for you guys who like discussing terrorism

http://www.womenswallstreet.com/WWS/articl...1&articleid=711

 

Terror in the Skies, Again?

 

By Annie Jacobsen

 

A WWS Exclusive Article

 

 

Note from the E-ditors: You are about to read an account of what happened during a domestic flight that one of our writers, Annie Jacobsen, took from Detroit to Los Angeles. The WWS Editorial Team debated long and hard about how to handle this information and ultimately we decided it was something that should be shared. What does it have to do with finances? Nothing, and everything. Here is Annie's story.

 

On June 29, 2004, at 12:28 p.m., I flew on Northwest Airlines flight #327 from Detroit to Los Angeles with my husband and our young son. Also on our flight were 14 Middle Eastern men between the ages of approximately 20 and 50 years old. What I experienced during that flight has caused me to question whether the United States of America can realistically uphold the civil liberties of every individual, even non-citizens, and protect its citizens from terrorist threats.

 

On that Tuesday, our journey began uneventfully. Starting out that morning in Providence, Rhode Island, we went through security screening, flew to Detroit, and passed the time waiting for our connecting flight to Los Angeles by shopping at the airport stores and eating lunch at an airport diner. With no second security check required in Detroit we headed to our gate and waited for the pre-boarding announcement. Standing near us, also waiting to pre-board, was a group of six Middle Eastern men. They were carrying blue passports with Arabic writing. Two men wore tracksuits with Arabic writing across the back. Two carried musical instrument cases - thin, flat, 18 long. One wore a yellow T-shirt and held a McDonald's bag. And the sixth man had a bad leg -- he wore an orthopedic shoe and limped. When the pre-boarding announcement was made, we handed our tickets to the Northwest Airlines agent, and walked down the jetway with the group of men directly behind us.

 

My four-year-old son was determined to wheel his carry-on bag himself, so I turned to the men behind me and said, You go ahead, this could be awhile. No, you go ahead, one of the men replied. He smiled pleasantly and extended his arm for me to pass. He was young, maybe late 20's and had a goatee. I thanked him and we boarded the plan.

 

Once on the plane, we took our seats in coach (seats 17A, 17B and 17C). The man with the yellow shirt and the McDonald's bag sat across the aisle from us (in seat 17E). The pleasant man with the goatee sat a few rows back and across the aisle from us (in seat 21E). The rest of the men were seated throughout the plane, and several made their way to the back.

 

 

As we sat waiting for the plane to finish boarding, we noticed another large group of Middle Eastern men boarding. The first man wore a dark suit and sunglasses. He sat in first class in seat 1A, the seat second-closet to the cockpit door. The other seven men walked into the coach cabin. As aware Americans, my husband and I exchanged glances, and then continued to get comfortable. I noticed some of the other passengers paying attention to the situation as well. As boarding continued, we watched as, one by one, most of the Middle Eastern men made eye contact with each other. They continued to look at each other and nod, as if they were all in agreement about something. I could tell that my husband was beginning to feel anxious.

 

The take-off was uneventful. But once we were in the air and the seatbelt sign was turned off, the unusual activity began. The man in the yellow T-shirt got out of his seat and went to the lavatory at the front of coach -- taking his full McDonald's bag with him. When he came out of the lavatory he still had the McDonald's bag, but it was now almost empty. He walked down the aisle to the back of the plane, still holding the bag. When he passed two of the men sitting mid-cabin, he gave a thumbs-up sign. When he returned to his seat, he no longer had the McDonald's bag.

 

Then another man from the group stood up and took something from his carry-on in the overhead bin. It was about a foot long and was rolled in cloth. He headed toward the back of the cabin with the object. Five minutes later, several more of the Middle Eastern men began using the forward lavatory consecutively. In the back, several of the men stood up and used the back lavatory consecutively as well.

 

For the next hour, the men congregated in groups of two and three at the back of the plane for varying periods of time. Meanwhile, in the first class cabin, just a foot or so from the cockpit door, the man with the dark suit - still wearing sunglasses - was also standing. Not one of the flight crew members suggested that any of these men take their seats.

 

Watching all of this, my husband was now beyond anxious. I decided to try to reassure my husband (and maybe myself) by walking to the back bathroom. I knew the goateed-man I had exchanged friendly words with as we boarded the plane was seated only a few rows back, so I thought I would say hello to the man to get some reassurance that everything was fine. As I stood up and turned around, I glanced in his direction and we made eye contact. I threw out my friendliest remember-me-we-had-a-nice-exchange-just-a-short-time-ago smile. The man did not smile back. His face did not move. In fact, the cold, defiant look he gave me sent shivers down my spine.

 

When I returned to my seat I was unable to assure my husband that all was well. My husband immediately walked to the first class section to talk with the flight attendant. I might be overreacting, but I've been watching some really suspicious things... Before he could finish his statement, the flight attendant pulled him into the galley. In a quiet voice she explained that they were all concerned about what was going on. The captain was aware. The flight attendants were passing notes to each other. She said that there were people on board higher up than you and me watching the men. My husband returned to his seat and relayed this information to me. He was feeling slightly better. I was feeling much worse. We were now two hours into a four-in-a-half hour flight.

 

Approximately 10 minutes later, that same flight attendant came by with the drinks cart. She leaned over and quietly told my husband there were federal air marshals sitting all around us. She asked him not to tell anyone and explained that she could be in trouble for giving out that information. She then continued serving drinks.

 

About 20 minutes later the same flight attendant returned. Leaning over and whispering, she asked my husband to write a description of the yellow-shirted man sitting across from us. She explained it would look too suspicious if she wrote the information. She asked my husband to slip the note to her when he was done.

 

After seeing 14 Middle Eastern men board separately (six together, eight individually) and then act as a group, watching their unusual glances, observing their bizarre bathroom activities, watching them congregate in small groups, knowing that the flight attendants and the pilots were seriously concerned, and now knowing that federal air marshals were on board, I was officially terrified.. Before I'm labeled a racial profiler or -- worse yet -- a racist, let me add this. A month ago I traveled to India to research a magazine article I was writing. My husband and I flew on a jumbo jet carrying more than 300 Hindu and Muslim men and women on board. We traveled throughout the country and stayed in a Muslim village 10 miles outside Pakistan. I never once felt fearful. I never once felt unsafe. I never once had the feeling that anyone wanted to hurt me. This time was different.

 

Finally, the captain announced that the plane was cleared for landing. It had been four hours since we left Detroit. The fasten seat belt light came on and I could see downtown Los Angeles. The flight attendants made one final sweep of the cabin and strapped themselves in for landing. I began to relax. Home was in sight.

 

 

Suddenly, seven of the men stood up -- in unison -- and walked to the front and back lavatories. One by one, they went into the two lavatories, each spending about four minutes inside. Right in front of us, two men stood up against the emergency exit door, waiting for the lavatory to become available. The men spoke in Arabic among themselves and to the man in the yellow shirt sitting nearby. One of the men took his camera into the lavatory. Another took his cell phone. Again, no one approached the men. Not one of the flight attendants asked them to sit down. I watched as the man in the yellow shirt, still in his seat, reached inside his shirt and pulled out a small red book. He read a few pages, then put the book back inside his shirt. He pulled the book out again, read a page or two more, and put it back. He continued to do this several more times.

 

I looked around to see if any other passengers were watching. I immediately spotted a distraught couple seated two rows back. The woman was crying into the man's shoulder. He was holding her hand. I heard him say to her, You've got to calm down. Behind them sat the once pleasant-smiling, goatee-wearing man.

 

I grabbed my son, I held my husband's hand and, despite the fact that I am not a particularly religious person, I prayed. The last man came out of the bathroom, and as he passed the man in the yellow shirt he ran his forefinger across his neck and mouthed the word No.

 

The plane landed. My husband and I gathered our bags and quickly, very quickly, walked up the jetway. As we exited the jetway and entered the airport, we saw many, many men in dark suits. A few yards further out into the terminal, LAPD agents ran past us, heading for the gate. I have since learned that the representatives of the Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI), the Los Angeles Police Department (LAPD), the Federal Air Marshals (FAM), and the Transportation Security Association (TSA) met our plane as it landed. Several men -- who I presume were the federal air marshals on board -- hurried off the plane and directed the 14 men over to the side.

 

Knowing what we knew, and seeing what we'd seen, my husband and I decided to talk to the authorities. For several hours my husband and I were interrogated by the FBI. We gave sworn statement after sworn statement. We wrote down every detail of our account. The interrogators seemed especially interested in the McDonald's bag, so we repeated in detail what we knew about the McDonald's bag. A law enforcement official stood near us, holding 14 Syrian passports in his hand. We answered more questions. And finally we went home.

 

 

Home Sweet Home

The next day, I began searching online for news about the incident. There was nothing. I asked a friend who is a local news correspondent if there were any arrests at LAX that day. There weren't. I called Northwest Airlines' customer service. They said write a letter. I wrote a letter, then followed up with a call to their public relations department. They said they were aware of the situation (sorry that happened!) but legally they have 30 days to reply.

 

I shared my story with a few colleagues. One mentioned she'd been on a flight with a group of foreign men who were acting strangely -- they turned out to be diamond traders. Another had heard a story on National Public Radio (NPR) shortly after 9/11 about a group of Arab musicians who were having a hard time traveling on airplanes throughout the U.S. and couldn't get seats together. I took note of these two stories and continued my research. Here are excerpts from an article written by Jason Burke, Chief Reporter, and published in The Observer (a British newspaper based in London) on February 8, 2004:

 

Quote:

Terrorist bid to build bombs in mid-flight: Intelligence reveals dry runs of new threat to blow up airliners

 

Islamic militants have conducted dry runs of a devastating new style of bombing on aircraft flying to Europe, intelligence sources believe.

 

The tactics, which aim to evade aviation security systems by placing only components of explosive devices on passenger jets, allowing militants to assemble them in the air, have been tried out on planes flying between the Middle East, North Africa and Western Europe, security sources say.

 

...The... Transportation Security Administration issued an urgent memo detailing new threats to aviation and warning that terrorists in teams of five might be planning suicide missions to hijack commercial airliners, possibly using common items...such as cameras, modified as weapons.

 

...Components of IEDs [improvised explosive devices]can be smuggled on to an aircraft, concealed in either clothing or personal carry-on items... and assembled on board. In many cases of suspicious passenger activity, incidents have taken place in the aircraft's forward lavatory.

 

 

So here's my question: Since the FBI issued a warning to the airline industry to be wary of groups of five men on a plane who might be trying to build bombs in the bathroom, shouldn't a group of 14 Middle Eastern men be screened before boarding a flight?

 

Apparently not. Due to our rules against discrimination, it can't be done. During the 9/11 hearings last April, 9/11 Commissioner John Lehman stated that ...it was the policy (before 9/11) and I believe remains the policy today to fine airlines if they have more than two young Arab males in secondary questioning because that's discriminatory.

 

So even if Northwest Airlines searched two of the men on board my Northwest flight, they couldn't search the other 12 because they would have already filled a government-imposed quota.

 

I continued my research by reading an article entitled Arab Hijackers Now Eligible For Pre-Boarding from Ann Coulter (www.anncoulter.com):

 

On September 21, as the remains of thousands of Americans lay smoldering at Ground Zero, [secretary of Transportation Norman] Mineta fired off a letter to all U.S. airlines forbidding them from implementing the one security measure that could have prevented 9/11: subjecting Middle Eastern passengers to an added degree of pre-flight scrutiny. He sternly reminded the airlines that it was illegal to discriminate against passengers based on their race, color, national or ethnic origin or religion.

 

Coulter also writes that a few months later, at Mr. Mineta's behest, the Department of Transportation (DOT) filed complaints against United Airlines and American Airlines (who, combined, had lost 8 pilots, 25 flight attendants and 213 passengers on 9/11 - not counting the 19 Arab hijackers). In November 2003, United Airlines settled their case with the DOT for $1.5 million. In March 2004, American Airlines settled their case with the DOT for $1.5 million. The DOT also charged Continental Airlines with discriminating against passengers who appeared to be Arab, Middle Eastern or Muslim. Continental Airlines settled their complaint with the DOT in April of 2004 for $.5 million.

 

From what I witnessed, Northwest Airlines doesn't have to worry about Norman Mineta filing a complaint against them for discriminatory, secondary screening of Arab men. No one checked the passports of the Syrian men. No one inspected the contents of the two instrument cases or the McDonald's bag. And no one checked the limping man's orthopedic shoe. In fact, according to the TSA regulations, passengers wearing an orthopedic shoe won't be asked to take it off. As their site states, Advise the screener if you're wearing orthopedic shoes...screeners should not be asking you to remove your orthopedic shoes at any time during the screening process. (Click here to read the TSA website policy on orthopedic shoes and other medical devices.)

 

placed a call to the TSA and talked to Joe Dove, a Customer Service Supervisor. I told him how we'd eaten with metal utensils moments in an airport diner before boarding the flight and how no one checked our luggage or the instrument cases being carried by the Middle Eastern men. Dove's response was, Restaurants in secured areas -- that's an ongoing problem. We get that complaint often. TSA gets that complaint all the time and they haven't worked that out with the FAA. They're aware of it. You've got a good question. There may not be a reasonable answer at this time, I'm not going to BS you.

 

At the Detroit airport no one checked our IDs. No one checked the folds in my newspaper or the content's of my son's backpack. No one asked us what we'd done during our layover, if we bought anything, or if anyone gave us anything while we were in the airport. We were asked all of these questions (and many others ) three weeks earlier when we'd traveled in Europe -- where passengers with airport layovers are rigorously questioned and screened before boarding any and every flight. In Detroit no one checked who we were or what we carried on board a 757 jet liner bound for American's largest metropolis.

 

Two days after my experience on Northwest Airlines flight #327 came this notice from SBS TV, The World News, July 1, 2004:

 

Quote:

The U.S. Transportation and Security Administration has issued a new directive which demands pilots make a pre-flight announcement banning passengers from congregating in aisles and outside the plane's toilets. The directive also orders flight attendants to check the toilets every two hours for suspicious packages.

 

 

Through a series of events, The Washington Post heard about my story. I talked briefly about my experience with a representative from the newspaper. Within a few hours I received a call from Dave Adams, the Federal Air Marshal Services (FAM) Head of Public Affairs. Adams told me what he knew:

 

There were 14 Syrians on NWA flight #327. They were questioned at length by FAM, the FBI and the TSA upon landing in Los Angeles. The 14 Syrians had been hired as musicians to play at a casino in the desert. Adams said they were scrubbed. None had arrest records (in America, I presume), none showed up on the FBI's no fly list or the FBI's Most Wanted Terrorists List. The men checked out and they were let go. According to Adams, the 14 men traveled on Northwest Airlines flight #327 using one-way tickets. Two days later they were scheduled to fly back on jetBlue from Long Beach, California to New York -- also using one-way tickets.

 

I asked Adams why, based on the FBI's credible information that terrorists may try to assemble bombs on planes, the air marshals or the flight attendants didn't do anything about the bizarre behavior and frequent trips to the lavatory. Our FAM agents have to have an event to arrest somebody. Our agents aren't going to deploy until there is an actual event, Adams explained. He said he could not speak for the policies of Northwest Airlines.

 

So the question is... Do I think these men were musicians? I'll let you decide. But I wonder, if 19 terrorists can learn to fly airplanes into buildings, couldn't 14 terrorists learn to play instruments?

yes... they could make a pretty hip band.

Put the guy with the goatee on bongos and he can be the lead.

 

I picture the band looking somehting like This

i have gotten 'restricted' items on and off more than six flights since 9/11

 

security in airports is still terribly lax.

 

not too mention ports, trains, and soft targets of every variety.

 

it is very difficult to profile a criminal without including their race.

 

problem is, our government doesn't know how to use a fine tooth comb.

instead, they round up thousands of innocent middle easterners, and then get criticized for their gesatapo tactics (which they should)

 

when they detain them, they do it illegally, and often in secret.

 

they need to start being upfront about the threats, and being specific.

they need to get people who fit the profile, not just any random middle easterner.

if fitting the profile is a middle easterner who flies, fine. i get searched all the time, search them too..

I had actually thought about the assembly of bombs on airplanes before but I assumed that chemical sniffers would detect the components. Apparently not. Are they not using chemical sniffers? I don't see why not because even I can afford one.

Air Security has a zillion loopholes

 

I think the government's position on so-called "racial profiling" is a bunch of bullshit. Anybody who presents even the slightest possibility of a threat to a commercial aircraft should be pulled aside and subjected to a rigorous search. If he misses his flight, tough shit. If the security measures are going to prohibit the average passenger from being armed with a knife or pepper spray, or a stun gun, then anybody who gets caught smuggling anything prohibited onto an airplane should go directly to jail.

 

I cannot believe they allowed these fourteen guys to travel together. What the fuck, the militia unit I trained with couldn't even eat together in a restaurant without drawing stares--these guys can get on a cross-country flight to L.A., congregate in the aisles, group up at the bathrooms and all this shit and nobody even said anything? Fuck that.

 

After 9/11, I am reluctant to fly anywhere because of this exact sort of bullshit. The government sticks it's nose into everybody's business, and then they let assholes like this board airplanes in groups of fourteen. Fuck that. If I had been the captain I would have refused to fly them unless they were all strip-searched, and I knew for a fact there were armed Federal air marshals on board. And I would have prohibited them from getting out of their seats except one at a time.

 

If fourteen members of the Ku Klux Klan or fourteen members of the American Nazi Party or fourteen members of any extremist group (Communists, Socialist Worker's Party, whatever) were known to be on an airplane, I would not board it.

 

The one time I've flown since 9/11, I resolved with my wife beforehand, if anybody tries to seize this airplane, we will try to kill them with our bare hands immediately---no waiting. As soon as anybody does anything aggressive, we attack him. I figured we'd bite the sonofabitch to death if necessary. I inventoried all my clothing, trying to identify things I could use as a weapon. I figured there has to be several other men on board with the same idea---probably will be one or two on the far side of any terrorists--we would hit them from both front and back. The air crews should be trained to restrain unruly passengers and supplied with disposable electric-tie handcuffs.

 

I read a story in the paper about a guy who tried to get into the cabin of an airplane and died from the crush of passengers attacking him. RIGHT FUCKING ON. They all should have received a medal for bravery.

 

Under no circumstances should a group of Middle Eastern men of "military" age be permitted to fly together within or to the United States, I don't give a shit WHO they are, fucking diplomats, whatever. This country is so fucked up about "discrimination" and "racial profiling", I can't believe it.

 

I talked to Stretch on the telephone today. We were talking about the increased security around railroads (nation-wide, they are arresting tramps and homeless people anywhere near railroad property.) Between the two of us, we know more than twenty trainhoppers. In all our conversations, travels and hanging out around rail yards none of us has ever seen anybody we thought might be a terrorist, nor have we seen any suspicious "sabotage-like" activity.

Yet the bulls are arresting everybody in sight.

 

And on airplanes, fourteen large Middle Eastern men with suspicious packages and objects board the plane, walk all over the place and congregate in bathrooms.

 

What the fuck.

Originally posted by KaBar2

I read a story in the paper about a guy who tried to get into the cabin of an airplane and died from the crush of passengers attacking him. RIGHT FUCKING ON. They all should have received a medal for bravery.

 

There was way more to the story than that.

If we are talking about the same thing, the

guys had some crazy respitory condition and

he couldnt equalize the pressure in his head/chest

so he freaked out. Anyone would have done the same.

Because he thought he was goign to die, he was

acting rather irrationally and a group of passengers

tackled him and sat on him. He already thought

his lungs were going to explode, and having a group

of adults sit on your torso and head wouldnt help calm you down.

 

yeah... that was a really tragic accident,

no one deserves a medal for that.

Bullshit. His family may say that now, but I'm not fucking buying it. And, even if he DID have a respiratory condition, he has no business going to the cockpit, irrational or not.

 

The other passengers could not possibly have known whatever his condition was, all they knew was that he was acting like a wack job, and trying to get into the cockpit. Fuck him.

he never made it into the cockpit.

he was murdered outside the cockpit door.

 

 

• 
  A Las Vegas man who tried to break into a Southwest Airlines jetliner cockpit during an August flight to Salt Lake City was killed by the passengers who restrained him, not by a heart attack, an autopsy concluded.
   
  However, the U.S. Attorney's office is not filing any criminal charges, saying Jonathan Burton's death was merely an act of self-defense by frightened passengers and there was scant likelihood of winning a conviction against anyone involved.
   
  Janet Burton of Las Vegas, Jonathan's mother, referred all questions to her attorney, Kent Spence of Jackson, Wyo. Spence is the son of famed defense attorney and author Jerry Spence.
   
  "He was strangled, beaten and kicked," Kent Spence said. "We'd like to know how this could have happened to this young man. This kid had no history of violence. He would sooner take a spider outside than kill it."
   
  The family has not decided whether to pursue a lawsuit against Southwest Airlines or the passengers, Spence said.
   
  The Utah medical examiner's autopsy report classified his death a homicide because it resulted from "intentional actions by another individual or individuals."
   
  The report, released by Burton's family, said he was suffocated. He also had contusions and abrasions on his torso, face and neck and suffered other blunt force injuries.
   
  Burton, 19, became combative 20 minutes before Flight 1763 from McCarran International Airport was scheduled to land Aug. 11 at Salt Lake City International Airport, hitting other passengers and pounding on the locked cockpit door. Passengers told investigators that Burton went toward the door and began banging on it as pilots prepared the aircraft for landing, but was calmed down by two passengers and returned to his seat.
   
  Minutes later, the 6-foot, 190-pound Burton charged the door again, and as many as eight of the jetliner's passengers subdued him.
   
  After the plane landed, airport security handcuffed Burton and started to escort him off the Jetway when he collapsed and later died.
   
  Southwest Airlines spokeswoman Linda Rutherford said Saturday that the company considers the U.S. Attorney's office decision fair.
   
  "This was a very stressful situation and we really extend our sympathies to the Burton family, but we really wish he had not done what he did. By taking the violent action that he did on board the plane, he put in danger the lives of 137 passengers and five crew members.
   
  "We believe that the U.S. Attorney's decision not to pursue any charges is a good and correct decision," Rutherford said.
   
  Rutherford wouldn't comment on the appropriateness of passengers handling the outburst. She said the airline's attendants undergo rigorous behavior training upon hire, and each year attendants must undergo additional training.
   
  "You can never predict human behavior, so you can't train for every situation." Rutherford said. The airline has not experienced any other incidents similar to Burton's, she added.
   
  Burton died after being removed from the plane. Authorities initially believed he suffered a heart attack.
   
  The autopsy found low levels of marijuana in Burton's tissues but said that was an "unlikely explanation" for his violent outburst.
   
  Janet Burton said last month that her son had watched a special report on airline crashes the night before the flight. She said he expressed some reservations about flying but seemed to shrug it off upon arriving at the airport.
   
  She said her son, a 1999 graduate of Cheyenne High School and a caregiver at a retirement home, was heading to Salt Lake City to visit his aunt for a few weeks and had made previous trips there without incident.
   
  "He was a good kid and not someone with an explosive temper," Janet Burton said last month. "I really don't know what happened up there."
   
  The outburst occurred as federal officials report a dramatic increase in air-rage incidents nationwide. Statistics from the Federal Aviation Administration showed 292 incidents of unruly passengers last year, more than double the 138 reported in 1995.
   
  The FAA can recommend fines of up to $25,000 against airline passengers who "assault, threaten, intimidate or interfere with a crew member."

 

I cant find any links about his condition anymore.

sounds liek a homicide.

what if that had been kabar's daughter?

 

life has a certain measure of risk to it.

 

the highway is a far, far more dangerous place than a plane.

a lot of drunk drivers get a simple slap on the wrist.

 

priorities are completely out of whack.

 

what is interesting to me, is the complete lack of interest in investigating the motivation behind these terrorist attacks. no one wants to know WHY they wanna kill americans.

ridiculous.

 

there is very little we could do to stop terrorist attacks on soft targets in this country.

mournful visage

Originally posted by Kr430n5_666

mournful visage

http://mk.rated-k.net/movies/mk/mk6.jpg'>

 

dude..... that's the 'get over here' thing right there!!!!

http://img5.photobucket.com/albums/v15/hands/ham.jpg'>

Originally posted by !@#$%

what if that had been kabar's daughter?

 

 

hahahaha

 

 

 

it's no good how this incident was not publicized

That writer is stupid. She says “four in a half hours”…isn’t it supposed to be “four and a half hours”?

 

That’s pretty fucked up about the whole bomb building thing. Airport security needs to tighten up. The whole 14 military aged men on one plane thing…it’s a tough call, in my opinion. Kabar has a point, though. But I’m saying, what if they are just musicians.

 

Oh, Kabar, you say that if you saw 14 KKK members, or Nazis, or what have you, on a plane, you wouldn’t board? Cool, I guess. But what does that have to do with 14 Ay-rabs. Would you board if the Michigan University hockey team was on board? That’s about 25 “military aged” men on board.

 

I say those Air Marshals should have seen what the fuck was going on. To not even investigate the washrooms is ridiculous.

 

Those Middle Eastern men had no business acting so suspicious if they are indeed just musicians. They should go to jail just because they were knowingly freaking out the passengers…if they weren’t doing that, then they were building a bomb.

Originally posted by ARCEL

hahahaha

 

 

 

it's no good how this incident was not publicized

Yeah...Whatever,,

huh....fucked up.

on it goes..until the next attack..

and then....on it goes until the

next one........yay for unholy

alliances with the house of saud.

14 middle eastern musicains doing coke in the bathroom of the plane. i bet they got good shit over there. i can hit a line through a trombone.

Originally posted by freightster

i can hit a line through a trombone.

 

i highly doubt that, unless you have lungs the size of golf bags.

 

http://www.sptimes.com/2002/11/25/photos/flo-trombone.jpg'>

Originally posted by beardo

I continued my research by reading an article entitled Arab Hijackers Now Eligible For Pre-Boarding from Ann Coulter

Bang, there goes all my respect for this writer.

 

Also consider the source, is Women's Wall Street the most reliable source for your hard news?

 

On another level, I don't think hijacking planes is even a viable plan any more. The psychology of it changed. From the first hijackings until 9/11 the motive for hijacking airplanes was to have a large amount of hostages and transportation, so the passengers would just keep their heads down and hope they didn't get knifed to death.

 

On september 11 that changed, people aren't going to take any shit from hijackers now. I don't think anyone who's boarded a plane in the last 3 years hasn't sat down and said to himself "if anyone tries to hijack this bitch I'm going to kill him with my hands. I don't give a fuck, ain't no way in hell I'm letting this plane fly into a building." This is a far cry from "aiight, just don't piss them off and I'll live," and it's why I don't think we're going to see another 9/11.

Originally posted by ARCEL

it's no good how this incident was not publicized

What is there to publicize? "NEWS AT ELEVEN: 15 arab dudes looked sketchy on an airplane today, then were arrested"

 

This is not something i would sit through a commercial for.

http://www.kak.ru/images/archive/15/national/Cigar%2314.jpg'>

!@#$%

 

I agree with you that life has a certain element of risk to it, but it is risk associated with unavoidable circumstances. For instance, in a lightning storm, you run the risk of being hit by lightning. If you are unwilling to accept that level of risk, the don't do outside of your home when it's raining , thundering and lightning and the level of risk will be tremendously reduced.

 

But, when we are talking about flying on a commercial airliner, most of the risk is associated with weather, mechanical failure, etc., not unruly passengers. And definately not FOURTEEN unruly passengers.

 

If the Michigan State hockey team doesn't want to spend their collective youth in a Federal penitentiary, they they had best conduct themselves like gentlemen on board a commercial airliner. When a 110 pound airline attendant asks a 225 pound hockey player who is demanding "more brewskies!" to please have a seat and be quiet, she speaks with a voice of authority backed by the United States Government, and ultimately, the the entire citizenry of the United States.

 

He'd better fucking sit his big ass down, because if he fails to do so, and I'm on his jury, I will GLADLY send him to prison for the maximum sentence.

 

And that goes double for the fourteen Middle Eastern gentlemen.

^^ what a straight up redneck

Faithfull

 

Faithfull, you don't know shit about rednecks, you're from Chicago. Come on down here to Texas, and I can show you some genuine rednecks. You use the word "redneck" the way real rednecks use the word "nigger." It's ignorant and weak. You've got a right to your opinions, but your ability to express them effectively reduces you to ad hominem attacks when you cannot defend your position. What you should have said is:

 

"Michigan State hockey players who get boisterous on an airplane do not constitute a genuine hazard to other passengers any more than the fourteen completely innocent Middle Eastern musicians did. Just because the irrational fears of the American-born passengers led them to fear people who look different and speak a different language led them to incorrectly surmise that the Middle Easterners intended to hi-jack the plane does not mean that the Middle Easterners actually did anything wrong, or that they should even justifiably be questioned or searched. Basically, the Americans were so frightened about dark-skinned, Arab-speaking air travelers that they panicked for very little reason.

 

Your vindictive attitude about the theoretical Michigan State hockey players means that if you have a shred of integrity, you would ask to be excused from their jury, because you could not possibly afford them a fair trial. Right? (Right.) Therefore, somebody else, and not you, would be deliberating upon their theoretical guilt or innocence. But you are correct about the airline attendant, she does have Federal authority once the plane is airborne."

 

And NO, I'm not a redneck. So "Suck on this." (LOL.)

nekro has some good points, and made me laugh too..

as does WEAPON X.. he seems pretty on it about the whole situation.