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~Paris Riots~

Discussion in 'News' started by H. Lecter, Nov 3, 2005.

  1. H. Lecter

    H. Lecter Senior Member

    Joined: Sep 15, 2004 Messages: 1,844 Likes Received: 4
    Sick, Crazy, Wild Rioting in the streets of Parisienne Suburbs every day for the the past week...


    English Article

    French Article


    Laying in the middle of this 7 day period is the 51st (truely 50th) anniversarie of the first strike of the Algerien War of Independence (from the French)...

    "La Premiere Matin du Novembre"- is a well remembered occurance and is often used as a symbol of colonial deterioration and a precedent for future revolts of Arabs, particularly in and of European nations..

    Is this coincidence, or co-ordinance?

    Were this two kids who died self-sacracficing martyrs who gave their lives in order to give spark to the fire, simply : excuses to kick-off the violence and uprising that has been brewing for a considerable amount of time in the heads of the muslim population of France...?

    About their deaths,
    are the police or EDF (Electricitie De France, the owner of the power sub-station in which they persihed) to blame?..or are the boys at fault for doing something which would make the police persue them?

    The discontent and static has finally reached a boiling point in France...

    When will it stop?
    What does this signify?
    What do you reckon the results to be?

    Perspectives...



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    The hash spot~

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    As someone who has lived in the region of conflict,
    and someone who has heard and even has been on both sides of this conflict ,
    I must say that this is something that is really serious and really sad..
    The people in the 93 have really declared war in a sense~
    This has been spoken about and labeled as "inevitable" for some time now,
    and it comes as no suprise..

    I honestly don't clearly see a complete end to the sentiment which caused this breaking point..
    and I don't see a complete end to the violence which is now being used to express it..
    I think this problem will grow and grow until serious concessions and/or stern solutions will be made...
    Anti-police riots and the threat of violence will be something that the people will have to live with indefinately... A wave like this is not just going to simply retreat back to the ocean once it has broken...

    I cant help but to draw some comparisons to the civil rights uprisings and riots
    of Black -Americans some 40 years ago..
    Hopefully all this discontent will amount to something as productive as the US uprisings have..
    But honestly, I think most radical Muslims are too narrow-minded and short-sighted for that happen...
    This is and will be more of an issue of religion rather than race,
    and that as well all know, is signifigantly more volatile...

    The revolutionary sense of these riots is admirable,
    as the Muslims in France have not had equal treatment;
    however l'Ile de France is not Algeria and it is not, nor has it ever been Muslim soil..
    so the authenticity and credibility of there actions is to be questioned..
    They can not justly fight for land, when that land is not theirs..
    and They can not violently protest conditions in a place which they chose to flee to for "assylum"....and have all options to leave...

    Many of the people who are most unhappy are people who refuse to integrate into French society at all..
    Actually they are anti-social and full of angst for everything un-Muslim in France..

    On the side of the Muslims who are sensible and enlightened, "normal" people,
    I see this display of discontent as an oppourtunity to take a vocal stand on the issues
    which stir such emotions...
    I think they should hit the streets, call the Media and contact the government with their requests
    for the better treatment of their people..
    I think they should proclaim a non-violent offensive and open peoples minds to the productive and fair nature of most of their people..
    This would draw a line between the Muslims which will be and are integral parts of France,
    and those occupy French soil in their own little nation within a nation and fuel a fire from the ashes of which nothing good can come of... and who in all sensible regaurds, have no business there anyway.
    This will draw sympathy and reconciliation,
    where as violence and hateful, unjustified , seperatist doctrine will just further divide and polarize the people of France...


    Do they really think that they can gain from performing 1954 style uprisings and take over towns??
    Do they really think that they have the right to insite social-instability in France and create a civil war?
    Do they really think that they can accomplish equality by force...?


    The only other acceptable solution is the one that Le Pen has had for the past 20 years..
    Stop immigration, create zero tolerance on immigrant criminals,fish out all of the illegals hiding out , and give an ultimatum of work-or-leave to the welfare collecting leeches who hang around the banlieues all day and sit on their asses, smoking hookha and talking shit about how bad France is...
     
  2. Dawood

    Dawood Elite Member

    Joined: May 8, 2002 Messages: 4,677 Likes Received: 146
    It's unfortunate that some bad apples can spoil the whole bunch.
    I have to admit . I don't know much about this particular conflict at all, So I won't dare speak on it.
    All I can really say is from what I know of conflict in general is that it will get worse before it gets better and the best thing to do when you are unsure is to proceed with caution. Whenever there is fighting and killing going on and it is not clear who is in the right and who is the oppressor. I would never enter into, nor support any unclear uprisings. I'm all for fighting for what you beleive, but when fighting for what you beleive involves oppression and unjust killing, It's time to stop fighting and start evaluating.
     
  3. SF1

    SF1 Elite Member

    Joined: Apr 25, 2003 Messages: 4,866 Likes Received: 5
    Tonight it's a blast!


    ...tommorow you're homeless.


    ...Tonight it's a blaaaasssttt!!!
     
  4. SF1

    SF1 Elite Member

    Joined: Apr 25, 2003 Messages: 4,866 Likes Received: 5
    Why can't our youth be this proactive?
     
  5. !@#$%

    [email protected]#$% Moderator Crew

    Joined: Oct 1, 2002 Messages: 18,517 Likes Received: 621
    because we are a generally comfortable society, even for people living in poverty

    i wonder if some of these people don't get off their asses because they were put there by racist europeans who don't want to hire muslim immigrants, just as racism in the u.s. has kept some cultures from flourishing
    i know there is a 30% unemployment rate in some of those suburbs, and just like violence seen thorughout the middle east, in u.s. inner cities, and in africa, there is a clear link between unemployment and violence
     
  6. Dawood

    Dawood Elite Member

    Joined: May 8, 2002 Messages: 4,677 Likes Received: 146
    that is an absolute true statement, think about it. When in history did a societies poor people ever have an obesity problem except in America?
     
  7. KING BLING

    KING BLING Guest

    Poor people in our country are dumb and ugly - that is why they are poor and often fat, have bad teeth and smoke meth...

    I say we make all the trailer parks and projects in the US fight <the winner gets the welfare checks of the other> than send the winner to Paris to fight the poor there for the European league title belt...A belt which will be made from gold fronts purchased instead of buying formula for your new born...
     
  8. Dawood

    Dawood Elite Member

    Joined: May 8, 2002 Messages: 4,677 Likes Received: 146
    12 oz is full of blanket statements
     
  9. John Birch

    John Birch Member

    Joined: Apr 14, 2004 Messages: 747 Likes Received: 0
    I've been watching and reading about this for a week now on the bbc, which obviusly offers much more insight than biased American media...


    After all the religious civil wars France has had, they take much pride in finally creating a secular state, which is in fact an atheist state. The problem is is that most muslim immigrants have no desire to intergrate into secular atheist French culture because they reject that value system. Thus they can't find jobs or learn french or wear berets and quote satre while eating croissants. And native french, as other euro natives, are totally against the creation of a seperate muslim counterculture in their nation.


    See in America, religious immigrants can integrate easier, as long as you buy into the whole cheetos-ipod-friends re-runs culture, because America is allegedly a religious nation. Love god buhha or allah as long as you shop walmart and drives SUVs. The french no. The main prerquiste to join French culture is to sepak the language and adopt secularism.

    I'd hate to say this, but I think the only real solution is for alot of these people to leave, even the French born ones, or maybe, just maybe a civil war will erupt, and we know who will win that...otherwise they need to assilmilate...
     
  10. KaBar2

    KaBar2 Senior Member

    Joined: Jun 27, 2003 Messages: 2,126 Likes Received: 64
    John Birch, what you are advocating here is essentially the position of the French fascist, Le Pen. I tend to agree with you though. If they do not wish to assimilate into French culture and French society, let them go somewhere where the culture that they prefer predominates.

    I agree with the gentleman quoted in the article, the Muslim immigrants deserve to live in dignity---in Algeria.

    The French thought they were being so noble, so egalitarian, so liberal, when they allowed millions of Muslim Algerians and other North Africans to settle in France.

    Gosh, I bet they're real happy now.

    We Americans are going to have our turn in the barrel soon, in the U.S. border states. Exactly the same situation.
     
  11. John Birch

    John Birch Member

    Joined: Apr 14, 2004 Messages: 747 Likes Received: 0
    I wouldn't say I'm advocating the postion of le Pen at all...I'm not really advocating a postion at all...

    What I'm essentially saying is that France and other Euro nations are exteremly homogenous nations. If a group comes in and doesn't assilmilate its eventually gonna come to a head, which I think will happen in Europe soon...


    America is different. Of course theres still alot of wasps that would prefer a blue eyed blond christian protestant America, but America is a heterogeneous culture, and its written into our constitution. We can have jews and muslims and shakers and Indians and Irishman all living togetrher. They may not like each other, but they still have to deal with each other. Thats my point...
     
  12. KING BLING

    KING BLING Guest

    Maybe no one here remembers any of the riots we have had in the US in the past 40 years...isolated hopeless populations tend to boil over when provoked. I like how the french are stereotyped to the point of obsurdity above - maybe you haven't been to them, but we have our own areas like those in France - and your failure to recognize that shows we have naive and culturcentric people here at home as well...


    1964 - New York City 1964 race riot July 18-23
    1964 - Rochester 1964 race riot July 24-25
    1964 - Jersey City 1964 race riot August 2-4
    1964 - Paterson 1964 race riot August 11-13
    1964 - Elizabeth 1964 race riot August 11-13
    1964 - Chicago (Dixmoor) 1964 race riot August 16-17
    1964 - Philadelphia 1964 race riot August 28-30
    reference for these 1964 events: [1]
    1965 - Watts Riot, (Los Angeles, California, USA)
    1966 - Hunter's Point Riot, (San Francisco, California, USA)
    1967 - 1967 Newark riots, July 1967, (Newark, New Jersey, USA)
    1967 - 1967 Plainfield riots, July 1967, (Plainfield, New Jersey, USA)
    1967 - Cambridge, MD Riot 1967, July 1967, (Cambridge, Maryland, USA)
    1967 - 12th Street Riot (Detroit, Michigan, USA)
    1968 - 1968 Washington, DC riots, April 1968, (Washington, D.C., USA)
    1968 - Baltimore Riot 1968, April 1968, (Baltimore, MD, USA)
    1968 - 1968 Democratic National Convention riot, (Chicago, Illinois, USA)
    1969 - Stonewall Riots, (New York City, New York, USA)
    1969 - York Race Riot, (York, Pennsylvania, USA)
    1971 - May Day Protests 1971, May 1971, (Washington, D.C., USA)
    1971 - Camden Riots, August 1971, (Camden, New Jersey, USA)
    1971 - Attica Prison uprising, (Attica, New York)
    1975 - Livernois-Fenkell riot (Detroit, Michigan)
    1977 - New York City Blackout Riot, July 1977 (New York City, New York, USA)
    1979 - White Night gay riots, (San Francisco, California)
    1980 - New Mexico State Penitentiary Riot, (Santa Fe, New Mexico)
    1980 - Chattanooga Riot of 1980, (Chattanooga, Tennessee, USA)
    1980 - Miami Riot 1980, May 1980, (Miami, Florida, USA)
    1987 - Tampa Riot 1987, Feb. 1987, (Tampa, Florida, USA)
    1989 - Miami Riot 1989, Jan. 1989, (Miami, Florida, USA)
    1989 - Tampa Riot 1989, Feb. 1989, (Tampa, Florida, USA)
    1991 - 1991 Washington, DC riot, Mt. Pleasant riot, May 1991, (Washington, D.C., USA)
    1991 - Crown Heights Riot, Aug. 1991, (Brooklyn, New York, USA)
    1992 - L.A. riot/Rodney King riot, (Los Angeles, California)
    1996 - St. Petersburg, FL Riot 1996, Oct. 1996, (St. Petersburg, Florida, USA)
    1999 - WTO Meeting of 1999, (Seattle, Washington)
    1999 - Michigan State University student riot, April 1999, (East Lansing, Michigan)
     
  13. SF1

    SF1 Elite Member

    Joined: Apr 25, 2003 Messages: 4,866 Likes Received: 5
    DAAAYYAAMMM!!! August of 64 was a wild month! :king:
     
  14. WhiteOx

    WhiteOx Elite Member

    Joined: Sep 4, 2003 Messages: 3,691 Likes Received: 0

    Well I never!!!
     
  15. WhiteOx

    WhiteOx Elite Member

    Joined: Sep 4, 2003 Messages: 3,691 Likes Received: 0
    This shit is nothing big.

    In Sydney there were Redfern Riots last year following the death of an aboriginal kid who was being followed by Police and impaled himself on a fence.

    Earlier this year, The were more Sydney riots in Macquarie Fields following the death of two kids in a stolen car chase.

    These people are poor and unemployed and pissed off and get provoked and ENJOY being provoked into these riots.
     
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