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discussion on the nature of the creator of the heavens and earth


Dawood

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hampshire college. its a pretty redicluous place. there are some very brilliant people here and there are some very stupid people here. and then some inbetween. but overall the structure is pretty awesome. it's a trip to be able to act within a community almost as freely as one would wish and still be able to be taken seriously academically. e.g. producing a large body of work before we graduate. our structure is closer to grad school than contemporary undergrad structures.

 

 

some would call it a hippy school. and i agree. they are everywhere. but there are a few that arent bad.

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Then certainly you won't be sorry when this superpowered mod bans you off this site. That's the last warning' date=' now cut this shit out.[/quote']

 

Cut what out exactly?

 

Calling a spade a spade?

 

If you would like me to take the factual points I have made and remove my bad attitude and blatant attempt to ram them down your throat and phrase them into a discussion format instead, I can do that for you my friend...

 

Statement

 

People who beleive...

 

The earth is only 5-10,000 years old

In Intelligent design

Homosexuals are abominations

There is an omnipotent god and man is shaped in his image

Man made scriptures are the undeniable word of god

In jesus as a real human being in history

In Islam, Christianity and judaism

 

...are extrememly brainwashed, ignorant, and dangerous

 

Question

 

Agree/Disagree, why?

 

Statement

 

Maybe that was a little too broad.

 

Lets try...

 

People who do not beleive...

 

Religions based on man made documents that are 2000 years old and written in a time of strong allegorical litterature are dangerous when the very foundations of these religions pit human beings against each other for the fictional ideals and beleifs that are the basis for these religions.

 

...are fucking idiots

 

Question

 

Agree/Disagree, why?

 

statement

 

The violence caused and justified by religion far out weighs any psychological spiritual posotives experienced by an individual of faith

 

Question

 

Agree/Disagree, why?

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But you have some point I agree on. I honestly think religion is a load of crap. Religion was made by humans who didnt have a scientific answer for something. Its human nature to make up something that consoles them when in fear. Ta ta da! Jesus and all his lil people where born. Now sure I believe there's stuff out there we dont know nor can explain,But I dont believe in these "man made religions"

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Statement

 

You are banned for being a giant fucking holier-than-thou dickhead who thinks he has everything figured out and for resorting to insults and other inflammatory remarks that brought discussion to a standstill. When warned and given an opportunity, you followed up with the exact same shit, under the guise of statements that have been addressed pages and pages ago. This behaviour will not be tolerated.

 

Question

 

Agree/Disagree, why?

 

 

 

 

 

 

Oh I'm sorry, you can't answer this question.

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Statement

 

You are banned for being a giant fucking holier-than-thou dickhead who thinks he has everything figured out and for resorting to insults and other inflammatory remarks that brought discussion to a standstill. When warned and given an opportunity, you followed up with the exact same shit, under the guise of statements that have been addressed pages and pages ago. This behaviour will not be tolerated.

 

Question

 

Agree/Disagree, why?

 

 

 

So let me get this straight.

 

On a website solely based around breaking the government laws of every country on earth under the guise of freedom of expression. I am not allowed to state my position on religion. The position that is supported by almost every science known to man.

 

I have never claimed to have everything personaly figured out I do however claim to have studied a large amount of previous works from people alot smarter then me and that is what I base my questions on.

 

I have not directly insulted anyone in comparrison to the entire fucking bitch fest the entire rest of this site is with regard to the subject of graffiti.

 

In terms of inflammatory remarks I have stated my thoughts on religion like everyone else has. Why was the discussion brought to a "stand still"? oh because when I say 'religion is rediculous for these scientific reasons' there is simply no arguement a person of faith can make against that? (other then to ban)

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Well your bans are fairly pointless and childish El Mamerro. If you do not agree with my opinion in this discussion/arguement you should be mature enough to state reasons why I am wrong.

 

Instead you are a little power hungry and have decided on pointless bans. You are a fairly immature person for someone given over to moderator status.

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Well your bans are fairly pointless and childish El Mamerro. If you do not agree with my opinion in this discussion/arguement you should be mature enough to state reasons why I am wrong.

 

Instead you are a little power hungry and have decided on pointless bans. You are a fairly immature person for someone given over to moderator status.

 

I banned you the last time, and this time... I think you're imagining things. You seem to have created your own little fantasy there involving the vengeful god aka Mamski, when in fact, you should have played your game a little closer to your original argument. It's not one vengeful 'being in the sky' via the internet that is shutting you down and shitting on you. There's actually just a few relatively normal (rockstar supernova status, ya know) people who are tired of reading your rants and after several attemps to ask you to play nice... well, here we are... you suck, go away.

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hampshire college. its a pretty redicluous place. there are some very brilliant people here and there are some very stupid people here. and then some inbetween. but overall the structure is pretty awesome. it's a trip to be able to act within a community almost as freely as one would wish and still be able to be taken seriously academically. e.g. producing a large body of work before we graduate. our structure is closer to grad school than contemporary undergrad structures.

 

 

some would call it a hippy school. and i agree. they are everywhere. but there are a few that arent bad.

 

 

 

Ah man, before I read this I knew you were talking about Hampshire. I went there in 2002 for that big Halloween party they have on an invite from a friend's ex-girlfriend. I thought it would have been fun, but everyone was such a pretentious dick or a hippy. Not saying that you fit into this catagory, because I don't see pretentiousness or dickhead stamped on your posts at all. I wanted to go there at a point in high school when I was interested in film school, I'm glad that I decided to wait a few years before going to college because I don't think it would have turned out well for me at Hampshire and I certainly wasn't about to get into NYU. On paper, it sounds good. But I have a feeling that while there might not be grade inflation at Hampshire, I would think that evaluations only make it easier for the stupid kids to get a pass for failing.

 

 

 

And smooth_bruce: Not so fucking smooth now, are ya buddy?

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I banned you the last time' date=' and this time... I think you're imagining things. You seem to have created your own little fantasy there involving the vengeful god aka Mamski, when in fact, you should have played your game a little closer to your original argument. It's not one vengeful 'being in the sky' via the internet that is shutting you down and shitting on you. There's actually just a few relatively normal (rockstar supernova status, ya know) people who are tired of reading your rants and after several attemps to ask you to play nice... well, here we are... you suck, go away.[/quote']

 

Where does it stipulate I am not aloud to rant?

 

What is playing nice?

 

I have given my opinions on religion if people do not agree they should present their own opinion or not read the thread.

 

I am not forcing anyone to read my posts there is even a little shrink and enlarge button they can use.

 

It seems fairly pointless to ban me from one of the most important discussion topics that...how should I put this....HAS SHAPED THE ENTIRE COURSE OF HUMAN HISTORY AND IS CURRENTLY INFLUENCING ALL CURRENT WORLD EVENTS. When the entire rest of the site is annoymous garbage posts of "yo your style sucks toy, we the realest niggas word up we all city you aint shit fuck your crew"

 

But that is clearly how you want your site. Little to no important discussion and majority moronic garbage. I am not really suprised, you are americans after all.

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It seems fairly pointless to ban me from one of the most important discussion topics that...how should I put this....HAS SHAPED THE ENTIRE COURSE OF HUMAN HISTORY AND IS CURRENTLY INFLUENCING ALL CURRENT WORLD EVENTS.

Yeah, you think it works like that but... soon, the magic trick. There's a great big web out there where people don't even know what it means to be 'all city', go tell them how religion is stupid. Be sure you let them know they are all morons and that you posess the key to their freedom. We all wish you luck with that, around here though, things aren't that way...

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Fermentor. Yeah, halloween is a bullshit event now. I don't really dig it. If I wanna do those drugs, I can do them any other day with better weather and fewer people around. Personally the way I like it.

 

As for the grades and whatnot. I realised after my first semester that the bullshit and attrition rate are inherit to the structure of the school. In allowing the students to have the freedom to make amazing things, you get some shit things too. I think it also varies per class. This last year had some amazing visual arts div iii's. A lot of the people are pretty pretentious as you said. But there are lots of brilliant and amazing people there too. I rationalize it as that it's like any school, but because of the smaller amount of people it is very apparent who is a dick and who isn't. The thing I have mostly come to appreciate about the place was when I got kicked out my first semester. I didn't do anything academically and rightfully I was released from enrollment. But, because in the appeals process you are allowed to communicated directly to the person who was making the decision with my appeal, it helped me to clearly and effectively artiulate why I should be allowed to return. Beyond that, I can't imagine going to any other school at this point. My personal politics, even if in disagreement with most kids at my school, would be much less suited anywhere else.

 

 

anywho, back to the thread... so god=mams? when did that happen?

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Maybe I could get this discussion back in gear and share my views.

 

I am not an atheist because I think it is impossible to either prove or disprove the existence of a supreme being using logical, philosophical or scientific methods.

 

I am however, agnostic, which means I do not know if there is a god, but more importantly, god is not necessary for me. I think god is an answer, and I would rather ask questions. Some people speak of a universal concept for god and they use the word absolute, which is an ending to everything, a source of all. I do not think that there has to be a source of all things for my life to be enriched on this earth. Everyone around me is enough to sustain me.

 

I do not look down on religious people however. Some people need answers, and these answers can provide meaning to their lives. What is more important is goodness. Daewood seems like a good person, and he has answers that guide him. I think I am a good person, and I have questions to guide me. There is no reason that the two cannot co-exist.

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i just wanna clear up that people can be athiest and still accept that they could be wrong.

 

I am an athiest in so much as i whole heartedly believe there is no god, but I accept that I may be wrong.

 

 

i wasnt disagreeing with anything you said russel, just clarifying. the way you put it at the end is quite nice actually. i like that quite a bit.

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here's some food for thought for the athiest crowd from a book that i've been reading.

 

To illustrate the simple conclusion that God exists a simple analogy can be drawn. Prosecuters are known to bring forward evidences such as DNA samples , footprints and fingerprints to find people guilty of certain crimes that nobody has actually witnessed. Just as footprints in the ground point to the fact that a person had once walked in that place. Examining God's signs within His creational arrangement proves conclusively that every single thing that exists within the universe came about by a Most Wise Creator.

 

One example is the perfect and stable manner in which our universe and particularly our planet Earth is administrated. If the sun were any closer to the earth, heat and radiation would destroy us and conversely, if the sun were any farther from us, all life would cease. An incredibly complex equilibrium is constantly maintained in all affairs, and amazingly, the laws that govern this equilibrium maintain the same unity thoughout the whole universe. Could this amazingly precise organization have occoured though a process of random self assembly?

Those who believe in chance concede that it is something which is not by nature ordered. Once this is understood, the following question must be asked: How could something that is by nature disordered consistantly create order? This is a scientific . impossibility. Hence it is only logical to conclude that not only has a creator created our universe, but He is also continually administrating it's awe inspiring affairs.

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I actually believe in God, but just to play devils advocate; in evolution order is preserved because it increases the chances of survival of all elements of the symbiotic relationship. It creates autocatalysis through a positive feedback loop, or the virtuous circle.

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yeah, so translate that into couch potato language and all it means is the show taxi will never go away and Jim Ignitowski is back.

 

 

 

really though, how does confusion constantly produce certainty?

 

that's like saying you can put plastic, metal and wires in a blender and eventually

get a functioning laptop out of it.

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Perhaps you missed my point. The positive feedback loop. There's an entire science devoted to the understanding of order out of chaos, called chaos theory.

Have you ever read about the origins of the universe and of life? It's not like it was without incident. We've had arjuna impacts and all life on eart has been wiped out more than once. In fact, life itself came from one of these impacts.

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im at work at the moment but i have some stuff for you guys when i get home.

 

as a teaser.

 

 

villian- i agree, but i think the claim of life from impact is still rather debated.

 

dawood- check out chaos theory, like villian said, also look at something called the poissan distrobution. it is a principle that dictates that within given sample of data there is a way to adequately measure and predict a specific pattern within that data.

 

 

blah....more to come.

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