SeezurSalad Posted July 13, 2005 Share Posted July 13, 2005 Originally posted by Seldoon@Jul 11 2005, 10:09 AM uhhhh..not shoot?? sniper? projectile bean bags? fuck that, whoever baby momma is, she straight for life. rip baby Quoted post Yes, the officer should have taken out his projectile bean bag gun that all cops are required to have on them at all times. Or maybe while rounds were flying by his fucking face he should have called the police station to have a sniper dispatched. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
!@#$% Posted July 13, 2005 Share Posted July 13, 2005 Originally posted by ILOTSMYBRAIN@Jul 12 2005, 08:45 PM you have be kidding me, notice they were holding TOY GUNS that looked like the real thing, if someone has something that resembles a lethal weapon on them, and i think they would turn around and use it on me, you better belive im going to react first. i'm no "cop lover" i'm just going off the information that was given to me here in this thread. Quoted post no, actually i'm not kidding. it's ok for those cops to have murderted kids because of their assumptions? like i noted, being a cop isn't exactly the most dangerous job out there. at some point, they will have to start being accountable for the huge errors they make in judgement that end up costing people thier lives. doctors save lives for a fucking living, and have to pay, in dollars a massive premium just in case they might make a mistake, and even then they can still get sued. police are pretty much unaccountable, and they are offing people in record numbers. just going off the info in this thread? what a great excuse for a crappy opinion, you are ignorant? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imported_dowmagik Posted July 13, 2005 Share Posted July 13, 2005 Originally posted by symbols+Jul 12 2005, 06:47 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (symbols - Jul 12 2005, 06:47 PM)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--QuoteBegin-ILOTSMYBRAIN@Jul 11 2005, 11:30 PM this thread is pretty funny, its unforunate what happened, but not for nothing cops regardless of their location, do not go around shooting at little kids, unless its absouletly necessary. again rip baby. Quoted post cops have chosen to go into their profession, i don't care what the fuck they have to deal with, it's the life they chose, Quoted post [/b] do you feel the same way about soldiers? :rolleyes: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
!@#$% Posted July 13, 2005 Share Posted July 13, 2005 i know people like to argue by destroying subtlties and distinctions but you don't make a point by lumping a bunch of shit together in a generalization a society at WAR and a society looking for PROTECTION and SERVICE are two completely different things. go ahead and roll your eyes right out of your head but cops are not the same as soldiers and when a cop decides his profession, it's not out of desperation for college loot, or a way into a career because he couldn't get an education. again, at some point, police, [hmm, kinda like soldiers dealing with abu ghraib fallout], will have to become accountable for the shit that happens because of thier mistakes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stereotype V.001 Posted July 13, 2005 Share Posted July 13, 2005 Originally posted by SeezurSalad@Jul 13 2005, 06:33 AM Yes, the officer should have taken out his projectile bean bag gun that all cops are required to have on them at all times. Or maybe while rounds were flying by his fucking face he should have called the police station to have a sniper dispatched. Quoted post Well, they had time to wait around for swat. So that means it must of all happened in 30 seconds, all the tazers were malfunctioning, the snipers were all out golfing, and everyones common sense was out for lunch. dowmagik- I agree with you man. I thought joining the ARMY would teach people how to knit sweaters and play water polo. Who would guess we occasionally have to fight wars? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villain Posted July 13, 2005 Share Posted July 13, 2005 Originally posted by Stereotype V.001@Jul 13 2005, 12:33 PM I thought joining the ARMY would teach people how to knit sweaters and play water polo. Who would guess we occasionally have to fight wars? Quoted post Hey fuck you trust fund kids. The military is over half minorities, nearly all poor and most from the poorest states in the country. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stereotype V.001 Posted July 13, 2005 Share Posted July 13, 2005 I'm not a trust fund kid. College, a car, housing, food, or basically anything aren't things that my mommy and daddy can pay for. I'm just saying when you join the military, you train to kill people. Anyone who joins up just for the college money and DON'T take the fact they could end up fighting and/or dead by signing up into consideration are fooling themselves. When the top brass decides they want to fight a war you don't agree with you do not have the luxury of saying "Nope, no thanks, but I think I'll stay here and play XBOX." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villain Posted July 13, 2005 Share Posted July 13, 2005 Yeah well obviously we realize we are in the military. Not alot of people were really expecting this... you know, post-fall of the soviet union.... democracy spreads across the globe.... a thousand years of peace yadayadayada. I pretty much saw a war coming with Bush in office. But it ain't like I had much of a choice... join the military or go to jail. I came in off the streets and was real tired of being in and out of shelters and jails going nowhere. Now I'm government property. Modern slavery. Yay. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAGS156 Posted July 13, 2005 Share Posted July 13, 2005 LOS ANGELES, California (AP) -- A war of words has followed a police shootout that left a 19-month-old girl and her gun-wielding father dead, with relatives calling officers' actions "cruel" and the police chief hinting at the gunman's family troubles. Describing Jose Pena as a "cold-blooded killer," Police Chief William Bratton said Tuesday the coroner's report will likely show that police killed the young girl, but that all blame "falls on the shoulders of Mr. Pena." Meanwhile, Pena's brother called a news conference to describe the family's pain and lament that police weren't more patient during the standoff. "It's been cruel what's happened to my brother," German Pena said. "They didn't have any patience, none at all, knowing that my niece was with him, that he was a father. They should have acted with more patience." Bratton said Pena was intoxicated and armed with a 9 mm handgun when he threatened to kill his wife, teenage stepdaughter and toddler in the hours before the shootout. "This father was not a father of the year as the family is now attempting to portray him," Bratton said. Pena's wife called 911 about 2 p.m. to report that Pena had threatened her life. Officers interviewed the woman at a home near Watts, but Pena was nowhere to be found. Nearly two hours later, the man's 17-year-old stepdaughter called police from Pena's car business to report that she was being threatened. When officers arrived, Pena opened fire, police said. During the ensuing standoff, Pena "indicated clearly he was not going to go to jail" and shot again at officers and the teen as she escaped, Bratton said. The girl, whose name was not released, told police Pena had also threatened to kill his 19-month-old daughter. About 6:30 p.m., police stormed the location. Pena shot one officer in the shoulder before Pena was killed. The toddler was also found dead. Bratton said he didn't know if she was in Pena's arms when she died, as police initially reported. Autopsies were completed on the bodies Tuesday. Officials requested that the results not be released. http://www.cnn.com/2005/US/07/13/la.shootout.ap/index.html to take a child into this situation is discraceful to put police and an entire neighborhood in jepordy is worse there is really no positive soulition to what happend , you can bitch and moan but what happend happend the police reacted to a situation as they saw fit for the greater good of everone not just the baby, whom for no other reason than the father was there! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAGS156 Posted July 13, 2005 Share Posted July 13, 2005 Originally posted by symbols+Jul 12 2005, 02:47 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (symbols - Jul 12 2005, 02:47 PM)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--QuoteBegin-ILOTSMYBRAIN@Jul 11 2005, 11:30 PM this thread is pretty funny, its unforunate what happened, but not for nothing cops regardless of their location, do not go around shooting at little kids, unless its absouletly necessary. again rip baby. Quoted post um, no. cops killed a young black boy holding a toy gun a few years ago...one of more than a few people killed over mistakes. In August 1998, a 16-year-old New York boy bearing a submachine gun water pistol was shot six times in the legs by police. Another boy, this one 13, was shot and killed in 1994 by a police officer who mistook his toy gun for the real thing. no matter what, cops have chosen to go into their profession, i don't care what the fuck they have to deal with, it's the life they chose, AND NOT EVEN CLOSE TO THE MOST DANGEROUS OCCUPATION no cop ever put anything on the line for me they have copped out though called me a liar and fucking made me a victim so fuck the police TEN MOST DANGEROUS JOBS (fatalities per 100K) Timber cutters 117.8 Fishers 71.1 Pilots and navigators 69.8 Structural metal workers 58.2 Drivers-sales workers 37.9 Roofers 37 Electrical power installers 32.5 Farm occupations 28 Construction laborers 27.7 Truck drivers 25 suck it cop lovers. Quoted post [/b] Next time someone points a gun at you take the time to discuss if its real or not or get shot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest KING BLING Posted July 13, 2005 Share Posted July 13, 2005 Originally posted by MAGS156@Jul 13 2005, 12:16 PM Next time someone points a gun at you take the time to discuss if its real or not or get shot Quoted post The only time a gun was ever pointed directly at me was a cop... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ILOTSMYBRAIN Posted July 14, 2005 Share Posted July 14, 2005 Originally posted by symbols+Jul 13 2005, 07:23 AM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (symbols - Jul 13 2005, 07:23 AM)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--QuoteBegin-ILOTSMYBRAIN@Jul 12 2005, 08:45 PM you have be kidding me, notice they were holding TOY GUNS that looked like the real thing, if someone has something that resembles a lethal weapon on them, and i think they would turn around and use it on me, you better belive im going to react first. i'm no "cop lover" i'm just going off the information that was given to me here in this thread. Quoted post no, actually i'm not kidding. it's ok for those cops to have murderted kids because of their assumptions? like i noted, being a cop isn't exactly the most dangerous job out there. at some point, they will have to start being accountable for the huge errors they make in judgement that end up costing people thier lives. doctors save lives for a fucking living, and have to pay, in dollars a massive premium just in case they might make a mistake, and even then they can still get sued. police are pretty much unaccountable, and they are offing people in record numbers. just going off the info in this thread? what a great excuse for a crappy opinion, you are ignorant? Quoted post [/b] ignorant? for what? thinking logically about protecting oneself? if i had a fake knife on me, and we got into an arguement and i pulled the knife out, would you wait for me to stab you to see if it's real, or would you take action to make sure that doesn't happen? stop twisting the facts. what do doctors and cops have to do with each other? the fact that americans do whatever they can to get money, has nothing to do with this situation here. for gods sake a women sued mcdonalds because hot coffee spilled on her lap, and she claimed she didn't know that the coffee was going to be that hot. believe me the mother of the baby is going to milk the lapd for all she can. again, none of us were there, so none of us can judge on what exactly happened, thats what the crappy "excuse" implied. i don't care enough to look for more example, but i think these work well enough, if you are standing at a distance from someone, and they pull out something like this, and you just so happen to work, where you can be thrown into a dangerous situation without warning, hey, ya, you might get the wrong impression. i'm also not saying some of these guy's shouldn't get punished after a investigation occurs and some more facts come to the surface, but regarding all of the information we have been given so far, its just a really terrible tradegy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SF1 Posted July 14, 2005 Share Posted July 14, 2005 Yeah, they shoot the "nigglet" playing with a water gun and play dumb "oh, I thought it was real "ha,ha,ha, (high fives)". And you MORONS are stupid enough to beleive that a trained cop that literally LIVES AROUND GUNS can't tell the difference between a real gun and a plastic toy that more than likely had a orenge tip like most plastic water guns do. And if it didn't it still woulda had the nozle of a WATER GUN that they woulda seen if the kid really POINTED IT AT THEM! Some of you peoples stupididty is amazing. :rolleyes: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ILOTSMYBRAIN Posted July 14, 2005 Share Posted July 14, 2005 yea because its so difficult to change the color of a plastic tip. haha. i'm just judging this shit from my perspective, as if i were the cop. i'm not racist so i do not look at things that way. again, after a investigation as to what happened and more facts are brought to the table, i could change my views completly. i wish i could say the same about the majority of you. i also think its funny how you guys also put a spin on racism as it's always white to black, and never reverse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SF1 Posted July 14, 2005 Share Posted July 14, 2005 Originally posted by ILOTSMYBRAIN@Jul 14 2005, 12:18 AM again, none of us were there, so none of us can judge on what exactly happened, thats what the crappy "excuse" implied. i don't care enough to look for more example, but i think these work well enough, if you are standing at a distance from someone, and they pull out something like this, and you just so happen to work, where you can be thrown into a dangerous situation without warning, hey, ya, you might get the wrong impression. Quoted post There you go contradicicting your own statement. If you were'nt there then why are you assuming that every kid with a toy gun that get's shot has a toy gun that looks anything like the real thing? Were you there? Did you read somewhere that the toy gun was made to look so much like the real thing as to fool a trained profesional that is literaly surounded by guns day in and day out and probably has subscriptions to gun magazines for crying out loud can tell the difference between a toy and a real gun!?!? What are you gonna say if you're kid gets murked by some trigger happy pig for playing with a plastic watergun in your front yard and the pig has the audacity to say "the perp had a gun and I thought he was gonna shoot me." Then you look down at the ground next to your dead sons pool of blood and brain matter to see a plastic peice of shit toy with an orange nib that's also half the size of the real thing and this pig with a smile on his face (and all his buddies patting him on the back) has the BALLS to say "hey, I was scared for my life". Are you gonna just pat him on the back and say "good job officer hero!!!"? :huh2: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SF1 Posted July 14, 2005 Share Posted July 14, 2005 Originally posted by ILOTSMYBRAIN@Jul 14 2005, 12:33 AM yea because its so difficult to change the color of a plastic tip. haha. i'm just judging this shit from my perspective, as if i were the cop. i'm not racist so i do not look at things that way. again, after a investigation as to what happened and more facts are brought to the table, i could change my views completly. i wish i could say the same about the majority of you. i also think its funny how you guys also put a spin on racism as it's always white to black, and never reverse. Quoted post True that. I never said anything about race other than the cops shooting a "nigglet". Where I live alot of the cops are black and alot of the "niggas" is white, asian, hispanic, whatever. What I'm trying to get at is this whole guise of racism is just that... a guise. The real problem is CLASSISM. The rich paying sodiers to hold down the poor with the poors own tax dollars, and pitting the poor against eachother (by promoting racism) to keep them down. When they shoot a "nigglet" for holding a water gun it could very well be your WHITE son shot by a BLACK cop. But the polotitians still wan't you to think that it's white vs black to keep you distracted from the fact that it's really money vs non-money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ILOTSMYBRAIN Posted July 14, 2005 Share Posted July 14, 2005 this has gone completly off topic. when i posted those pictures i wasn't using them as the example of the guns those specific children were gunned down holding, i was just giving an example on how toy guns, can look real. also, you can paint a orange plastic tip, black, fairly easy, not to mention the rest of the gun to look even more convincing of the fact that it could be real. think about it, there are many instances where a cop may approach someone from the distance, and if they were to turn around, or just pull out a gun looking anything similar to one of those (or any other type of weapon), he may just react that way. thats why my children will not be allowed to play with such toys. i'm not saying this isn't very unforunate, and i hope it doesn't have to happen to anyone else, what i am saying is, that although the baby was killed, i highly doubt it was done intentionally. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
!@#$% Posted July 14, 2005 Share Posted July 14, 2005 i don't think it was intentional either but some administrative leave with pay for a few months is not the answer to proper discipline. shit, they likely won't even be disciplined at all. it's fucked up, and it's 'proper' procedure. on the other hand, i don't really give a fuck about gun rights, and lots of people do (probably all the same people who think those cops were within their rights doing what they did) we live in a society saturated with violence this dude was mentally ill and his daughter paid the price. there is plenty of blame to go around Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAGS156 Posted July 14, 2005 Share Posted July 14, 2005 I blame white people! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villain Posted July 15, 2005 Share Posted July 15, 2005 My experience in the military has taught me a few things which I think might apply to government in general. It helps to know people on the inside. Unlike the private sector, where you could be fired for not performing effeciently or effectively, we get paid regardless. Therefore, motivation can be very low, depending on a particular persons, units, departments disposition. Our efficiency is a perceived efficiency, largely dependent upon PR (hence why politicians are such good bullshitters I suppose) since there is no real way for us to be held accountable, except by our superiors, and the superiors are likely to be playing the same game. It is popularly called shamming in the military. lol That's not to say that we are all like this, obviously there are people who are really dedicated to their jobs, but your own personality and work habits seem to go further in this environment, rather than a company where they have very clear expectations and production goals and make sure that their money is going to good use. We are paid by taxes. Some people even joke that we pay ourselves because we get taxed. Tax money doesn't just stop flowing in because of our performance. They say in the military, that it's most important to be friends with people who work finance, supply, and food... That way you can garauntee yourself things will get done, and maybe even some favors. I don't know a whole lot about police officers, but I'm pretty sure they have to meet a quota. Even still, that might mean they can just meet their quota and then slack off the rest of the time, or just take easy marks to meet quota and leave the real criminals at large... I don't really know. What I do know is that if you have a G.E.D. instead of a diploma, you can only join the Army or Marines. If you can barely pass the ASVAB you are going to be infantry, because that is the lowest qualifications you need for an MOS. If you go infantry, when you get out, what exactly are you qualified for? Security. You could either go back to mcdonalds and work for $5.15 an hour, or you could work as a security/police officer and make $10/15/20 dollars an hour. What would you do? I know what I would do. Fortunately I have a diploma, and I'm kinda smert so I have a few more options available to me. But you see how easily someone could land themselves in a career in security. After 3,4, or 5 years or whatever in the military, you kind of have a lot of momentum pushing you in the direction that you specialized in while in the military. I've been abused by police, and I'm friends with police, all I'm saying is that they are people like anyone else and you see what the climate is like hopefully from my description in government, so that may help you. When an officer responds, they are kind of going out of their way to do so.... even though they are being paid to do that. They could sham and do the easy thing. Certainly discipline could be a problem. Like I said, much of it has to do with personal disposition. I've smoked with a cop in the past, I knew a guy who shot meth with a cop. There are really all kinds. But having a friend on the inside can go a long way. Sometimes when I find myself in a bit of trouble, an officer will see my military ID and cut me a break. I had two judges cut me breaks. So it's not like it's a nameless faceless enemy of mind controlled robots in gasmasks with the stark fist of justice, though sometimes it can feel like that. Think about the people behind the badge... don't just blame the badge itself. That's just another kind of stereotype. It's not just meathead jockboy bullys who become cops. lol Though I do think there should be more psychological screening of cops.... It's not like they are coming off an assembly line. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ILOTSMYBRAIN Posted July 15, 2005 Share Posted July 15, 2005 great post villian. pretty much sumed up what i was trying to say perfectly, with some added goodies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SF1 Posted July 16, 2005 Share Posted July 16, 2005 So in other words it's not just meat head jocks that become cops, but ex-soldiers trained and looking for action? I'll accept that... it makes it more clear why they act the way they do. :rolleyes: And I agree with the "psycological test" that they should be given before joining the force. I been saying for years that they should be given an attitude test to weed out the dickheads that seems to be 99.9% of the police force. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaBar2 Posted July 17, 2005 Share Posted July 17, 2005 SF1--- Why don't you become a police officer? Then we would know for sure at least one cop that wasn't a dickhead. After all, if it's not the criminals that are a problem, you ought to be able to do a lot of good, being all un-biased, and politically correct and whatnot. You'd be able to enforce the law fairly and justly. And I'm sure, since you have a really good understanding that all the crime and misbehavior is caused by racism, poverty and inequity and not the criminals just choosing to victimize people weaker than themselves, that you could make the world a better place, and probably "make a difference." You know what they say, "All it takes for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing." So get on down there to the Police recruiter, guy. There are a lot of young men of color who are going to be mistreated by vicious, racist, fascistic white cops if you don't do your part. We're counting on you, SF 1. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SF1 Posted July 18, 2005 Share Posted July 18, 2005 Originally posted by KaBar2+Jul 17 2005, 07:29 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (KaBar2 - Jul 17 2005, 07:29 PM)</div><div class='quotemain'>SF1--- Why don't you become a police officer? Then we would know for sure at least one cop that wasn't a dickhead. After all, if it's not the criminals that are a problem, you ought to be able to do a lot of good, being all un-biased, and politically correct and whatnot. You'd be able to enforce the law fairly and justly. And I'm sure, since you have a really good understanding that all the crime and misbehavior is caused by racism, poverty and inequity and not the criminals just choosing to victimize people weaker than themselves, that you could make the world a better place, and probably "make a difference." You know what they say, "All it takes for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing." So get on down there to the Police recruiter, guy. There are a lot of young men of color who are going to be mistreated by vicious, racist, fascistic white cops if you don't do your part. We're counting on you, SF 1. Quoted post [/b] Do you even read my posts? :huh2: Originally posted by SF1@Jul 13 2005, 01:02 AM Also every time a real motherfucker becomes a cop and either exposes abuses or complains to the brass or IA about the fucked up shit they see they quickly get fired and/or their life fucked up by the other cops in the union. Quoted post <!--QuoteBegin-SF1@Jul 14 2005, 03:17 AM True that. I never said anything about race other than the cops shooting a "nigglet". Where I live alot of the cops are black and alot of the "niggas" is white, asian, hispanic, whatever. What I'm trying to get at is this whole guise of racism is just that... a guise. The real problem is CLASSISM. The rich paying soldiers to hold down the poor with the poors own tax dollars, and pitting the poor against eachother (by promoting racism) to keep them down. When they shoot a "nigglet" for holding a water gun it could very well be your WHITE son shot by a BLACK cop. But the polotitians and the media still wan't you to think that it's white vs black to keep you distracted from the fact that it's really money vs non-money. Quoted post :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
!@#$% Posted July 18, 2005 Share Posted July 18, 2005 SF1: kabar seems to have selective reading and memory abilities. he reads only what he wants to argue with, sometimes contradicts himself and never adresses the facts you use to back up your opinion usually topping it off by belittling your age or something else that he feels shows your inexperience with life and it's cruel lessons [compared with his own omniscience, of course] it's a tactic he uses over and over ad nauseum around these parts, which is why a lot of us don't even bother with his bullshit anymore Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SF1 Posted July 18, 2005 Share Posted July 18, 2005 I'm glad I'm not the only one that's noticed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaBar2 Posted July 19, 2005 Share Posted July 19, 2005 Kind of gives me a warm, fuzzy feeling, just knowing that you guys care so much. ("sniff") Maybe someday, if we all just light one little candle in the darkness. . . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
!@#$% Posted July 19, 2005 Share Posted July 19, 2005 care about your condescension? no kabar, you're showing your arrogance.. i was showing some 'care' to poor SF1, who is wasting his time arguing with a brick wall like yourself now go do your gun-rant thing mr.predictable Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smart Posted July 20, 2005 Share Posted July 20, 2005 Man, I don't see why this is even a topic anymore... the kid was obviously the spawn of demon seed and needed, no, DEMANDED to be eradicated! Baby chupacabras grow up to be big chupacabras! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nutonce Posted July 20, 2005 Share Posted July 20, 2005 SAD STORY. BUT YOU DONT SHOOT AT COPS. PERIOD. IF YOU DO, YOU SEE THE RESULTS. THEY WILL KILL YOUR MOMS. AND YOUR BABY GIRL. AND BEST BELIEVE THEY AINT TAKING IT TOO HARD. SHE AINT KNOW WHAT WAS GOING ON. QUICK AND PAINLESS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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