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This is an essay to give to nazi music fans...

Discussion in 'Channel Zero' started by Agt. Adopus, Oct 25, 2002.

  1. Agt. Adopus

    Agt. Adopus 12oz Junior Member

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    This is an essay to give to nazi music fans...

    Discussion started by Agt. Adopus - Oct 25, 2002

    Racism/Fascism, Satanism & Heathenism.....The truth.

    Many groups/people do not fully understand the history and ideals behind non-Judeo-Christian philosopies, especially when it comes to their relations (if any) to rasicm and/or fascism. While not a comprehensive guide, this essay is intended to clear a few things up for people who may have been mislead into thinking that Satanism and Heathenism are racist idealogies, or that people who claim racial superiority (white or otherwise) are actually following the ideals of said belief systems, which of course they are not.

    Several groups have tried to inject racist ideas into the anti-Christian music underground (esp. Black Metal) where such pontiffication was once non-existent. Once, bands had to prove their musicianship to be worthy of praise and hails. Now, it seems any one-man band with a political agenda can gather the support of uninformed music fans by affiliating themselves with some "extreme" or "kult" idealogy or organization. The most common catalyst for such affiliation (real or imagined) is the concept of "shock value". Many bands claim allegiance to some "shocking" persona (i.e., Satan, Hitler) as a gimmick to try to sell CDs. With the current boom in sales of anything labled "Satanic" or "Black Metal", many sheisters have covered the dolar sign with a false visage of the Pentagram, Sigil of Baphomet, or even the Nazi swastika (different from the ORIGINAL swastika, a Sanskrit (ancient Indian) symbol of good luck). It is quite clear that such people are only trying to make money (be it for personal or political use) and are exploiting the underground in the process. It should be known that these types are NOT to be taken seriously, as musicians or occultists. They are the BackstreetBoys and Britney Spears of the undergound, maufactured image-based primadonnas posing for the camera in corpsepaint & spikes until the next trend comes along.

    The current trend of racist Black/Death Metal can be likened to the "punk" phenonmenon in the 1970s & 1980s...Once the Sex Pistols appeared on TV, record labels were snatching up and packaging anything remotely resembling "punk" rock, including artists like Blondie, Elvis Costello, and Billy Idol/Generation X. Obviously these pop artists had little or nothing to do with "punk", but the image was close enough foe the industry, and they were marketed as such. (Don't forget the use of the swastika as a shock tool during these times as well: Sid Vicous, Souixsee & the Banshees, etc...)
    Another comparison could be the "grunge"/"alternative rock" boom of the early 1990s (when real Black Metal was just gathering steam undergound)...A few bands like gained major-label success, and then the motif repeated itself, like clockwork. Every major-label went on a 50 state signing spree, dressing their new found bands in ripped jeans and flannel hoping for the next Nirvana or Pearl Jam....The same thing is happening now, only now smaller labels are caught up in the maelstrom of "extreme metal". Extreme is "in" and racist organizations are capitalizing on it, such as the racist label Resistance Records, who have scrapped their old marketing tactics in favor of flying the banner of "extreme metal", and advertising in popular magazines, alongside bands from non-white countries such as Brazil, Malaysia, etc.

    With that all said, let's move on to the actual ideas these supremacists claim affiliation with.........


    SATANISM (LaVeyan/Church of Satan)

    "4. Satan represents kindness to those who deserve it instead of love wasted on ingrates! "
    from The Nine Satanic Statements
    from The Satanic Bible, ©1969
    by Anton Szandor LaVey

    Clearly, the idea of any sort of "race war" falls under this statement. Why love or respect someone on the sole basis that they belong to the same "race"? That kind of deflates the pipe dream of "white unity", etc..

    "1. Do not give opinions or advice unless you are asked. "
    "3. When in another’s lair, show him respect or else do not go there. "
    "8. Do not complain about anything to which you need not subject yourself. "
    from The Eleven Satanic Rules of the Earth
    by Anton Szandor LaVey ©1967

    Each of these rules are broken by racists and facists all the time!
    1.The most common act associated with fascists is to spouting off in public (rallies, TV apearances) about politics no one wants to hear.
    3.Fascist/racist bands play at venues in predominantly black, Latino and Jewish areas all the time...also, since few people waste their time with archaic politics,The entire world is the lair of the non-racist, so where are these fools to go?
    8.Why do racist bands complain (in lyrics and in interveiws) about the "struggle" of being "pro-white"? One would imagine that probelm could be alleviated by simply NOT being racist and pushing your ideas on people.


    "1. Stupidity—The top of the list for Satanic Sins. The Cardinal Sin of Satanism. It’s too bad that stupidity isn’t painful. Ignorance is one thing, but our society thrives increasingly on stupidity. It depends on people going along with whatever they are told. The media promotes a cultivated stupidity as a posture that is not only acceptable but laudable. Satanists must learn to see through the tricks and cannot afford to be stupid. "
    "2. Pretentiousness—Empty posturing can be most irritating and isn’t applying the cardinal rules of Lesser Magic. On equal footing with stupidity for what keeps the money in circulation these days. Everyone’s made to feel like a big shot, whether they can come up with the goods or not. "
    "5. Herd Conformity—That’s obvious from a Satanic stance. It’s all right to conform to a person’s wishes, if it ultimately benefits you. But only fools follow along with the herd, letting an impersonal entity dictate to you. The key is to choose a master wisely instead of being enslaved by the whims of the many. "
    "7. Forgetfulness of Past Orthodoxies—Be aware that this is one of the keys to brainwashing people into accepting something new and different, when in reality it’s something that was once widely accepted but is now presented in a new package. We are expected to rave about the genius of the creator and forget the original. This makes for a disposable society. "
    "8. Counterproductive Pride—That first word is important. Pride is great up to the point you begin to throw out the baby with the bathwater. The rule of Satanism is: if it works for you, great. When it stops working for you, when you’ve painted yourself into a corner and the only way out is to say, I’m sorry, I made a mistake, I wish we could compromise somehow, then do it. "
    from The Nine Satanic Sins
    by Anton Szandor LaVey ©1987

    1.Self-explanatory.
    2.Pretensiousness is the trait that basically defines supremacist ideals.
    5.Herd confomity is the most obvious tendency that separates fascists from Satanists.
    7.Racism is not "new" or "extreme". It is merely the stuff of old-fashoined Christian ways. It's just being repackaged for public consumption.
    8.Self-explanatory.


    "There is no rule that says that we all should like each other. That is the kind of stupid idea one would expect a Christian to espouse.......There is no regard for the value of individuality in Christianity. In contrast to such notions, the individual is the foundation of Satanism. We should always regard one another first and foremost as individuals, not as parts of some collective whole. Whether that collective is race, religion or nationality is beside the point. There is no spiritual bond between Satanists. We are not mere components of some mystical “Body of Satan.” We should leave such idiotic notions to lesser creatures. If you subscribe to such ideas perhaps you had better think about whether you too are to be numbered amongst such lesser creatures."
    ---CoS Magister Micheal Rose


    Even with these few references, it is made clear that racism & fascism are NOT compatible with true Satanism. Obviously, anyone who is racist and also claims to be a Satanist, is doing just that, claiming.


    ASATRU/NORSE HEATHEN

    The Heathen idealogy (separate from, although an inspriation to Satanism) is based on the pre-Christian polytheistic religions. Many racists try to use Heathen (esp. Norse Heathen) references and imagery as a basis and/or platform for their poltical agenda. However, (as you will see in the quotes below) these people are shunned by those who are actually actively involved with modern Heathenism. The fact that Asatru (popularized in Black/Death metal by bands like UNLEASHED) existed before the spread of Christianty disqualifies it as having any race-related tenets. There were no Jews, Blacks etc. in Northern Europe at that time, so HOW could the religion be based on hatred against them? Also, contrary to racist belief, the "living history" of modern "kindreds" is refers to ALL of the bloodlines and history, which includes a great deal of miscegenation. The rich history and ancestry of Heathenism would be disrespected by anyone who tries to limit it to those of "pure" Germanic blood, which would be a grand total of ZERO people living today. The well-known history of Europe shows how the Vikings (as well as other Norse tribes/peoples) were EXPLORERS. If they were elitist with concern to race, then why would they want to expand and evolve their culture? Wouldn't they have just stayed at home, never learning about other cultures (like today's racists)? The very term Anglo-Saxon is rhe result of "race-mixing"; Anglos being the people native to the British Isles, and Saxons being a nomadic Germanic tribe.

    "The Nazis tried to revive the myths of ancient Germany in their ideology, but such an attempt could only lead to sterility and moral suicide. We cannot deny the demands of our own age, but this need not prevent us turning to the faith of another age with sympathetic understanding, and recapturing imaginatively some of its vanished power. It will even help us to view more clearly the assumptions and beliefs of our own time."
    -Hilda R. Ellis Davidson-from Gods and Myths of the Viking Age (also as Gods and Myths of Northern Europe)

    "Jordsvin's statement in regard to the racism, sexism, and homophobia unfortunately prevalent among some Asatru practitioners:
    <Jordsvin raises middle finger>"
    -Jordsvin-webmaster, Jordsvin's Norse Heathen Page

    "...We are not merely some fantasist group that tries to recreate the viking age, nor are we some radical racist idiots who try to boast genetic superiority through the lack of melanin in our skin. Our goal is to rediscover the heritage that was lost to us over one-thousand years ago and bring it back into our lives."
    --Northern Hammer Hearth, San Deigo, CA Asatru group

    "The Voluspa (from the Poetic Edda, my favorite translation is Lee Hollander's, yes I know he took some liberties for the sake of the poetry, but it's beautiful reading) gives a fairly blatant description of how all of the Gods and all of the Giants are descended from Ymir, a pretty horrid Giant. It also tells of how Frey, Freyja, and Njord, left the Vanir to live in Asgard, and how Mimir and Hoenir left the Aesir to live in Vanaheim. The Rigsthula describes how Rig (Heimdal) originates the 3 classes of men - slaves, freemen, and kings.Back to the Voluspa, Thor's sons Modi and Magni are his children by a Giantess, Jarnsaxa.The Grimnismal tells of vidarr and Vali, Odhinns sons by Giantesses.Skirnismal tells us of Frey's marriage to Gerdr, a Giantess.Skadi, Njord's wife, is a Giantess.Many sources show Odhinn having trysts with maidens of nearly every race.Loki, Odhinn's blood brother, is a Giant. There are theories that Bragi, Idunna's husband, is a human.We see here from this brief foray that the Gods - both the Aesir and the Vanir, the Giants, and the humans often intermingled, which says to me that race is not an issue, but rather, one's heart is the criteria one should judge."
    --Valeda Njordsdottir, webmaster, AsaWitch


    These people, as well as many others (too may to mention) KNOW the true origins of Heathenism, and KNOW that it has NO relation to race.

    The fact is that the "white power movement" (if you can call it that) includes the "Christian Identity movement" (ha!), therefore making the whole sham the complete antithesis of Pagan/Heathen and Satanic thought. They have tried to crush the underground and anti-Christian spirit of freedom, replacing it with that of fascist oppression, just as the Christian church (the roots of fascism) did to the pagans 1000 years ago. WE WILL NOT LET THAT HAPPEN AGAIN!!
    As you can plainly see, fascists are using the undergound and the occult community and its non-Christian constituants to try and spread the ideas of Christianity even more. Only they've wised up and seen that God doesn't sell to everyone. So now, the racists have perverted yet more belief systems and tried to pose as bearers of the truth. But their lies are indeed transparent, as history will always tell otherwise.


    +---+-+-----+-+--+-----+---+-+-+-+--+-----+--+---+----+---+---+
    Welcome back Defy!.
     
    Agt. Adopus - Rank: 12oz Junior Member - Messages:
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  2. im not witty

    im not witty Guest

    im not witty - Replied Oct 25, 2002

    long..but i read it and it was somewhat interesting. ho hum. end quote.
     
  3. SerialRapisT

    SerialRapisT New Jack

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    SerialRapisT - Replied Oct 25, 2002

    uhhh so are u trying to say your a nazi....

    I'm confused? :confused: :confused: :confused:
     
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  4. Agt. Adopus

    Agt. Adopus 12oz Junior Member

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    Agt. Adopus - Replied Oct 25, 2002

    Uhm, did you read?
     
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  5. seeking

    seeking Dirty Dozen Crew

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    seeking - Replied Oct 25, 2002

    thank god we have nuke here to tell us how to think.

    once i got to the claim that 'black metal' was just 'gaining steam' as grunge was flourishing, i realized the writer had no clue what he/she was talking about, so i didnt care to read the rest of the self indulogent, self agrandizing poppycock.
    literature for the sake of big words is nothing but fancy toilet paper...

    i dont need a pre written statement to give to anyone in defense of anything...
     
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  6. metallix

    metallix 12oz Elite Member

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    metallix - Replied Oct 25, 2002

    i enjoyed reading the rules of satanism, i recall having read them somewhere else.

    The Eleven Satanic Rules of the Earth

    by Anton Szandor LaVey ©1967

    [Spanish, Croation]



    1. Do not give opinions or advice unless you are asked.

    2. Do not tell your troubles to others unless you are sure they want to hear them.

    3. When in another’s lair, show him respect or else do not go there.

    4. If a guest in your lair annoys you, treat him cruelly and without mercy.

    5. Do not make sexual advances unless you are given the mating signal.

    6. Do not take that which does not belong to you unless it is a burden to the other person and he cries out to be relieved.

    7. Acknowledge the power of magic if you have employed it successfully to obtain your desires. If you deny the power of magic after having called upon it with success, you will lose all you have obtained.

    8. Do not complain about anything to which you need not subject yourself.

    9. Do not harm little children.

    10. Do not kill non-human animals unless you are attacked or for your food.

    11. When walking in open territory, bother no one. If someone bothers you, ask him to stop. If he does not stop, destroy him.


    The Nine Satanic Sins

    by Anton Szandor LaVey ©1987



    1. Stupidity—The top of the list for Satanic Sins. The Cardinal Sin of Satanism. It’s too bad that stupidity isn’t painful. Ignorance is one thing, but our society thrives increasingly on stupidity. It depends on people going along with whatever they are told. The media promotes a cultivated stupidity as a posture that is not only acceptable but laudable. Satanists must learn to see through the tricks and cannot afford to be stupid.

    2. Pretentiousness—Empty posturing can be most irritating and isn’t applying the cardinal rules of Lesser Magic. On equal footing with stupidity for what keeps the money in circulation these days. Everyone’s made to feel like a big shot, whether they can come up with the goods or not.

    3. Solipsism—Can be very dangerous for Satanists. Projecting your reactions, responses and sensibilities onto someone who is probably far less attuned than you are. It is the mistake of expecting people to give you the same consideration, courtesy and respect that you naturally give them. They won’t. Instead, Satanists must strive to apply the dictum of “Do unto others as they do unto you.” It’s work for most of us and requires constant vigilance lest you slip into a comfortable illusion of everyone being like you. As has been said, certain utopias would be ideal in a nation of philosophers, but unfortunately (or perhaps fortunately, from a Machiavellian standpoint) we are far from that point.

    4. Self-deceit—It’s in the “Nine Satanic Statements” but deserves to be repeated here. Another cardinal sin. We must not pay homage to any of the sacred cows presented to us, including the roles we are expected to play ourselves. The only time self-deceit should be entered into is when it’s fun, and with awareness. But then, it’s not self-deceit!

    5. Herd Conformity—That’s obvious from a Satanic stance. It’s all right to conform to a person’s wishes, if it ultimately benefits you. But only fools follow along with the herd, letting an impersonal entity dictate to you. The key is to choose a master wisely instead of being enslaved by the whims of the many.

    6. Lack of Perspective—Again, this one can lead to a lot of pain for a Satanist. You must never lose sight of who and what you are, and what a threat you can be, by your very existence. We are making history right now, every day. Always keep the wider historical and social picture in mind. That is an important key to both Lesser and Greater Magic. See the patterns and fit things together as you want the pieces to fall into place. Do not be swayed by herd constraints—know that you are working on another level entirely from the rest of the world.

    7. Forgetfulness of Past Orthodoxies—Be aware that this is one of the keys to brainwashing people into accepting something new and different, when in reality it’s something that was once widely accepted but is now presented in a new package. We are expected to rave about the genius of the creator and forget the original. This makes for a disposable society.

    8. Counterproductive Pride—That first word is important. Pride is great up to the point you begin to throw out the baby with the bathwater. The rule of Satanism is: if it works for you, great. When it stops working for you, when you’ve painted yourself into a corner and the only way out is to say, I’m sorry, I made a mistake, I wish we could compromise somehow, then do it.

    9. Lack of Aesthetics—This is the physical application of the Balance Factor. Aesthetics is important in Lesser Magic and should be cultivated. It is obvious that no one can collect any money off classical standards of beauty and form most of the time so they are discouraged in a consumer society, but an eye for beauty, for balance, is an essential Satanic tool and must be applied for greatest magical effectiveness. It’s not what’s supposed to be pleasing—it’s what is. Aesthetics is a personal thing, reflective of one’s own nature, but there are universally pleasing and harmonious configurations that should not be denied.
     
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  7. suburbian bum

    suburbian bum 12oz Loyalist

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    suburbian bum - Replied Oct 25, 2002

    Yes, Ive been reading about this stuff expecially from burzums site. Burzum has some good points but his racism is extemely ignorant. First of all he sais the arayan angermanic races are the only for that has been able to oppose christianity and groups such as blacks and the Native americans were too "weak" to fight it and lost out. Personally i think that both of these cultures have been just, or more sucessful in keeping their own values and resisting the Christian ideals that were force upon them through violence.




    ---->There is one great problem with humanity that we are ALL guilty of, and that is always justifying to yourself that you are better then someone else for ANY reason. We all do it. Every single one of us. "Im better because I'm, Smarter, I dont do drugs, I'm stronger, I'm harder working, I'm of a better race, My beleif system is better, ETC." Everyone has these thoughts or thoughts like this. This is the basis for all hatred and violence that breeds in the Human race
     
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  8. metallix

    metallix 12oz Elite Member

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    metallix - Replied Oct 25, 2002

    if one is to study the teachings of krishna, one will learn that enlightenment can only come once one does not put oneself above others, but sees oneself as an equal to everyone. not that i actually do this..but im just dropping knowledge for this discussion :)
     
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  9. Agt. Adopus

    Agt. Adopus 12oz Junior Member

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    Agt. Adopus - Replied Oct 25, 2002

    I don't intend to tell anyone how to think. The quiz is from a riot grrl email. I just posted it for the hell of it
    -+-+---+++--+----+++-++-
     
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  10. ~KRYLON2~

    ~KRYLON2~ 12oz Loyalist

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    ~KRYLON2~ - Replied Oct 25, 2002

    can someone summerize this???
     
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  11. serpent of the light

    serpent of the light 12oz Member

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    serpent of the light - Replied Oct 25, 2002

    summAry: satanism does not work w/ racist ideologies.

    whoever wrote that shit was an idiot. black metal was flourishing in the early 90's? hardly. 1984-1988 was the hayday for it, now its coming back, 1994 til now. and there are some really fucking dumb points in that. mere use of corpse paint, spikes, pentagrams etc does not mean the band is jumping on the wagon. thats part of black metal.

    anyways i didn't think that was a very good article, but may 'rip' will read it and understand why the straight edge kid has 666 at the end of his screen name.
     
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  12. Tyler Durden

    Tyler Durden 12oz Veteran Member

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    Tyler Durden - Replied Oct 25, 2002

    jesus fucking christ you people bore me sometimes.........

    wheres the shit about fucking goats and killing babies or something? why the fuck would anyone want to be a fucking goth fuck if you cant kill some farm animal and drink its blood after fucking it in front of some babies, whom you will also kill im sure, but...wow...that shit was just stupid pro-goth propaganda. fuck them and the commie pinko bastards.
     
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