Jump to content
Search In
  • More options...
Find results that contain...
Find results in...
Sign in to follow this  
Guest Ted Wakowski

Lets get into it...

Recommended Posts

Guest Ted Wakowski

Biological evolution. More specifically, human evolution vs. technological evolution. Neo-humanism. Artificial intelligence. Exponential growth. Moore's law ...........

 

What do you think of these things? Optimist or doomsayer?

 

I'm just curious what other characteristically rebellious writer-types who might be into thinking about this kind of shit have to say about it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
This forum is brought to you by the 12ozProphet Shop.
This forum is brought to you by the 12ozProphet Shop.
This forum is brought to you by the 12oz Shop.
Guest THEdude

One thing I'm am most sure of, the point from which I view things, I believe that if there is a meaning to this which there has to be since you mention the very same things that connect us, then yes, yes indeed.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest Dyptheria

Biological Evolution is a fact as far as i'm concerned. Nothing has disproven it. It doesn't disprove the existence of a higher being or any sort of deity, but it does disprove the inane story of creation in the old testament.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

i believe in a higher being yes...

 

the bible is a history book

 

thats the way i look at it..hard to look away from fact and science

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest Dyptheria

the bible is not a history book. it is incorrect in many ways....this is an evolution thread, not a bible thread. there's one of those, go back in the archives and bump it if you care to talk about that shit further

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest im not witty

"If you're looking at the highlights of human development, you have to look at the evolution of the organism, and then add the development of the interaction with its environment. Evolution of the organism will begin with the evolution of life, proceeding through the hominid, coming to the evolution of mankind: neanderthal, cro-magnon man. Now, interestingly, what you're looking at here are three strains: biological, anthropological (development of cities, cultures), and cultural (which is human expression). Now, what you've seen here is the evolution of populations, not so much the evolution of individuals. And in addition, if you look at the time-scale that's involved here: two billion years for life, six million years

for the hominid, a hundred-thousand years for mankind as we know it, you're beginning to see the telescoping nature of the evolutionary paradigm. And then, when you get to agriculture, when you get to the scientific revolution and the industrial revolution, you're looking at ten thousand years, four hundred years, a hundred and fifty years. You're seeing a further telescoping of this evolutionary time. What that means is that as we go through the new evolution, it's going to telescope to the point that we should see it manifest itself within our lifetimes, within a generation. The new evolution stems from information, and it stems from two types of information: digital and analog. The digital is artificial intelligence; The analog results from molecular biology, the cloning of the organism, and you knit the two together with neurobiology. Before, under the old evolutionary paradigm, one would die and the other would grow and dominate. But, under the new paradigm, they would exist as a mutually supportive, non-competitive grouping independent from the external. Now what is interesting here is that evolution now becomes an individually-centered process eminating from the needs and desires of the individual, and not an external process, a passive process, where the individual is just at the whim of the collective.

So, you produce a neo-human with a new individuality, a new consciousness. But, that's only the beginning of the evolutionary cycle because as the next cycle proceeds, the input is now this new intelligence. As intelligence pods on intelligence, as abilty pods on ability, the speed changes. Until what? Until you reach a crescendo. In a way, it could be imagined as an almost instantaneous fulfillment of human, human and neo-human, potential. It could be something totally different. It could be the amplification of the individual...the multiplication of individual existences, parallel existences, now with the individual no longer restricted by time and space. And the manifestations of this neo-human type evolution could be dramatically counter-intuitive; That's the interesting part. The old evolution is cold, it's sterile, it's efficient. And, it's manifestations are those social adaptations. We're talking about parasitism, dominance, morality, war, predation. These will be subject to de-emphasis. These will be subject to de-evolution. The new evolutionary paradigm will give us the human traits of truth, of loyalty, of justice, of freedom. These will be the manifestations of the new evolution, and that is what we would hope to see from this, that would be nice."

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest Dyptheria

that was one of many of my favorite dialogs from that movie. i also liked the one about freewill, and what is freewill, and do we really have freewill?

 

did yo get that from a website that has all of the dialog transcribed? if so can you share?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Originally posted by Dyptheria

the bible is not a history book. it is incorrect in many ways....this is an evolution thread, not a bible thread. there's one of those, go back in the archives and bump it if you care to talk about that shit further

eh i did not mean it that way...i say history cause it was written by mortal men...thats all..i dont really care enough bout the subject to really get into it ;)

you folks continue on

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest Ted Wakowski

That's Eamonn Healey!! Word up, it's dope they used him ... I threw that excerpt my friend's way today while we were looking at something Ray Kurzweil wrote.

 

Talk about a fucking optimist. That's a good thing though, kind of rare in a fairly pessimistic modern science community.

 

Evolution makes sense to me. In a sense, so does religion. What starts to get me really thinking, considering a certain belief I'll conform to as far as an evolutionary process even more exponentially expansive than Moore's law suggests, is trying to see the next step. I guess certain trans- or neohumanistic theories might make sense when really rationally considered, beyond the floating stigma of science-fiction. Then again so does the idea of everything being fucking doomed.

 

I don't know. Talk to me in twenty or thirty years when I've seen more of the situation first-hand and have accumulated a lot more knowledge and awareness.

 

This is honestly a HUGE subject. You could debate or sink into thought on these ideas for the rest of your life and maybe never come to any really solid conclusions. Eventually, I think you'll just settle back into what you believe, be it the definitive "truth" in your mind or not.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest JIGSAW

Technology begins to climb at a great rate, yet we still have men reading at grade eight....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest --zeSto--

it's so very obvious that our natural pace of evolution is clashing with our

current rate of technical progress.

 

let me simplify...

 

Lactose Intolerance.

 

The human body hasn't evolved to really handle milk after the nursing phase.

How ever... we not only drink milk all our lives,

and suffer from varying degrees of lactose intolerance...

but we make the milk taste like chocolate! Now that's fucked up.

 

here's another breakdown of terms...

Humans (and all living things) evolve at a steady pace unless a mutation occurs.

Humans have had way more evolutions than most animals in too short a time frame.

Our technology occurs in Revolutions... where everything changes overnight.

So imagine the imbalance that happens when our present bodies

are subjected to medicines 'of the future' (evolutionally speaking)

 

you know what you get...?

People over extending their natural lives way beoyond what the rest of the planet can support.

Great.... every one of those humans will make 30 years extra trash then they used to.

Bring on the matrix.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

moore's law...funny.

 

_______________

 

i think it's one of two things...

 

1) humans survive but the world (earth/environment) is completely unrecognizable, due to the fact that we can't evolve as quickly as technology/science. in that case, are humans still 'humans'? it's like the ship of theasus ( i think it's theasus -- damn weed and memory), but if you take a ship apart and put it back together, is it still the same ship?

 

2) the world and humans are no longer an issue...as technology will propogate quicker w/ better defense mechanism than humans...

 

i think we're daft if we don't think that we're building machines that will at one point replace us...

 

which will (in our history) make us the only animal to literally create the object of our demise.

 

_____

 

on the flip side...watching it happen is pretty sweet...how they mixed the goat and the spider together to create a 'goder' that spins web 10 times stronger than a flack jacket, but the weight of a tshirt...thank god for military research!

 

-dot.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

heavy shit for 12oz

 

my belief is that while human evolution has remained basically stagnant due to natural selection and over-population (ex: any beneficial traits will be lost in the shuffle of so many people; ex: whereas a mentally deficient or physically handicapped person wouldn't have been able to replicate in the past, society has made them able to reproduce {not that they couldn't fuck before, but it was unlikely that they would have a chance to breed} they can now pursue more-or-less normal lives due to increases in the avaliability of medicines and support systems {family, social workers, etc...}thus allowing them to breed more often-slowing the evolution of mankind even further, if not regressing) the rapid upward trend of technological evolution has put mankind in a serious conundrum-how do we cope with too much knowledge?

 

We now possess drugs to "fix" almost any mental or physical problem-extending our lifespans and "increasing" our standard of living seems to be a large goal of science currently. But the problem remains that our bodies have not evolved-basically, we are the same creature that walked the earth 100,000 years ago.

 

Before you insist that can't be correct, our bodies haven't changed-only our method of instilling knowledge, or the gerrymandering that passes for science in most cases.

 

Ever notice that 65% of america is considered obese? this isn't because we eat too much, or because we eat the wrong foods, but because of the fact that our bodies have not changed (evolved) enough to handle the unhealthy products we force upon it.

 

that's about enough for now-my brain is hurting from too much thinking about this...i mean, come on people-this is 12oz prophet-NOT philosophy 202. but i did enjoy it

 

:idea:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest JIGSAW

lucid dream, I used to have a lot of them as a kid, I'd know I would be in a dream and I'd want to wake up while I was in the dream...I remember one night where I even tried making a "wake up machine" in one of my dreams, didnt work...:o

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest Ted Wakowski

"With the advent of a technology-creating species, the exponential pace became too fast for evolution through DNA-guided protein synthesis and moved on to human-created technology. Technology goes beyond mere tool making; it is a process of creating ever more powerful technology using the tools from the previous round of innovation. In this way, human technology is distinguished from the tool making of other species. There is a record of each stage of technology, and each new stage of technology builds on the order of the previous stage." (kurzweil)

 

 

 

"The relative indifference to the environment springs, I believe, from deep within human nature. The human brain evidently evolved to commit itself emotionally only to a small piece of geography, a limited band of kinsmen, and two or three generations into the future. To look neither far ahead nor far afield is elemental in a Darwinian sense. We are innately inclined to ignore any distant possibility not yet requiring examination. It is, people say, just good common sense." (plastic.com)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Originally posted by im not witty

"If you're looking at the highlights of human development, you have to look at the evolution of the organism, and then add the development of the interaction with its environment. Evolution of the organism will begin with the evolution of life, proceeding through the hominid, coming to the evolution of mankind: neanderthal, cro-magnon man. Now, interestingly, what you're looking at here are three strains: biological, anthropological (development of cities, cultures), and cultural (which is human expression). Now, what you've seen here is the evolution of populations, not so much the evolution of individuals. And in addition, if you look at the time-scale that's involved here: two billion years for life, six million years

for the hominid, a hundred-thousand years for mankind as we know it, you're beginning to see the telescoping nature of the evolutionary paradigm. And then, when you get to agriculture, when you get to the scientific revolution and the industrial revolution, you're looking at ten thousand years, four hundred years, a hundred and fifty years. You're seeing a further telescoping of this evolutionary time. What that means is that as we go through the new evolution, it's going to telescope to the point that we should see it manifest itself within our lifetimes, within a generation. The new evolution stems from information, and it stems from two types of information: digital and analog. The digital is artificial intelligence; The analog results from molecular biology, the cloning of the organism, and you knit the two together with neurobiology. Before, under the old evolutionary paradigm, one would die and the other would grow and dominate. But, under the new paradigm, they would exist as a mutually supportive, non-competitive grouping independent from the external. Now what is interesting here is that evolution now becomes an individually-centered process eminating from the needs and desires of the individual, and not an external process, a passive process, where the individual is just at the whim of the collective.

So, you produce a neo-human with a new individuality, a new consciousness. But, that's only the beginning of the evolutionary cycle because as the next cycle proceeds, the input is now this new intelligence. As intelligence pods on intelligence, as abilty pods on ability, the speed changes. Until what? Until you reach a crescendo. In a way, it could be imagined as an almost instantaneous fulfillment of human, human and neo-human, potential. It could be something totally different. It could be the amplification of the individual...the multiplication of individual existences, parallel existences, now with the individual no longer restricted by time and space. And the manifestations of this neo-human type evolution could be dramatically counter-intuitive; That's the interesting part. The old evolution is cold, it's sterile, it's efficient. And, it's manifestations are those social adaptations. We're talking about parasitism, dominance, morality, war, predation. These will be subject to de-emphasis. These will be subject to de-evolution. The new evolutionary paradigm will give us the human traits of truth, of loyalty, of justice, of freedom. These will be the manifestations of the new evolution, and that is what we would hope to see from this, that would be nice."

 

 

I was going to say the same.

 

Waking Life rules.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Originally posted by JIGSAW

lucid dream, I used to have a lot of them as a kid, I'd know I would be in a dream and I'd want to wake up while I was in the dream...I remember one night where I even tried making a "wake up machine" in one of my dreams, didnt work...:o

 

 

I've only had a few myself.

 

They've been as a young child, too.

 

 

I always ended up with guns, though.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest SPLINTER

we are creating our own dooms with the usage of medicine and highly technological (that sounds shitty, oh well) surgeries that save our lives. medicine does many things to weaken the HomoSapien species.

 

first it allows us to survive or to help to survive children and adults alike in situations that would have killed them in the past because there body wasnt strong enough. Sometimes these situations could be easily overcome by most humans but the ones that cannot usually have weak genes thus we allow them to reproduce and poison the gene pool.

 

medicine (antibiotics) and soaps that kill bacteria have created a society in which we are afraid of the germs that our body can naturaly kill off. this is like deactivating our immune system and then what if we are in some wierd situation when we dont have antibiotics nor antibacterial creams to rub on our wounds?? were gonna pay.

 

our common day belief is that all humans should be very similar to one another so when certain genetic disorders as we like to call them appear we try to make the holders of the disoreder more like everyone else even if it doesnt endanger their lives. these disorder may not be disoreders at all maybe all of the people with the genetic difference were made to mate with each other and produce a more different offspring, after many years of mating between one another a speciation might have occured. this wuold have been evolution of one species into many but we dont allow it to happen.

 

wow how the fuck did i come up with that shit??

 

thanks to mr. Cracked Ass for enlighting me in the Deoderant thread where he taught us many things about bacteria and the immune system.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...