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the war...your opinions..


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<span style='color:#460A05'>S[/color]o familiar and overwhelmingly warm

This one, this form I hold now.

Embracing you, this reality here,

This one, this form I hold now,

so Wide eyed and hopeful.

Wide eyed and hopefully wild.

We barely remember

what came before this precious moment,

Choosing to be here right now.

Hold on, stay inside...

This body holding me,

reminding me that I am not alone in

This body makes me feel eternal.

All this pain is an illusion.</span>

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Guest ModelCitizen

I support the troops!

 

I don't actually do anything ... I just sit here and claim support ... but I support them nonetheless. Go troops.

 

Actually, no, I don't support them. The troops are wack. Fuck the troops.

 

What the fuck's the difference?

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Guest Pseudoprep©

------------------------------------------------------------------------

Originally posted by BROWNer

dysfunctional nationalism at its worst.

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haha. nice try you makeshift commie.

 

 

http://www.paulreveresociety.com

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Guest ctrl+alt+del

michael savage is a racist and extremely shallow and ignorant.

 

its amazing to me how stupid the majority of america is.

 

 

 

thoreau was right.

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Guest Dr. Drew

i'm bored at work, and need some brain stimulation...

 

All I can say is that I was fifty times as bitterly against the Vietnam War as anybody on this board, and just as smart-ass about it as any of you. I thought I knew better than any of the adults and I thought Johnson, then Nixon were both fascists, blah, blah, blah. I WAS WRONG.

what were you wrong about? the US entered vietnam under the false pretense of stopping communism. well, the US lost, and communism DID NOT spread like wildfire as the US claimed would happen.

 

I hated "plastic people" (oh, the surety of one's convictions when young), and the suburbs. Smoking pot was de rigeur, the only music worth listening too was what is now "classic rock" (it was brand new and "revolutionary" back then, of course) and I repeatedly hitch-hiked and rode trains all across the U.S. to attend anti-war rallies, "peace marches" and "Movement gatherings." We danced all around revolution against the Government. We were dead wrong.

yes, you do understand the attitude of many young people. but again, what were you wrong about in terms of the US attacking another nation for not following our demands?

 

 

When I look back upon that time in my life, I ask myself "How could I have been so self-deluded?"

 

Your experience may been based on irrational thought or emotions, but it doesn't take away from the issue of the US ethnocentrically imposing our values and rules on other nations

 

The United States is far from perfect. Our leaders are far from perfect. But it is the absolutely best thing going. In Iraq, if the people who posted such anti-government statements on 12 oz. did that in Baghdad or Basra, they would wind up with electrodes on their nuts and their hand in a vise.

 

comparing two piles of horse manure may establish which one is superior, but some of us would rather grow flowers.

 

 

You guys are so cynical---you just can't see it. It's hard for me to read people's posts who justify the murder and maltreatment of U.S. soldiers. War is hell, for sure. They knew what they were doing when they signed up, one can only suppose. They were "adults"--18, 19, 20 years old. Getting killed in legitimate combat is one thing, but being shot out of hand after capture is another thing altogether. I'm not at all surprised that the Iraqis did it, but I'm kind of surprised that people born and raised in the U.S., who have benefitted all their lives from living here, and who are being defended by those very same soldiers, could write things so cynical, calloused and uncaring.

 

No disrespect to those who have been lost, but some of us feel that these soldiers are not "defending" us, but rather serving the political agenda of those in power. Not all of us are convinced that this war is about removing weapons from saddam.

 

We have thousands of Iraqi EPW's. They are being treated well, they are being given food and water and medical care just like our own soldiers receive. They are being treated with dignity and honor. After the war is over, some of them may wind up wearing the uniform of the New Iraqi Army.

 

Ever hear about Iraqis in the US being rounded-up in the same fashion as the Japanese in WW2? I really doubt there will be a new Iraqi Army, more like a new dictator to succeed saddam.

 

I hope the Iraqis get the democratic, constitutional republic that they desire. With luck, they will get it.

 

Again, americans imposing our values and beliefs on others. It didn't happen in Kuwait, although we were told it was one of the US's reasons for desert storm

 

 

I yelled about "Revolution" and civil war plenty when I was a kid. Shit, I may live to see it yet. Only this time, I think I may be on the other side of the battlefield.

 

sounds like a decision based on blocking out a time when your reasoning was irrational. and it is true that many anti-war activists also believe in their causes under irrational thinking, but it doesn't make all anti-war activism stupid. too bad you picked up rational thinking from "the other side of the battlefield"

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Guest duh-rye-won
Originally posted by killtheradio

it doesnt effect our little bubble so we dont care 666 bush is devil wait there is no devil darnit...

 

my friend died in the towers.

i have 2 friends in the military fighting in iraq.

 

consider my bubble effected.

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Completely, intimately, and thoroughly, none of us really know dick about any of this war shit beyond the limited range of knowledge we've been exposed to. Every scholar, military expert, liberal activist, right-wing gun-pusher, peacenik, politician, social critic, news anchor, author, ignorant redneck, false prophet, used-car salesman or whoever else the fuck we're becoming influenced by at any given point in time will inevitably kick us down some bullshit that'll fuck with our heads and make us believe in the gospel of holy conviction they'd have us worship, whether it's right or not. The only thing that's really real is the truth, and in this screwball fucking time we're given a broken plastic fork to dig up a "truth" buried 12,000 feet beneath the wreckage of colliding interests. Even our gut feelings are being fucked with.

 

Personally, I think this Iraq-invasion shit can eat a dick for one reason: the genuine possibility of being globally ass-fucked by a nuclear war. To me that's serious shit, and that's the only thing I can see through the thick haze of political and ethical crack-smoke the GW team is blowing in everyone's faces right now, including all the crazy motherfuckers sitting on enough uranium and plutonium to provoke the U.S. into a full-scale thermonuclear fuck-fest of annihilation and chaos. We weren't even at war when those maniac plane-jackers rearranged this entire fucking country. Imagine how fucked up shit could get in the next few years, now that the arab world is finally UNITING against us, and that monkey motherfucker is sitting in the White House floating his shaky little pinky finger over the "red button."

 

My opinion on the war, for whatever it's worth: against it.

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Risk of Nuclear War has always been there

 

Since about 1947 or '48, when the Soviets finally admitted they had the Bomb, and a way to get one to us. I'm not sure of the exact year. Back in the 1950's the sociologists used to say that "living in the Shadow of the Bomb" was he reason that 1950's teenagers were so fucked up. Personally, I never bought that Rebel Without A Cause stuff.

 

What changed the teenaged world wasn't the nuclear bomb, it was the availability of the automobile, in my opinion.

 

One of the things that has profoundly changed the teenaged world since the 1970's is the end of the Draft. The Draft has been gone now almost as long as it's last permutation existed. We hated the Draft, but it had some very positive effects especially in the late '50s and the '60s. For one thing, it exposed millions of young American men, of various races and backgrounds, to other young American men of various races and backgrounds. It was, despite all my whining about it, a very democratizing influence, once the "color barrier" was broken in the 1940's, and segregated military units were ended in the 1950's. The Marine Corps, always considered the most racist of the armed forces, was the first service to be integrated, because they were also the most disciplined. Essentially, they do whatever they are told to do, and in the early Fifties, they were ordered to integrate. And they did so. Once the Marines successfully integrated, the Army, Navy and Air Force quickly followed. Today, the armed forces are one of the most integrated, least racist institutions in the entire country. About thirty percent of the Marine Corps is black, and well over 50% of the senior NCO corps. It's not because of any bullshit scheme to sacrifice young black men for global hegemony---it's because the military is a good, steady career with excellent benefits and excellent retirement after 20 years. I've talked to a lot of middle-aged black guys on their second career who enlisted at age 17, retired at AGE THIRTY-SEVEN, and are now working on a second career (maybe the U.S. Post Office) from which they will retire at age FIFTY-SEVEN. That means TWO retirement checks.

Sounds like forty years of shit to you guys, but I'm 53. If I had done this^^^, I'd be completely retired in four years or less. I did not do this. I did as I pleased, instead. Eleven more years, minimum, before I can kick it. If I live so long. Even if I had stayed in when I enlisted late, at age 26, I'd STILL already be retired from one job (at age 46) with half pay coming in every month.

 

But, oh gosh, my main concern is whether or not it will negatively impact the Third World. I'd like to do my part by retiring in Belize, preferably close to a bar.

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