...

 

so heres my response in a nutshell..

come over here and find out you euros dont care you smash a few freights then leave us on the other hand have to live here....nuff said

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Hell, I live in the second largest city in IL. I've got a freight yard and a CTA yard. The CTAs run into Chicago and I know that if i paint them, they'll at least make one trip. Its just the fact that its too easy to buff my work off that its not worth it to me. I'll just stick to freights I think..

EDIT: Plus, Im sure that when trains roll out of the CTA yard all bombed out..they'll know where I come from. :burn:

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In the US right now there are about 300,000 freight cars. Theoretically any of them can go anywhere, but because commerce and industry follow patterns, so do the freights... most boxcars and such wind up going between two or four different cities, around and around... of course the cities could be Los Angeles and St. Louis and Atlanta...

 

Having recently been in London and Dortmund, i can say Yes, American train security is a bit of a laugh... last month i was in a US city where we basically walked right into the yard... not even a fence really... that just wouldn't happen in Europe. And in the US you're not gonna be painting a trackside wall when a train bears down on you doing 180 mph, that's three miles a minute if you're counting, and you have twenty seconds tops between when you see it and you're hamburger if you don't move, and NO you can't hear it before it's onto you...

 

the rush of being in a sanfran tunnel when a muni zipped past doing 50, one foot away... and the rush of being three feet away from a German ICE train doing 180 three feet away... while you're ducked in by the electrical pylon... yeah stuff in Europe is crazier... America is cake by comparison...

 

and yes i seen a few flix from here, stuff gets done, and almost nobody sees it but the writers and their friends. euro's come over here and with a connection or two they get their panels and their flix and take 'em home...

 

the big mistake folks here make, is trying to get a scene going with pieces... you can't do it... in NYC 1970s it was tags tags tags everywhere and then you get stuff up faster than the buff can remove it...only THEN can you get pieces running...

 

unless you wanna do the old routine where you do pieces on one train and smash the windows on everything else in the yard... a bit brutal but it can work...

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Guest Sparoism

You never pulled the Pac Bell layup trick? That's all I'll say here. It's crazy..drink-Cisco-and-eat-Valium-and-still-stress-out kind of action. We'll discuss it someday I'm sure.

 

So, why have things changed? It's simple.

 

Thirty years ago, it was all new. You could DRIVE into some of the yards and barbecue and no one would say a goddamn thing, because people who didn't paint trains didn't care. No cell phones, no rewards, light if not nonexistenst sentences... basically no incentive to get involved.

 

Nowadays, on top of the transit police there are a bunch of heroes that aren't always motivated by principle, but PROFIT...who think one day- five hundred bucks to turn in a kid I don't know in for tagging? Sure, why not?"

 

Well...it is a good way to get hurt, for starters,

and it isn't stopping shit. Five bills is a new window. Five hundred in trade for good PR, fuck the window? PR, and make it snappy.

 

 

Transit is a business. Not a city agency, a BUSINESS. That informs their decisions.

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Originally posted by Sparoism@Dec 23 2005, 12:19 PM

You never pulled the Pac Bell layup trick? That's all I'll say here. It's crazy..drink-Cisco-and-eat-Valium-and-still-stress-out kind of action. We'll discuss it someday I'm sure.

 

So, why have things changed? It's simple.

 

Thirty years ago, it was all new. You could DRIVE into some of the yards and barbecue and no one would say a goddamn thing, because people who didn't paint trains didn't care. No cell phones, no rewards, light if not nonexistenst sentences... basically no incentive to get involved.

 

Nowadays, on top of the transit police there are a bunch of heroes that aren't always motivated by principle, but PROFIT...who think one day- five hundred bucks to turn in a kid I don't know in for tagging? Sure, why not?"

 

Well...it is a good way to get hurt, for starters,

and it isn't stopping shit. Five bills is a new window. Five hundred in trade for good PR, fuck the window? PR, and make it snappy.

 

 

Transit is a business. Not a city agency, a BUSINESS. That informs their decisions.

 

I haveto say, that this is also true in a place like London, where if your seen vandalising anything especially trains then someone will inform the police.

 

I lived in america for a few years, was working a lot, but decided i couldnt leave with out at least painting a few cleans. Managed to do a couple in nyc and also in chicago. At the time these were the hardest missions i'd done, but thren i moved to Europe.

 

First stop was Barcelona, it was crazy. No one gives a fuck if you tag in front of them. Family's walking tracks to get into stations without paying. But that was my mistake it looked easy. When it came to the commuter/ subway shit was different, and I ended up getting beaten by a security guard on the subway and fined.

 

Next stop was London, this was the opposite of crazy, lots of police on the streets and lots of visible and invisible security measures to guard their trains.

10ft high razor topped fences equipped with tremor sensors, security guards, motion sensors, infra red cctv and reecently pressure pads.

At first i thought it was impossible, but shit gets done, a lot. Stuff runs, but not for long, and this is only because so much gets done and the vandal squad and cleaners cant cope with protecting such a big system and they cant cope. Recently someone got sent down for 3 and a half years for tagging commuter trains in london...thats harsh.

 

Managed to paint a few tubes but they were all backjumps and to be honest werent that hard, and ran for a couple of hours, but the yards never had the balls knowledge to have a go.

 

But then also in europe yoiu have rome, meant to be quite hard with guards with guns and writers have been shot, but then on the other hand the subway doesnt get buffed, you just get taken out by locals.

 

Europe is a continent and every country is different, thats all i have to say.

peace

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not sure what cpickle is talking about.

 

 

i've done cleans on both sides of the pond, and europe had easy and tremendously difficult ones, same as in the u.s.

and although i will give it to europe, i've heard the security is worse,

the penalties and jails in the united states make europe's penalty phase lok like a stroll in the park with your girlfriend.

 

also, trains are travelling all over the united states (far bigger than europe) and they do get mixed up pretty well, sometimes it takes years, but it's nice seeing a ten year old piece you or your friend did...

and they are not only travelling between three or four destinations. rail is the number one mode of transport for goods in the u.s. rail moves 42% of consumables in the u.s. (not to mention that cpickle has no concept of the thousands of meters traversed between stops, and the hundreds of people they pass by on the way)

 

this is BNSF's payload..and keep in mind that BNSF is one of many large freight companies..

 

o 36,255 covered hoppers

o 15,327 gondolas

o 10,021 boxcars

o 10,866 open hoppers

o 7,854 flatcars

o 5,427 refrigerated "reefer" cars

o 827 automobile cars

o 639 tank cars

o 31 general purpose boxcars

o 302 "other" types of cars

 

BNSF directly operates some 24,500 miles (39,429 kilometers) of track. When these additional tracks are counted, however, the amount of track that the railway has direct control over rises to over 50,000 miles (80,467 kilometers).

 

Additionally, the BNSF Railway has been able to gain trackage rights on over 8,000 miles (12,875 kilometers) of track throughout the United States and Canada. These rights allow the BNSF to operate its own trains with its own crews on competing railroads' main tracks.

 

 

ok, so here's some u.s. totals:

 

Class I, Freight cars 560,154

Class I, Locomotive 20,028

Nonclass I freight cars 132,448

Car companies and shippers freight cars 688,194

 

yeah, so over a MILLION. not 300,000

 

and about 225 308 160 meters of track.

 

 

and for those who like to argue

just because you don't get it and aren't a part of it doesn't mean you should hate it.

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THESE THREADS SUCK>>> EUROPE PAINTS WAY MORE CLEANS BECAUSE THATS WHAT THE COOL THING TO DO IS. BUT THAT ISNT TO SAY THAEIR ARE A HANDFULL OF US WRITERS THAT ROCK SUBWAYS HERE.

 

I WAS IN ITALY AND had A REALL HARD TIME HITTING THE SUBWAYS EVEN WITH LOCALS TAKING ME. but the commuters were easier than my local frieght spots.....

US transit gets crushed too but we dont want you to know that,, so it can still be painted.

 

BUT YEAH AMERICANS ARE MORE INTO STREET SHIT AND FRIEGHTS WHILE EUROPE IS ALL ABOUT COMMUTERS AND SUBWAYS WITH SOME STREET ACTION THROWN IN.

 

WHATEVER GRAFFITI SUCKS

 

PLUS THERES ONLY LIKE 3 REAL SUBWAYS IN THE US WITH LIKE 10 light rail systems... in europe like every fucking city has a system.

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Originally posted by BEEFEATER@Dec 23 2005, 06:12 PM

And there are roughly 6,500 subway cars in NYC.

 

:)

wow, you're so cool

 

 

did you count those numbers on all 6500 fingers? Inbreeding worked to your benefit it seems

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are you just butt hurt because in your 29 years of life they never created a legal subway for you to paint with Krylon?

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alright you motherfuckers its time for me to set it straight for you fucking bitches..i went all over Europe in the summer at least 15 differnt cities..and in all but 2 cities i saw panles panles panels!!!!!!!!! motherfucker.. running.. in a couple cities i didint see any subway (xept tags n undersides) but the commuters made up for it... ive been around america enough.. going to do it proper soon again.. One thing i say (and ill be fair becasue most cities got these little dick subway systems, so ill only reffer to philedalphia new york and chicago when comparing to european major cities) is that how many fuckning panels did i see in america ever... >> NONE!! so dont say "you dont see it run but it gets done theres a scene just like in Europe" compare that to Europe, in cities there where the buff is probably the same as ny philly or chicago.. you see panels running still!!.. so theres a differnce,.. dont be using that 'its becasue people dont post flix' shit.. thats a bunch of crap because even if people in america post less flix of passenger trains than peopel in europe (which im not convinced of) the evidence from experince shows that more (using it modestly) trains are painted in Europe than in North america.. I was joking typoing this but since i already typed it fuck it sorry for goofer attitude i havent slept in 3 fucking days ..

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