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bobobi11
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Guest bumdigger
Originally posted by bobobi11

 

But I work with the city and the politicians in the city are not as enlightened as we would like.

 

we????????

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Originally posted by bobobi11

It's not the actual paint or marker on property that bothers me, it is the use of valuable resources on a problem like this that bothers me.

 

it's not the actual things your saying that bother me, it is the fact that you came here when you are obviously not wanted. you seem to be in a postition to where you could change these stereotypes, but you seem a little to concerned with keeping your job... (a job that you have your own conflicts with doing. you say you like looking at graffiti? well you sound like a vegetarian butcher...)

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....well, you came back to face up to what you did

 

i'm a bit surprised..

 

however, using the excuse of "this is my job" is a copout

 

in our world, there is ample oppurtunity for most people to get many different kinds of jobs..people have a choice in the career path they follow..people have a CHOICE..they choose to bear children, they choose to get a job, and they have plenty of say in the kind of job they get an keep..are you only good at taking flicks, and being an 'expert'? ..apparantly so, because you aren't computer savvy, and a terrible observer and detective..(your response to secret is a great demonstration)..maybe if you went out and learned about something you may be better at it..

 

you chose to follow this career, and continue to do so

your site claims that you are an expert witness, and an authority on graf..although you are not technically a cop..this is pretty goddamn close to law enforcement..

your attempts to learn about graf have been pretty pathetic..15 to 17 year olds who listen to hiphop?! hahahaaaaa

awesome

 

i don't fit anywhere in that category, and have not since i started

 

we'll probably keep you in your lame business though, since the buff is fighting a losing battle..

the career you have is fucking pathetic..i hope you aren't kidding yourself into thinking you're doing portland some good by keeping up the buff...

 

and poor fucking travis..you don't know shit about that guy..i hope one of your kids grows into the type of person he is..

 

i hope your children expose you to even more about the trials and tribulations of dealing with the justice system..i have no doubt that they will test you better than any of us can

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Originally posted by SayOne

all i want to know is how you got the job you have, you make it sound like you hate it. But whatever, it just goes to show we gotta watch our backs no matter how they seem.

 

You know funny enough I got this job as a temp because I was a good secretary. I had just been evicted from my apartment and needed a job, this one came along. To start it was mostly urban planning and the graffiti aspect was given to me later. By that time I was well into the job and believed the bs given to me. It was only later that I began to doubt what I was doing. I don't really hate my job, I just struggle with the moral implications.

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like i said i know its wrong...and there is no justification for it...there are pros and cons to just about everything...why not graffiti...this brings me to another point, and a question(quite funny if you ask me)i got into graffiti a few years back after being harassed by policeman, business owners, drivers, pedestrians, for skateboarding..

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Originally posted by bobobi11

 

You know to some extent I agree with you. In and of itself, graffiti seems to me pretty harmless. I know that I sometimes really enjoy seeing it. But I work with the city and the politicians in the city are not as enlightened as we would like. And the owners of the property that is being vandalized as well as business owners in the neighborhood are still working under the old assumptions of graffiti being "gang" related and are abnormally scared by its presense. So you have a large group of "important" people going to your governments and complaining about the graffiti. So then the city is forced to do something. Contrary to popular belief on here, the cops don't stop worrying about rapists and murderers to go after vandals instead. No the city takes money away from programs such as art and music, parks, public art, etc. to pay for the removal of graffiti. And businesses raise their prices to cover the increased overhead of having to remove graffiti from their buildings and replace "racked" merchandise. It's not the actual paint or marker on property that bothers me, it is the use of valuable resources on a problem like this that bothers me.

 

and have you noticed that in cities where graf was getting fucking crazy all over the place they stopped WASTING the money and started legal walls and murals (see philly...full of gorgeous murals..not all graf!)

..this has happened all over cali as well..

 

graf forces people to look at the art..abatement is not effective..

 

so finally people started opening their eyes to the ideas of legal art on public walls

 

have you ever seen europe buff their subways like the states?!

they don't waste the money because they know it is something many enjoy..

 

maybe you should be working to change these attitudes..

not reinforcing them

 

fucking hypocrites!

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Originally posted by bobobi11

 

. Contrary to popular belief on here, the cops don't stop worrying about rapists and murderers to go after vandals instead. No the city takes money away from programs such as art and music, parks, public art, etc. to pay for the removal of graffiti.

 

 

 

It's not the actual paint or marker on property that bothers me, it is the use of valuable resources on a problem like this that bothers me.

 

this was a point of mine...graffiti is extremely harmless, why waste money for schooling, parks, etc. When you can put it into something productive. Jesus Christ, have you been to a public school lately?

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Originally posted by Are2

maybe you should be working to change these attitudes..

not reinforcing them

Are2 is right. If you "struggle with the moral implications" of your job, then why not do something to change it instead of doing whatever they tell you to at your "safe" job.

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Originally posted by Are2

....well, you came back to face up to what you did

 

i'm a bit surprised..

 

however, using the excuse of "this is my job" is a copout

 

in our world, there is ample oppurtunity for most people to get many different kinds of jobs..people have a choice in the career path they follow..people have a CHOICE..they choose to bear children, they choose to get a job, and they have plenty of say in the kind of job they get an keep..are you only good at taking flicks, and being an 'expert'? ..apparantly so, because you aren't computer savvy, and a terrible observer and detective..(your response to secret is a great demonstration)..maybe if you went out and learned about something you may be better at it..

 

you chose to follow this career, and continue to do so

your site claims that you are an expert witness, and an authority on graf..although you are not technically a cop..this is pretty goddamn close to law enforcement..

your attempts to learn about graf have been pretty pathetic..15 to 17 year olds who listen to hiphop?! hahahaaaaa

awesome

 

i don't fit anywhere in that category, and have not since i started

 

we'll probably keep you in your lame business though, since the buff is fighting a losing battle..

the career you have is fucking pathetic..i hope you aren't kidding yourself into thinking you're doing portland some good by keeping up the buff...

 

and poor fucking travis..you don't know shit about that guy..i hope one of your kids grows into the type of person he is..

 

i hope your children expose you to even more about the trials and tribulations of dealing with the justice system..i have no doubt that they will test you better than any of us can

 

Are2 I am sorry that you feel so betrayed by me. I can also understand you feelings about my career. There are no words that I can use over the internet to make you believe that I never meant to hurt you. As far as my "detective" skills if you read what I wrote above again you will see that I was trying to prove that writers did not fit into the profile that has been pushed since graffiti abatement became a job.

 

I am sure that my children will expose me to a lot of trials and tribulations, hopefully not with the justice system since I seek to keep an open communication with them.

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Guest fr8lover
Originally posted by Are2

have you ever seen europe buff their subways like the states?!

they don't waste the money because they know it is something many enjoy..

 

you were kind of right and kind of wrong. first, many cities in europe DO or are now buffing their subway lines, look at rome as a recent example of them doing it, that place was overrun with graffiti much like the mta, and it seemed that as much as regular people *may* have enjoyed it, they became more fed up than overjoyed about the problem.

 

second, shes not being hypocritical, it sounds more like shes taking the stance of "liking graffiti if its in the right place." you guys still havent quite grasped that this was her job, and as much as you talk at her its not her job to enjoy all graffiti. hell, im sure all of us dont like it all either.

 

anyway you slice it, it was a pretty shitty thing of her to do. pretending to be a fan when really she was plain and simple a hater in the truest form of the word.

 

theres been a lot of argument about which threads need to be closed and which dont, but this one seems ripe to be closed. its not going to go anywhere or accomplish anything but more bickering and breaking away from what this message board is normally supposed to be.

 

bobobi, maybe its time you took an exit stage left and let it be, same with everyone else.

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Guest SayOne
Originally posted by bobobi11

 

 

I am sure that my children will expose me to a lot of trials and tribulations, hopefully not with the justice system since I seek to keep an open communication with them.

 

what if your kids got into graff, what would you do???

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Originally posted by inkjunkie34

like i said i know its wrong...and there is no justification for it...there are pros and cons to just about everything...why not graffiti...this brings me to another point, and a question(quite funny if you ask me)i got into graffiti a few years back after being harassed by policeman, business owners, drivers, pedestrians, for skateboarding..

 

I can understand that. There are actually laws that I find stifling myself. Skateboarding is a good example. We recently changed the laws in Portland so that skateboarding is allowed in the street just like a bicycle. I have also be a proponent to new skateboard parks. I think skateboarding is a good hobby and one that my oldest son enjoys. I understand the need for regulation with boards though since I have seen several pedestrians knocked down by boarders without enough respect to look out for people in their way. This is just as bad as drivers who hit bicyclists or even boarders by not looking where they are going.

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i don't feel betrayed

 

i'm trying to show you that your attitude is hypocritical, you didn't accomplish anything positive by coming on here and misrepresenting yourself, and maybe to open your eyes up to the fact that you do not have to keep doing what you're doing..

 

 

and i feel bad for poor travis..

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Originally posted by Are2

 

and have you noticed that in cities where graf was getting fucking crazy all over the place they stopped WASTING the money and started legal walls and murals (see philly...full of gorgeous murals..not all graf!)

..this has happened all over cali as well..

 

graf forces people to look at the art..abatement is not effective..

 

so finally people started opening their eyes to the ideas of legal art on public walls

 

have you ever seen europe buff their subways like the states?!

they don't waste the money because they know it is something many enjoy..

 

maybe you should be working to change these attitudes..

not reinforcing them

 

fucking hypocrites!

 

That's funny. Philly has a reputation as being one of the toughest buffs around. The only way they got to the point of free walls was by breaking the graffiti community in that town. And maybe you should ask me what I have done for the good of graffiti. That I have talked till I am blue in the face about free walls, and mentorship programs instead of jail, or that I am also on the board for a mural program. You now I can understand that you are upset. I would probably be too. But you know what I was able to look past the fact that you are a vandal and see that you are also an intelligent, sensitive woman who was more than a stereotype.

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What I like is how you keep trying to defend yourself and your job and that you really do like graffiti and think it's good. Funny, any observer looking at your "credentials" would assume that you think graffiti is the plague of the modern day and are on your own personal crusade to eliminate it completely. You people are worse than cops. You are small minded ignorant yokels who don't understand this culture at all.

 

The fact that you came on here and tried to pass yourself off as a "neutral fan" of graffiti when all the while you were gaining "research" (which seems to include collecting nearly every flick posted in the bench) on how you can combat it is what has pissed most people off. Get a clue that you are just like every other close-minded fuck with a pathetic, useless past time and are no longer wanted on this board.

 

Go away.......

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Originally posted by bumdigger

 

we????????

 

Yes WE. Just because I have a job in graffiti abatement doesn't mean that I personally hate all writers. It doesn't mean that I am absolutely closed minded. I have feelings about both sides of the coin. And you know what, if I hadn't been able to come on here and talk to you guys without the "you suck because you are the buff and I will never talk to you" I would have continiued thinking that the other anti's were right and that you were just a bunch of rebellious kids. I suspended my beliefs to listen to you and realize that this issue is not black and white but many shades of gray.

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the philly graf community is far from broken

i think you should check that before a bunch of people are all over you for a different reason

 

philly is not bomb central like it was back when, but please..lots of people still get up, and stay up there..

 

and the good of graf?

 

pardon me for not thanking you..i couldn't care less whether or not graf was legal..

you are still in the system, working FOR it

 

and don't expect a commendation because you aren't stupid enough to believe every stereotype you hear..

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Originally posted by bobobi11

 

Yes WE. Just because I have a job in graffiti abatement doesn't mean that I personally hate all writers. It doesn't mean that I am absolutely closed minded. I have feelings about both sides of the coin. And you know what, if I hadn't been able to come on here and talk to you guys without the "you suck because you are the buff and I will never talk to you" I would have continiued thinking that the other anti's were right and that you were just a bunch of rebellious kids. I suspended my beliefs to listen to you and realize that this issue is not black and white but many shades of gray.

 

THE WHOLE FUCKING WORLD IS A SHADE OF GREY

 

you expect to gain some credit because you aren't absolutely close minded

 

well woopdeefucking doo aren't you a good person

 

and you suspended you're believes to listen to us?

well which is it? what do you believe?

 

i hope that is all a big question to you right now

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Originally posted by inkjunkie34

 

this was a point of mine...graffiti is extremely harmless, why waste money for schooling, parks, etc. When you can put it into something productive. Jesus Christ, have you been to a public school lately?

 

As a matter of fact I have been. I actually volunteer a lot at my school because I feel that my kids deserve that. But I am one person, I don't control the funding. I can talk and try to make the city more understanding, but in the end if they are intent on making a war on graffiti, I would rather it be quick and economical so we can get on to better things than drawn out and money sucking. Do you realize that this country spends very conservatively $15 billion a year just to remove graffiti. Not for investigation or any other expenses just removal. And that doesn't count volunteer groups either. At least I am trying to do something for my community. You bitch that cities divert resources to removing graffiti, then why cause the problem in the first place. Why not try to find another way of getting your voice heard, one that is positive?

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Originally posted by bobobi11

 

As a matter of fact I have been. I actually volunteer a lot at my school because I feel that my kids deserve that. But I am one person, I don't control the funding. I can talk and try to make the city more understanding, but in the end if they are intent on making a war on graffiti, I would rather it be quick and economical so we can get on to better things than drawn out and money sucking. Do you realize that this country spends very conservatively $15 billion a year just to remove graffiti. Not for investigation or any other expenses just removal. And that doesn't count volunteer groups either. At least I am trying to do something for my community. You bitch that cities divert resources to removing graffiti, then why cause the problem in the first place. Why not try to find another way of getting your voice heard, one that is positive?

 

 

Do you realize that you keep contradicting yourself over and over and over????

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