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Weapon X

Is U.S. the No. 1 Rogue Nation?

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I see you google news link.... and raise you a google news link

 

the adbusters 'history of america' volume gives a good timeline.

Can you believe that the US has been doing it all along?

Dont belive me? Look at the United Fruit Company.

 

 

read all about it

a hundred years ago, fruit was todays oil.

 

note how many times the US sent troops to south american companies

to 'intervene' with the local governments and people. Really... it's everywhere.

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Guest imported_Tesseract

An incendiary device, white phosphorus is also used to light up combat areas. The use of incendiary weapons against civilians has been banned by the Geneva Convention since 1980.

 

The United States did not sign the relevant protocol to the convention, a U.N. official in New York said.

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Just the good ole boys doing their jobs, spreading freedom.

 

US forces 'used chemical weapons' during assault on city of Fallujah

 

By Peter Popham

Published: 08 November 2005

 

Powerful new evidence emerged yesterday that the United States dropped massive quantities of white phosphorus on the Iraqi city of Fallujah during the attack on the city in November 2004, killing insurgents and civilians with the appalling burns that are the signature of this weapon.

 

Ever since the assault, which went unreported by any Western journalists, rumours have swirled that the Americans used chemical weapons on the city.

 

On 10 November last year, the Islam Online website wrote: "US troops are reportedly using chemical weapons and poisonous gas in its large-scale offensive on the Iraqi resistance bastion of Fallujah, a grim reminder of Saddam Hussein's alleged gassing of the Kurds in 1988." The website quoted insurgent sources as saying: "The US occupation troops are gassing resistance fighters and confronting them with internationally banned chemical weapons."

 

In December the US government formally denied the reports, describing them as "widespread myths". "Some news accounts have claimed that US forces have used 'outlawed' phosphorus shells in Fallujah," the USinfo website said. "Phosphorus shells are not outlawed. US forces have used them very sparingly in Fallujah, for illumination purposes. "They were fired into the air to illuminate enemy positions at night, not at enemy fighters."

 

But now new information has surfaced, including hideous photographs and videos and interviews with American soldiers who took part in the Fallujah attack, which provides graphic proof that phosphorus shells were widely deployed in the city as a weapon. In a documentary to be broadcast by RAI, the Italian state broadcaster, this morning, a former American soldier who fought at Fallujah says: "I heard the order to pay attention because they were going to use white phosphorus on Fallujah. In military jargon it's known as Willy Pete.

 

"Phosphorus burns bodies, in fact it melts the flesh all the way down to the bone ... I saw the burned bodies of women and children. Phosphorus explodes and forms a cloud. Anyone within a radius of 150 metres is done for."

 

Photographs on the website of RaiTG24, the broadcaster's 24-hours news channel, http://www.rainews24.it, show exactly what the former soldier means. Provided by the Studies Centre of Human Rights in Fallujah, dozens of high-quality, colour close-ups show bodies of Fallujah residents, some still in their beds, whose clothes remain largely intact but whose skin has been dissolved or caramelised or turned the consistency of leather by the shells (see provided link below).

 

A biologist in Fallujah, Mohamad Tareq, interviewed for the film, says: "A rain of fire fell on the city, the people struck by this multi-coloured substance started to burn, we found people dead with strange wounds, the bodies burned but the clothes intact."

 

The documentary, entitled Fallujah: the Hidden Massacre, also provides what it claims is clinching evidence that incendiary bombs known as Mark 77, a new, improved form of napalm, was used in the attack on Fallujah, in breach of the UN Convention on Certain Conventional Weapons of 1980, which only allows its use against military targets.

 

Meanwhile, five US soldiers from the elite 75th Ranger Regiment have been charged with kicking and punching detainees in Iraq.

 

The news came as a suicide car bomber killed four American soldiers at a checkpoint south of Baghdad yesterday.

 

© 2005 Independent News & Media (UK) Ltd.

 

------------------------------------------

 

***See the photographs from Italian TV mentioned in the article here***:

 

http://www.rainews24.rai.it/ran24/inchiest...?gallery=1&id=2

 

(click on 'succissiva' to go to the next picture in the slideshow)

 

3.jpg

 

looks to me like they were lighting up more than the combat areas.

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some comments from another forum by a guy who's in the military, or so he claims:

 

If the WP charge is true, you’d have seen Fallujah so obscured with smoke that nothing would have been visable…and troops would have been at greater risk as they would have been running up on those guys at small arms range which eliminates any advantage the grunts had with their supporting arms.

I see clear streets on every bit of footage I’ve seen except for dust kicked up by HE, which is brown, not bright white as WP is.

In fact, when I was there, I was curious as to why the infantry DIDN’T have WP grenades to screen their movements across streets and such. A. They didn’t have any in inventory. B. Wouldn’t have used it if they had because a smokescreen neutralises every small arms advantage they had. You can’t scope a guy off a rooftop through a cloud of smoke.

(We found people with bizarre wounds-their bodies burned but their clothes intact, relates Mohamad Tareq al-Deraji, a biologist and Fallujah resident.)

Sorry, there has NEVER been an incindiary weapon used on the tactical level in all fo history that could concievably do that. You burn, all of you burns…period.

Also, if you’re using “Chemical� weapons, it would behoove you to equip your own people with gas masks….another piece of kit conspicuously absent in photos or footage. In fact, it’s usually the first thing that gets left behind or thrown in a ditch when soldiers move out.

Absence of gas masks leads me to conclude that the US didn’t even bother to use CS riot control agents (tear gas). Why? Cause it’s more of a pain in the ass than it’s worth.

 

any militarly dudes(villain) have anything to add...does this hold water?

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A Debate: Did the U.S. Military Attack Iraqi Civilians With White Phosphorous Bombs in Violation of the Geneva Conventions?

------------------------------------------------------------------------

We speak with a former U.S. soldier who witnessed orders being given to drop white phosphorous bombs over Fallujah; a Pentagon spokesperson in Baghdad who admits such bombs were used but denied they were used as a chemical weapon; and the news director of RAI TV, the Italian TV network that produced “Fallujah: The Hidden Massacre.� [includes rush transcript]

 

 

* Maurizio Torrealta, News Editor for the Italian television RAI and co-producer of the film "Fallujah: The Hidden Massacre."

* Jeff Englehart, former army Specialist in Iraq. He maintains a weblog called Fight to Survive

* Lieutenant Colonel Steve Boylan, spokesperson for the U.S. military in Iraq.

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When I was in the Marine Corps, we trained with willy pete rounds, and they were commonly used to "mark targets." The infantry fire control liason radios to the artillery support unit (usually several miles behind him) and calls in eight-digit artillery coordinates. This will allow the arty to drop a round within ten meters of the coordinates. The artillery radio-telephone operator (RTO) repeats the coordinates to double check. The infantry liason confirms, and requests "One round willy pete to mark target." The arty liason confirms, then says "One round willy pete, round out. Watch for smoke," when the round is fired. Boom. The WP hits near the target. The infantry liason radios back and adjusts fire, adding or subtracting distance, or right or left ("Long rifle, this is Hotel Three Six, adjust fire. Add one hundred, right fifty, over." The arty RTO confirms, then says "One round willy pete, round out. Watch for smoke." Boom. A cloud of white willy pete on target. The infantry liason then says "Long Rifle, target. Ten rounds Hotel Echo, FIRE FOR EFFECT." Boom boom boom boom boom ba-boomity boom bom. The target disappears under the hail of 155mm HE rounds. If the target is serviced, the infantry liason says "Long rifle, cease fire, I say again, cease fire." But if not, he says "Long rifle, RE-PEAT, I say again, RE-PEAT." "Roger, Hotel Three Six. Round out." Boom Boom Boom Boom Boomity ba-boom boom boom. Again, the target gets ten 155mm HE rounds. Twenty rounds of HE ought to definately do the trick. "Long Rifle, you got it. Cease fire."

 

Those two WP rounds make a big cloud of white smoke, and it also splatters chunks of burning white phosphorous everywhere, in a big radius about fifty or one hundred meters in every direction. One does not use WP for illumination. The WP burns the everloving shit out of anything it touches, and it doesn't spare anything. Anything that will burn, burns--including houses, trees, crops, vehicles, livestock and people. If the shit gets on you, it is burning white phosphorous. It burns until it goes out. Water won't put it out, nothing else will either. Standard battlefield first aid for casualties hit by WP is to try to dig the burning WP out of the casualty with a bayonet before it burns all the way through him.

 

Illumination is achieved with ILLUM rounds, which are not WP, but magnesium flares suspended by a parachute. There are 81mm mortar ILLUM rounds, 4.2 inch mortar ILLUM rounds, 105mm ILLUM rounds and 155mm ILLUM rounds. None of them contain WP.

 

Getting burned by WP would really suck (in fact, getting burned by anything would really suck.) We watched them shoot WP in training at 29 Palms, CA.

 

I have a hard time imagining anybody using WP grenades to create a smokescreen, but perhaps if you had a lot of WP grenades and no smoke grenades, a WP would work, if you really, really needed smoke. Most likely, if the Marines used a lot of WP at Fallujah, they were highly pissed at the guys defending and wanted to teach them a lesson for shooting at Marines. "Either surrender peaceably, RIGHT FUCKING NOW, or get your ass smoked, motherfucker."

 

Civilians would be highly advised to get the hell out of any battle area where Marines are about to attack the enemies of the United States, because what is about to happen is that everybody and every thing beyond the forward edge of the battle area is about to die horribly. The Marine Corps has the combat power to erradicate every living thing in front of it, and nobody should be stupid enough to believe that they will not use it. It is what Marines do: kill the everloving shit out of everything they see on a battlefield, using fire and close combat. White phosphorous is JUST THE START.

 

You guys have absolutely no idea the amount of force that a single Marine battalion can bring to bear. It is awesome in it's horror.

 

Napalm may only be used against military targets. Terrorist insurgents are a military target. Ergo, they are fair game, for napalm, or willy pete, or what-the-fuck-ever.

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Guest imported_Tesseract

Damn, was i away from this forum a long time or kabar is really inspired lately?

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"You guys have absolutely no idea the amount of force that a single Marine battalion can bring to bear. It is awesome in it's horror."

 

oh, really?

no shit sherlock.

why the FUCK do you think some of us were so against this war in the first place?

 

fucking destruction of a sovereign nation, AND FOR WHAT?

before we looked like a cool country with a shit military/govt apparatus

now we all just look like shit

we're the new empire, is what the fuck we are.

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hmmm...the soldier in the report refers to WP as 'whiskey pete' NOT 'willy pete'.

so far as i can tell, it is in fact called 'willy pete' NOT 'whiskey pete'..is that not

a pretty big slip up or do they have different names for this shit?

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I got to hear some pretty wicked second hand Fallujah stories from a buddy who just got out of the marine corp, many of his friends were there. He said when they stormed the city, they were told to kill everything in their path no matter what, even if its a 6 year old walking down the street, to hit it with all you got. I am so fucking glad I never joined the service.

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"Whiskey" is the military phonetic for the letter "W". The "willy pete" moniker is an old one (military forces have used white phosphorus rounds for a long time, since around WWI) from back when the phonetic alphabet was different. Today it is Alfa, Bravo, Charlie, Delta, Echo, Fox and so on. Back then it was Able, Baker, Charlie, Dog, Easy, Foxtrot and so on. "Willie" was "W," and "Pete" was "P," I think. Today it is "Whiskey" and "Poppa." Nevertheless, I never heard a Marine call white phosphorus anything but "willy pete."

 

Even training is extremely hazardous. While I was in the Marines there were three or four deaths in our regiment that occured during training, from vehicle crashes, rollovers, accidental weapons discharges, etc. When I was in the National Guard, a guy from another battalion was crushed between two tanks while guiding one in the dark using night vision devices. I was injured myself, helping open up the huge, heavy, tank engine-bay doors on the top of the tank behind the turret. We had to replace an engine. The engines and transmissions are designed to be quickly replaceable. I think there are only eight large bolts holding one of those huge air-cooled, supercharged V-12 diesel engines in place, plus three electrical connections, like plugs. Changing one only takes a couple of hours. The engines are stockpiled on or near the battlefield inside of huge clamshell-like aluminum cases. Watching the mechanics change an engine or transmission in a tank is like watching a pit crew at a NASCAR race. They haul ass.

My tank crew was back in "action" before lunch, but I, fortunately, was medevac'ed to the Battalion Aid Station, and then on to "the rear area," to a Brigade field hospital. (Of course, there were perfectly good civilian hospitals about fifteen minutes away, but since we were training for war, I wound up on a cot in a tent in the desert, hobbling 100 yards to take a piss, instead of in a nice, clean Yakima hospital bed.)

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Originally posted by KaBar2@Nov 9 2005, 08:59 AM

Civilians would be highly advised to get the hell out of any battle area where Marines are about to attack the enemies of the United States, because what is about to happen is that everybody and every thing beyond the forward edge of the battle area is about to die horribly.  The Marine Corps has the combat power to erradicate every living thing in front of it, and nobody should be stupid enough to believe that they will not use it.  It is what Marines do:  kill the everloving shit out of everything they see on a battlefield, using fire and close combat.  White phosphorous is JUST THE START.

 

You guys have absolutely no idea the amount of force that a single Marine battalion can bring to bear.  It is awesome in it's horror.

 

Napalm may only be used against military targets.  Terrorist insurgents are a military target.  Ergo, they are fair game, for napalm, or willy pete, or what-the-fuck-ever.

 

The fact that you condone this like it's ok to just storm a town and kill every single thing in sight, man woman and child, old and young, threat or not... shows what an evil fucking douchebag you are.

They call terrorists "cowards" for doing exactly this, and they don't have the support of body armor, tanks, state of the art equipment, an entire batalian right behind them. They also don't have the luxury of sending lazer guided bombs from miles away... therefore they usually have to sacrafice themselves in order to kill others.

If the Terrorists are "cowards" than what does that make you and your beloved Marine Corps?

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The fact that you condone this like it's ok to just storm a town and kill every single thing in sight, man woman and child, old and young, threat or not... shows what an evil fucking douchebag you are.

They call terrorists "cowards" for doing exactly this, and they don't have the support of body armor, tanks, state of the art equipment, an entire batalian right behind them. They also don't have the luxury of sending lazer guided bombs from miles away... therefore they usually have to sacrafice themselves in order to kill others.

If the Terrorists are "cowards" than what does that make you and your beloved Marine Corps?

 

 

pum-pum lick a shot rudebwoy!

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Somehow I missed SF1's little tantrum, so sorry I'm late, but here's my answer.

 

Terrorists are not terrorists because they kill people. They are not even terrorists because they deliberately kill civilians, although that's certainly bad enough. Terrorists are terrorists because their exercise of deadly force and violence is completely unauthorized and uncontrolled by a civilian government. Essentially, they do not wage war according to the established and accepted rules of war as set down by the Geneva Convention. They do not wear distinctive uniforms, identifying them as soldiers. They do not wear dog tags. They do not wear rank insignia, and they do not carry their weapons openly, so that they can readily be identified as armed soldiers of a legitimate government.

 

We have rules of war so that wholesale slaughter of an enemy force is not necessary to achieve victory. Military officers are professionals, just as doctors and lawyers and engineers are professionals. Military officers are obligated to carry out their orders with a minimum of loss of life, of their own troops, and enemy troops, as well as civilians in the battle area. Enemy soldiers who wish to surrender are supposed to be allowed to do so. They are to lay down all weapons, and raise their hands in the universal gesture of military surrender. Surrendering soldiers are to be treated with as much dignity and respect as is possible under the circumstances extant. Iraqi EPW's were not abused and humiliated. They were rounded up, fed, given water, and held until the end of hostilities, then (to save having to feed them and care for them) they were released and told "The war is over. You are officially demobilized. Go home." Wounded Iraqis were cared for by American, British and coalition medics, doctors and nurses.

Iraqi weapons were confiscated and stockpiled to arm a new Iraqi government. As many Iraqi officers as could be identified were arrested and investigated for being members of the Baath Party, participation in war crimes and so forth.

 

The Iraqi terrorists satisfy NONE of the rules of the Geneva Convention. They qualify as terrorists, bandits and guerrillas. Their exercise of deadly force against American soldiers and their allies, and very much so against the Iraqi civilians, is COMPLETELY UNAUTHORIZED. The Iraqi Army SURRENDERED, and the survivors of the war were treated humanely. There are many who believe that demobilizing the entire Iraqi Army was a bad idea. They think the Iraqi Army should have been put on Uncle Sam's payroll, and utilized to guard government buildings, police the streets, enforce the law, etc. Perhaps they are correct. Many terrorists are former soldiers who were persuaded to carry out attacks against U.S. forces for money. If they had a paycheck from Uncle Sam, no doubt they'd be less vulnerable to the arguments of terrorist ringleaders.

 

The U.S. armed forces, and ESPECIALLY the United States Marine Corps prides itself on selfless devotion to duty above all things. The Marine Corps will stand down and allow themselves to be taken captive if the ranking officer or NCO orders it to be so. (This is what occurred at the U.S. Embassy in Tehran, where the U.S. Ambassador ordered the Marine Gy. Sgt. in charge of the Marine Security Force in the embassy to stand down, lay down their weapons, and surrender to the hundreds of Iranian student radicals who surrounded the embassy. Rescue was impossible, the Marines were overwhelmingly outnumbered, and the ambassador chose surrender over an Alamo-like last stand. The MSF, of course, wanted to mount a spirited defense, but were obliged to follow orders. They spent 444 days blindfolded, shackled, tied with ropes and forbidden to contact the outside world, before being summarially released after Lt. Col. North worked a deal with the Iranians.

 

While I was an active duty Marine, I followed orders explicitly, confident that the Marine Corps was correctly receiving it's orders through the chain of command from the President and the JCOS. Soldiers do not wage a private war. They carry out the orders they are given from the elected representatives of the American people. "My precious Marine Corps" is an armed force representing the American people, doing their bidding, waging war in their name and in their defense. They are the best at what they do in the entire world.

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So according to you , Kabar, freedom fighters are "terrorists"?

The French underground during W.W.2 were terrorists?

The Cubans that got slaughtered at the Bay of Pigs were Terrorists?

 

 

You're an idiot. Learn the difference between Guerrilla's and other people fighting in defense against an INVADING foreign occupying ARMY---> and "terrorists". :dunce:

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"Iraqi EPW's were not abused and humiliated."

 

Did he seriously just say this??? :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha:

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Guest imported_Tesseract
Originally posted by KaBar2@Dec 3 2005, 05:23 AM

Surrendering soldiers are to be treated with as much dignity and respect as is possible under the circumstances extant. Iraqi EPW's were not abused and humiliated.

 

"My precious Marine Corps" is an armed force representing the American people, doing their bidding, waging war in their name and in their defense. They are the best at what they do in the entire world.

 

iraqis_tortured_newyorker-e.jpg

YEAH BABY!!!

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