bufme1 Posted February 13, 2003 Share Posted February 13, 2003 http://images.indymedia.org/imc/jakarta/01_lontoo_sw-thumb.jpg'> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaBar Posted February 13, 2003 Share Posted February 13, 2003 Pittsburgh Unless you are a super-dedicated Communist, which I doubt, I bet that within ten years your views change dramatically. I bet that before you are 26 years old (the cut-off date for enlistment in the armed forces) that you experience a change of heart, and enlist in the military. Maybe not the Marines, like I did (hey, I was extraordinarally unhappy with the choices I had made---a tour in the Air Force or the Navy would have probably been good enough) but I bet before you are too old, you are wearing the uniform of your country. And I did not join for any kind of benefits. I enlisted in the Marines and pretty much demanded "infantry." I joined to learn to fight, and so that I could look in the mirror and say "You did your duty." I'm sure you think that's total bullshit, and since we live in a free country, you are free to think and say, and write, whatever you please. Can't do that in Iraq, though. In 1969, when I was at my most most rabid anarchist revolutionary fever pitch (man, I hated Nixon with a burning passion, beyond anything I've seen on this board so far) I was jungled up with a bunch of hippies and one of them was an older French guy, in his late twenties or early thirties. After listening to me rant and rave about Nixon, the State, "this genocidal war" yadda yadda yadda for about twenty minutes, he asked me what I would do if the U.S. was ever attacked. I drew myself up and sort of self-righteously announced "I'm a pacifist!" He just smiled, put another stick on the fire and said, "You'll fight. When it comes to your home and your family---you'll fight." That's all he said about it. Words of insight from the French. He was carrying a French Army ruck, I've always wondered if he was a French veteran of Vietnam---they were fascinated with the American involvement in Vietnam, and the French national conciousness was a sort of smug "See, even the Americans got their ass kicked." Getting overrun at Dien Bien Phu was a terrible loss to French national pride. Do what you gotta do, but you know what? "You'll fight." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yoshy Posted February 13, 2003 Share Posted February 13, 2003 hey kabar, do you think you needed to go through you radical hippie phase? are you glad that you did, or would you have rather come into the mindset you have now, at an earlier age. i guess i am asking if you think there are actual answers, or if there is just a process.... and on another note, i kinda get the feeling that you enjoy "glamorizing" war, and that bothers me...maybe i am just misreading things tho.... yoshy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dojafx Posted February 13, 2003 Share Posted February 13, 2003 heh reppin the super dedicated comunistas! viva! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xwibxonex Posted February 13, 2003 Share Posted February 13, 2003 MY VIEW ON ALL THIS some of you guys ARE really impressionable, BOTH WAYS, i'm like alot of you on here, i dont watch alot of news, i hear what i hear thru say school or work, my boss being a Army National Gaurdsman, on alert about to be sent out, ANYWAY, you peopel scare me, alot of you, kabar, he is intellegent, but he is an extremist, those ARE worst case scenarios, alot of his phrases and fragments true, main point a little shady a lot of you are reaaaaly to one side here, i dont beleive the vew presented on any of the us news channels, but how smart is it to base your knowledge off of a message board of a bunch of kids caught up in a stream of anti-americanism, i hate bush, hes an idiot yes I dont know all the facts on everything, and neither do all of you, a lot of you will watch the news, or check news articles posted on sites and than blast them to pieces and try and prove them wrong, now look, isn't that a little "weird"? I like the post where the kid linked to a site that said something about bush being in direct connection to terrorists in iraq or something about his broker having ties to bin laden, while im sure hes got some dirty things going on here and there, like alot of our presidents had, you fools take shit too far I mean shit, ANYONE can right this shit with NO facts at all, besides, dont you think the press would be all on his shit about it, go, go ahead and say NOOOO theyre hiding things from us, but thats bullshit, PLUS, hed have no chance in the next elections with that garbage, and we all know it, stop complaining and acting as if you all know what youre talking about, being a rebel is fun yes, but i got bored of it, and im annoyed of hearing it, chose your side, pick reliable facts, and for gods sakes, stop reading every damn article on google that has to do with the goverment written by 20 something college kids with no full view of whats going on in the world. peace. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dojafx Posted February 13, 2003 Share Posted February 13, 2003 heh, george bush is not an idiot he knows exactly what he is doing capitalism will always be on the march towards fascism thats how it works, i'm sure you've heard of that poem by the holocaust survivor "first they came for the communists, and i didnt speak up because i wasnt a communist, etc..." thats exactly how its working except they're comming for the immigrants first this time watch your back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dojafx Posted February 13, 2003 Share Posted February 13, 2003 oh, and as much as i disagree with KaBar politically, i think arming yourselves would be a really good idea as zapata said "its better to die on your feet than to live on your knees" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaBar Posted February 13, 2003 Share Posted February 13, 2003 Fair Question Honestly, I think that people (especially men) go through stages of life where they tend to be rebellious and defiant, and then, as they mature, they lose that. Some of us (hey, I'm 52 and I'm still attracted to a board full of teenagers---what does that say about me?) seem to drag it out much longer than others. As for glamorizing war, well, it has to do with imagination, I think. People who disagree with me take the position that the United States is safe, secure and no preparations or individual ability to defend the country is necessary, or even desireable. I was reading posts that were very concerned about the possibility that commercial airliners might be hi-jacked and used as kamikazi planes against soft civilian domestic American targets as far back as 1994. The survivalist and militia guys have always been worried about it, and we discussed it at great length, numerous times, over the years. Nobody in the "straight world" (i.e. non-survivalist, or maybe "anti-survivalist" world) took it seriously at all. We had been worrying and calling for food stockpiling and arming every household for years, but the liberal left, and also the bland middle majority just rolled their eyes. I don't understand how the liberals can be so blind. Can they not see that what stops fascists and night riders and terrorists in their tracks is an armed population? What Ku Klux Klansman in his right mind would even consider night-riding and cross lighting in a black neighborhood today? Shit, they'd be shot so full of holes they'd look like a collander. One thing I never could understand back when I was a young-twenties anarchist is how the Left could be so stupid as to "give away" being armed and combat-ready to the right wing. hel-LO! If anybody needs to be trained and armed, it's the WORKING CLASS. All my so-called revolutionary anarchist buddies had a very limited and unimaginative viewpoint of the world. Basically, they are pussies, and that's the truth. The only fighters I ever met on the left were the anarchist-communists in San Francisco, and even they admitted that they beat up the Trots for the hell of it. As I became aware that I was definately no pacifist, I started saying "What else that I believe is a bunch of nonsense?" Pretty soon I found myself saying "I really do love my country. That black flag doesn't mean shit to me, so why am I going around telling myself that I'm an anarchist?" I wasn't super patriotic when I enlisted, but as I served in the Corps, I sure got that way. So few of us in America have served in the armed forces these days, it's almost a subculture now. I had already done my two year's alternative service as a C.O. When I enlisted, my military obligation was satisfied, I didn't have to do it. Don't you think the Drill Instructors looked at me with a jaundiced eye? They had to know I was a former anarchist. They leaned on me plenty. I wound up as both Platoon Honorman and Series Honorman. I was the best fucking Marine they had seen in months. War isn't glamorous, it's nasty. Basically, you're talking about legalized homicide, but even in war there are definate rules. Anybody that breaks them, and gets caught, will suffer the consequences. Once you know how to wage war, though, you have a distinctively different understanding of the world. There are 1.8 million members of the armed forces. There are 4 million members of the NRA. There are 31 million licensed deer hunters. There are 70 million American firearms owners. NO DICTATORS HERE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RumPuncher Posted February 13, 2003 Share Posted February 13, 2003 RE: Taliban and the treatment of the population. I'd just like to add a comment for the sake of adding a little info on this subject. I just finished work on a documentary about a woman's return to Kandaher. She is an Afghan, and a Muslim. I've met and talked with this woman about her story and feel that because she was there, her opinions are extrememly valid. When she was a child, there were pictures of Michael Jackson on the billboards all over the major cities. They drank coca-cola and wore levis. Then the Russian supported a coup in 1978, and started kidnapping and tourturing all their opponents. So the Afghan 'Freedom Fighters' get incredible support from the CIA and approved aid from the american congress. This is all cold-war stragety, and when Mother Russia falls, they retreat from Afghanistan. The 'Freedom Fighters' have won! So now what? The Mujahedeen are in control of the counrty, but they are essentially tribal gangs with many guns and stinger missles. There's no real leadership and the US has stoped officialy supporting them. What happens? Well they kill anyone they think is against them in addition to rape, kidnapping, torture, murder and genocide. Many people are aginst these new rulers, and being led by Mullah Omar, they form the Taliban in Pakistan. When the Taliban was originally formed it was considered the less-fundamentalist group. The people needed someone to stop the violence and killing so they looked to Omar and the taliban for help. They take Kabul by force and change the country. At this time the CIA is still seceretly supporting the Taliban because they fear that the Russian supported Uzbek and Tajik groups will try to regain power. These group have come to be know as the 'Northern-Alliance'. then 9-11 So all the US intervention goes down and what come from it? The Taliban and their allies are killed by former russain supporters and former 'freedom fighters'. Too bad that both of these groups also want to kill each other. Essentially all off the evil warlords that were in power before the taliban are back in power. I'm not saying that the Taliban were any better, it's just crazy that killers replace killers who replace killers. any what do the poeple of Kandahar blame on the violence? The fact that every single grown man has guns! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dojafx Posted February 13, 2003 Share Posted February 13, 2003 i see you kabar i have an icepick proof hat you're not getting me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dojafx Posted February 13, 2003 Share Posted February 13, 2003 on the afghanistan issue the cats that were in afghanistan who were supported by the soviets were brutal, but compared to the taliban they were long haired flower sniffing hippies Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaBar Posted February 13, 2003 Share Posted February 13, 2003 Kilo 7 Good point, and I've got to respect your source, but I do not agree. Sorry. I understand that your friend feels that way, but bottom line, I'm not disarming NO MATTER WHAT, and I'll bet you that the Afghan freedom fighters/communist creeps/ warlords/ CIA shills etc. aren't disarming EITHER. I'm sure it would be a better world if everybody would just be nice, but they won't and so one either prepares or deals with the fact they aren't prepared. If you don't want to, brother it's cool with me. But the woods in the state of Texas are like one huge ammunition dump. This state will not be pacified, man. See what I'm saying? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RumPuncher Posted February 13, 2003 Share Posted February 13, 2003 Kabar I suppose the difference in our opinion comes from the meaning of being 'armed'. You can have a shotgun, side arms and even a semi-auto rifle, but it's no where close to what these people are dealing with. The Russians gave relatively simple people assault rifles and land mines. The cia gave even simpler people stinger missles. The escalation just got so far out of hand that everyone was armed to the tits, and terrified of everyone else. That's why the struggle for power went so crazy and why so many people died. If you see two men fighting, dont give one a gun. That's the major difference. I think that it's totally in your rights to have arms, but I don't think that every american should have to have guns just because their neighbours do. People have owen guns for generations and are very well aware of the consequences. Americans know that if you start firing your guns off, you will probably get shot. Some people dont have the experience. besides, it's easy to make rash decisions when you're starving. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
some pittsburgh flavor Posted February 13, 2003 Share Posted February 13, 2003 Re: Fair Question Originally posted by KaBar (hey, I'm 52 and I'm still attracted to a board full of teenagers---what does that say about me?) it starts with "P" and ends in "edophile" no, i'm kidding. you asked for it though. i don't see how you answer any of my questions or rebutt any of my statements by telling what went down when you were in the marines. if yuo're going to be the proverbial "father" to this 16-year-old, i'd appreciate if you'd actually respond to me. thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xwibxonex Posted February 14, 2003 Share Posted February 14, 2003 no doubt heh, my bad, i was attacking the wrong group of poeple in the wrong thread, i totally agree with being armed, ive got a good start with 3 swords and a bb gun 45 heh, but yeh, im still tired of these extremists, but im ready to arm myself for my freedom, right on kabar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patatasbrava Posted February 14, 2003 Share Posted February 14, 2003 If you really want to here some good honest media coverage with views from all over the world. There are many sister stations, but 94.1 KFPA in Berkley has some of the best coverage of world events. that station only has a range that can reach people in the Bay Area. but there are other stations across that country the work together and broadcast the same things that KPFA does. its great because the have alot of people(scholars,journalists, human rights activists, civil rigts) so you get a complete story not the junk thats in mainstream media. Its a public funded radio station thats why they can broadcast what they want, without having a large corporation leaning on them about what there content is. peep it , it change the way you look at things. www.kpfa.org the sister stations are: KPFK(LA), KPFT(houston),WBAI(NY),WPFW(DC) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RumPuncher Posted February 14, 2003 Share Posted February 14, 2003 But here's the tricky part... What is too much ? Obviously if you're sitting on a giant ammo dump the chances of self-inflicted wounds are goingto rise. If you've got a gun in every room, well you're not really all that protected from accidents or quick theifs. I have a sawed-off baseball bat (dont laugh) behind the door incase any nutjobs try to come up my stais. I think that's all I'd need. If anyone with a gun tries to rob my house, then they are probably just dumb enough to use it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Former Posted February 14, 2003 Share Posted February 14, 2003 1984 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
some pittsburgh flavor Posted February 14, 2003 Share Posted February 14, 2003 it's all about kanedigital's size 34 wooden louisville slugger complete with electrical tape grip and "BEAT ON THE BRAT" lettering on the dome-crushing portion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casekonly Posted February 14, 2003 Share Posted February 14, 2003 iraq is the second largest oil producing country in the world...not that it matters. i honestly don't think it's about oil. russia has potential to produce a shit ton more oil, they just don't have the funds. we have people over there right now trying to find the best place to drill, it won't be long. i think the u.s. is slowly weening itself off of oil from the middle east... as far as weapons go, our armed forces have some pretty high technology "super weapons" who needs a nuke when you can wipe out the population of a city and leave buildings standing? who needs missiles when you can shut down their ground control with a digital bomb (will shut down all electricity, and data type devices with an electro magnetic pulse)? we can also cause the "enemy" to wretch and fall onto the ground with super powerful sound waves...inaudible for that matter...gah, who knows what else we have up our sleeves? as far as the homeland security act part II: i'm scared to death of the first one, the second is 1,000,000x worse...i'm moving to canada...and i'm buying a gun and a wilderness survival book... here's something interesting you can do: go googling and find out how many nuclear reactors are in the u.s. and find out where the closest one to your house is...and stop using the library computers and checking out books....the feds keep track of what you look at...also, use a proxy on the net...i'm not using one at the moment, but plan to...if you don't know what a proxy is, find out... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaBar Posted February 14, 2003 Share Posted February 14, 2003 How Much Is Too Much? I think that we should arm in accordance with the letter of the law. One has to qualify statements like that, because every single thing the Nazis did was 100% legal under the laws in Germany at the time they did them. The legislature was NSDP controlled (National Socialist Party of Germany) and they just wrote whatever laws "Chancellor" Hitler told them to write. IN FACT, the Gun Control Law of 1968 was lifted WORD FOR WORD from Nazi gun laws, and that is absolute fact. (For you doubters, I heartily recommend you check with the organization "Jews for the Preservation of Firearms Ownership" (JPFO). They call themselves "America's aggressive civil rights organization.") www.jpfo.org or go directly to the Nazi gun law of 1938 http://jpfo.org/NaziLawEnglish.htm The law says that you may not own "long arms" (rifles and shotguns) until you are 18 years old. DO NOT VIOLATE THE LAW. If you do, and you get caught, you will lose your legal right to own firearms for the rest of your life. You may not buy handguns until you are 21 years old. ^^^ See above statement. You also may not purchase or possess ammunition for handguns until you are old enough to buy one, except .22LR ammo, which also fits .22LR rifles. Not everyone should own firearms. I have had people tell me "I just don't trust myself around firearms." Wow. When I heard that, I said "Then by all means, don't buy any." Sheesh. If you don't trust yourself, no wonder that you don't trust me. This is more or less what it boils down to. You have a right to own firearms under the Second Amendment to the Constitution. But that does not mean that you have a right to carry them around illegally, stupidly show off for your friends, get drunk and play with them, shoot up rival drug dealers' house, etc., etc., etc. You have a right to LAWFULLY POSSESS THEM. That means "Don't break the fucking law!" Do people stupidly break the law? Well, duh! Yeah, they do. Goof around with a gun, though, and you might wind up killing somebody (or yourself), just like if you goof around on a motorcycle, or while skydiving, or while rock climbing. You'd best put your brain in gear around guns. DO NOT DRINK AND FUCK AROUND WITH FIREARMS. At 18, you can vote, get married, make a legally binding contract, join the Armed Forces, get insurance, buy property, sue people, get sued, be tried as an adult, purchase long guns, and so on and so forth. You have a right to do all these things. If you do any of them stupidly, you could wreck your life. Exercise some care, young citizen. At the age of 17, LIKE IT OR NOT, you are a member of THE MILITIA. You do not get to choose. The law applies to you, period, unless you meet a rather narrow bill of exemptions. If you want to read the CURRENT LAW REGARDING YOUR MEMBERSHIP IN THE MILITIA, look up United States Code, Section 311 and Section 332, I think. It basically says that if you are between the ages of 17 and 45, able-bodied and male, you are automatically in the militia unless you are the Vice-President, employed as an arsenal or shipyard worker, or a minister of the Gospel, or already a member of the regular armed forces. There is the "organized militia" (National Guard) and the "unorganized militia." (That's the rest of us.) If you have prior military service, you are in the militia until age 64. This means that come what may, if the President or the Governor of your state calls up the militia, YOU WILL GO, or you will be breaking the law. (Frankly, I can't see it happening anytime soon, but it is still LEGAL.) In Texas, any peace officer can deputize any citizen as a member of the "state military forces" (militia) anytime he or she needs to. Remember the Texas Tower Sniper? (Charles Whitman, former Marine, with a "brain tumor the size of an orange" August 1, 1966.) The four men who went up that tower after him were two brave Austin police officers, and two brave deputized civilians who were combat veterans. They didn't really want to go, but Whitman had killed fourteen people and injured dozens. Somebody had to go get him, and so they volunteered to do it. Legally, they were members of the militia, mobilized in the service of the State of Texas. As regards the Pacifica Radio network, here in Houston we have KPFT 90.1 FM. They were bombed off the air twice by the Ku Klux Klan back when I was in my twenties (1971 and 1972). I went out and looked at the tin transmitter shack (or what was left of it) the first time. I think the guy that did it used way too much explosives. The second time, it looked very professional--the building (which was concrete) was hardly damaged at all. The bombers put the charge on top of a vent grille, then put sandbags on top of that. When it went off, it destroyed the transmitter, but barely scratched the building at all. It looked like a military demolition job to me, which was pretty close. A Klan member named Jimmy Dale Hutto was convicted of it, but in 1981, a Grand Wizard of the Texas Klan admitted that it was he who had engineered the bombing. Unfortunately, by that time, the statute of limitations had run out. I enjoy KPFT's music a lot of the time, especially their blues program, reggae, and bluegrass, but the left-wing politics sucks a big one. Oh, well. They can't please everybody. I figure anybody that the KKK thinks is worth blowing up must be worth listening to, even if they are ultra-liberals. A Constitutional republic requires a little input from every side. If the right wing were completely unfettered, they would soon alienate the population just like an unfettered left wing has done. Texas now has a completely REPUBLICAN CONTROLLED government, both houses of the Legislature and the Governor. Do you realize how rare this is? Texas has been a solidly Democratic state SINCE THE CIVIL WAR. But when the Democratic Party became a euphemism for the Socialist Party, the people of Texas voted with their feet. For years and years and years, the word "Republican" was synonymous with "Yankee." Not any more, though. They done come up. Well, this was a long and boring ass post. Typical. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RumPuncher Posted February 14, 2003 Share Posted February 14, 2003 you are automatically in the militia unless you are the Vice-President, employed as an arsenal or shipyard worker, or a minister of the Gospel, or already a member of the regular armed forces. so a shipyard worker is more essential in his position than a doctor? I guess that just goes to show how outdated that little bit of legislation really is. When was that law writen ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
some pittsburgh flavor Posted February 14, 2003 Share Posted February 14, 2003 hmm.... the terror alert was a false alert. there is nothing to be scared of. WHAT A FUCKING SURPRISE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
some pittsburgh flavor Posted February 15, 2003 Share Posted February 15, 2003 hellllllo-o-o-o-o-o-o-oooooo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OMARNYCAKASW1 Posted February 15, 2003 Share Posted February 15, 2003 http://www.hermes-press.com/soldier.jpg'> http://www.hermes-press.com/silence.jpg'> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Green Posted February 15, 2003 Share Posted February 15, 2003 Originally posted by fr8oholic you didn't get the chain email? we are the new hitler. i heard hitler was the new anus.. which is the new vagina. fyi boieeeeeeee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaBar Posted February 18, 2003 Share Posted February 18, 2003 Very Creative Re-Cycled WWII Art I'm not sure why I think it's important to try and reach you guys on this issue. Probably I won't succeed in reaching many. You all have your own viewpoints, and it's virtually certain that the power of the mass media from Hollywood already has succeeded in shaping your viewpoints. (I know, I know--you feel like your viewpoint was arrived at totally independently and that nothing except your own opinions and sensibility has unduely influenced you. That's why companies spend fifty million dollars for thirty seconds of commercial air time during the Super Bowl, because TV doesn't influence anybody. ) You guys feel that you are very sophisticated and media-savvy, and I'm sure that's true to a degree, but YOUR OPINIONS ARE SHAPED BY POPULAR CULTURE AND POPULAR CULTURE IS SHAPED BY "HOLLYWOOD." Why do you think so many left-wing, so-called "progressive" people gravitate towards advertising, Hollywood film and TV, teach in universities, etc., etc.? They go where they think they can have the most influence on society. Why do you think so many people in the "social services" sector of the government are ultra-liberal, left-wing types? You guys probably do not think of Harvard and Yale and other "Ivy League" schools as universities that champion the Left, but they absolutely do. Yale, in particular, has had enormous influence over CIA and NSA over the years, as well as being the source of many Naval officers. The professors in these schools know that while they may have little personal power in world affairs, if they can succeed with one George Bush or one Bill Clinton or one Condoleeza Rice, they can have enormous influence on world affairs and the direction the country (and the world) takes. President Bush's cabinet is filled with people who served in former (mostly Republican) administrations, as well as many, many corporate Boards of Directors. Bill Clinton's administration was exactly the same way, with only slight variations. They have many things in common, but one glaring common thing is where they went to college--there is a HEAVY dose of the up-Eastern establishment in both examples. George W. may be a good ol' boy from Midland in the public's mind, but his roots go DEEP, DEEP, DEEP into Connecticut and the same up-Eastern establishment mileau that produced the Rockefellers, the Mellons, the du Ponts and so forth. These universities also make it possible for the children of FOREIGN elite classes to be educated at their schools. And when little Abdul becomes Minister of Interior in Abu Dhabi, his background is at least heavily influenced by having attended Duke University or Harvard or Yale or wherever. Ergo, his professors have some influence over how he thinks and the decisions he is likely to make. I deliberately enlisted in the Marine Corps. I quit art school at University of Houston, and joined the Marines. That experience colors the way I think. I did it on purpose. The decisions YOU make, what TV shows you watch, what movies you go see, the people hang out with, the newspapers you read etc., etc., are all going to influence the way you think. Don't think for one second that listening to MTV and popular music, etc., isn't changing the WAY YOU THINK and WHAT YOU BELIEVE TO BE CORRECT. It does. Recognize it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RumPuncher Posted February 18, 2003 Share Posted February 18, 2003 just to piggyback on Kabar's point (about viewpoints and influence)... Try to balance out your news sources. For every item you get from CNN, try to get a least one oterh viewpoint from the BBC or any other international news source. Please! American cable television is not the most reliable news source. and for more piggybacking (on the influence of certain schools)... Noam Chomsky teaches at MIT. How's that for a left-right conflict? Please Believe! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveAustin Posted February 18, 2003 Share Posted February 18, 2003 I watch BBC more often than any american news program...for real. Don't trust american media or the governments manipulation of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suburbian bum Posted February 18, 2003 Share Posted February 18, 2003 Funny thing Kabar, because your opinion that left wing people's views were formed by hollywood and the media. I was just going to say the exact same thing about YOUR views. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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